Why make things so difficult?

[_Jeff_Swayze_]

Adobe, there are several GREAT forum packages out there that are well-established, well-supported, highly-configurable and well-liked by the community. Why re-invent the wheel creating new forum software? Use your resources to customize an existing package and moderate the forums. Take all the money you'll save and add headcount to the Lightroom team! (OK, I'm biased...)

[Guest]

Er... that's what they've done, Jeff. The forum package comes from the Jive software house and is well known.

[Cindy-]

> Adobe, there are several GREAT forum packages out there that are well-established

Why don't you recommend which ones?

[Guest]

And ensure your suggested software meets Adobe's criteria for an enterprise-scale package. Not as easy as people think.

[Cindy-]

> And ensure your suggested software meets Adobe's criteria for an enterprise-scale package

And just what exactly is an enterprise-scale package?

[Dirck]

Big as a starship?

[Guest]

hmm... how about... webcrossing? XD

(shutting up, suh! thank you suh! may i have anothuh?)

[Cindy-]

> Big as a starship?

Apparently not! The new one that is. :(

[Guest]

smaller than a bread box?

[Cindy-]

> hmm... how about... webcrossing?

Hey! That's a good idea Dave. How 'bout webcrossing?

[Guest]

well, i know it scales... and erm... wait. wait! what are those black helicopters with the big red A on the side landing in my yard. no! no! get back! ge.....<Sssszzzzzt><cccrrrackkklle> ....[NO CARRIER]

[John T Smith]

Somewhere (I don't have the link) someone (I think it was JC) posted that there are 600k forum members, with (I think) 400k messages last year

That is a pretty large "ship" in my book

[Guest]

In the new forums, get up the display of all the forums there are. Frightening. This is no small thing. Also, there will a raft of consideration about the long term viability of the software and the company that produces it, quality of support and documentation, adherence to relevant standards, etc etc - all stuff which is the hidden part of the iceberg from we mere mortals who think this is an easy choice to make.

I get the impression that when you investigate possible contenders in depth, you come down to remarkably few choices.

[Cindy-]

I would think that Adobe could muster up the talent to make their own forum.

[Dirck]

Can you imagine the task if you were to develop a bitmap editing program or an advanced web authoring application? My knees would buckle at the assignment. I doubt it can be done.

[Guest]

> I would think that Adobe could muster up the talent to make their own forum.

I think their present staff are pretty fully occupied ( and they are downsizing).

[Cindy-]

> I think their present staff are pretty fully occupied (and they are downsizing).

What ever

[Guest]

>there will a raft of consideration about the long term viability of the software and the company that produces it<br /><br />adobe? c'mon they're better than that! <kidding><br /><br />> I would think that Adobe could muster up the talent to make their own forum. <br /><br />please no, adobe. stick to what you do best!!!

[Curt Wrigley]

> I would think that Adobe could muster up the talent to make their own forum.

Thats exactly what they should Not do. Adobe is getting leaner and needs to focus on its core competencies; none of which include writing forum sw.

The path they are taking is perfectly logical. As much as forum regulars (including myself) like to think that forum activity is critical to the sw sucess; Its not.

The forum does not have to be perfect. It doesnt even need to be close to perfect. Its needs to make sense financially, be easy to maintain, reasonably usable (which jive is) and viable for the future.

[_Jeff_Swayze_]

Hmmm... OK, mea culpa that I didn't know it was OTS software (never heard of Jive before tonight), but let me clarify my point. Looking at the new interface, I see inefficiency. Tall rows for message title/icon/etc, pretty colored icons to choose a forum, non-scalable width, wide column for "Top Participants" and such.

The software I had in mind was vBulletin. I see that used on many of the forums I frequent and it seems to be very efficient and easy to use.

If Adobe has to limit the window width and still display additional information, Apple's Discussions pages seem to do that pretty well. I don't know if they are using proprietary software or not (I'm guessing yes) but that seems like an efficient use of the space available.

I'd love to see the forums concentrate on legible text, a logical hierarchy of forums/folders, and easy robust editing (like the ability to include in-line images and attaching files). I don't need fancy graphics and other bandwidth-hogging elements. Heck, look at Craigslist. Low bandwidth, very efficient, easy to use.

I'm not suggesting that any one of these is the best for Adobe, just that there are more efficient forums out there. I don't know much about Jive, but looking at the examples on their web page, they seem to concentrate on a pretty fluffy UI. However if configured appropriately they can do a pretty good job. Take a look at the SAP site that uses their software: https://cw.sdn.sap.com/index.jspa

RE: Adobe designing their own software... NOOOOOO! They need to put their resources where they do their best work.

[Cindy-]

The vBulletin site was very fast but the sap.com site was equally as slow. Craigslist is probably too boring for most. I wouldn't mind vBulletin but I have yet to really go into it. I have been to other forums like it and I like them.

[Guest]

You're mentioning popular names - Adobe will have crossed them off the list for one (presumably) good reason or another.

Look at the number of forums and subforums involved. They need to be integrated at the top for searching. Any sites you can think of that run that number of forums and with the kind of usage figures that we have here? Then look at the companies operating them - are they the kind of blue chip company which tends to take the view that "I'll buy anything as long as it says IBM on the box"? (OK, I'm harking back many years, but you get my drift).

For further background read - or re-read - http://www.adobeforums.com/webx/.59b7e47b/13

[John_Cornicello_Photo]

Apple uses an older version of Jive Forums that I believe has been discontinued. Apple Japan is in the process of moving from Web Crossing to Jive Clearspace (as we are).

John