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10 replies

Participant
November 19, 2017

Adobe probably pissed a lot of people by taking it out, including me.
Others could stop pointing it's being wrong. It's still working. Good practice or bad practice, who cares? A example. On Apple devices <embed> doesn't scroll content, while <iframe> scrolls (example - Baltic-stream ). Had to redo the code on a lot of pages just to make it work for Apple devices. Should we now dump the <embed> tag? According to some of the logic laid out here, we should. Apple doesn't allow Flash animations? Should we now dump Animate ? Of course.

Since the "market" exists and it works, you could have left it, Adobe.

There are workarounds on playing with the code in DW CC by adding an element manually
position: absolute;

BenPleysier
Community Expert
Community Expert
November 19, 2017

People in the know are more than pleased that AP-divs have been removed form DW. They were a source of many layout problems.

Taking your page as an example, the following

1. when I make the viewport narrower, the content does not respond, leaving scrollbars to view the content

2. talking scrollbars, have a look at

3. According to rational logic, documents should be correctly coded, not like [Invalid] Markup Validation of http://baltikstream.com/catalogue_engine_NVD_48_A2U.php - W3C Markup Validator.

4. We should not dump Animate, just the flash files that it produces.

There is much more to be said, but I am afraid it is falling on deaf ears.

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Legend
November 19, 2017

Zoom the page, it gets progressively worse.

Participant
May 21, 2016

I'm studying graphic design, and I have an assignment on Dreamweaver CC, and one part of the assignment that counts largely is being able to do the AP DIVS.... how must I now do the AP divs if it doesn't exist anymore............

Participant
May 21, 2016

You can still download CS6.

My best,

Justin

beexraye
Participant
November 7, 2015

This is annoying. My professor is using CS5 or 6 and I'm using CC. How can I get the same result? I already got " you need to get the version we're using" when I asked for help

Nancy OShea
Community Expert
Community Expert
November 7, 2015
  1. Log-in to your Creative Cloud Desktop App.
  2. Click on Apps > ALL APPS.
  3. Scroll down to the bottom and click on PREVIOUS VERSIONS.
  4. You should see CS6 offered in the DW list. 

NOTE: This only works for paying subscribers.  It won't work for 30-Day Trial accounts.

Nancy O.

Nancy O'Shea— Product User & Community Expert
Participant
June 1, 2015

I have a base structure do use APDIVs and they all follow every monitor size. I have made more than 8 websites with them.

BenPleysier
Community Expert
Community Expert
June 1, 2015

Please supply the URL of one of those 8 websites. I love to learn.

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Participating Frequently
February 25, 2014

Thanks for the information about whether or not AP divs are in CC.

That being said, I am disappointed in a way.  Right now, I am taking a class at ABC Adult School using CS6 and I have just learned how to draw and work with AP divs.  I had hoped to use it in a personal project here at home, but could not find any way to make the divs.

Now that I know that it's not there, I feel sort of cheated because that's knowledge I can't use.  And I certainly don't know how to create a similar effect in CC without AP divs.  I would appreciate any help; until then, I'll just carry on.

Participating Frequently
February 25, 2014

BW -

You can use AP Divs with CC just specify you're positioning through your CSS.

Best advice is to avoid this forum altogether, unless you relish the idea of constantly being told by Ben & Nancy that their is no place at all for AP Divs, that this is a FACT, that design is a strict and undebatable medium with stringent rules that they are the gatekeepers of, that you cannot wear white after Labor Day, that going out into the rain with no coat on will kill you and other such 'Facts.'

Find a forum where there is open discussion so you don't get hammered over the head by these stubborn coding geriatrics.

I wish you the best.

Jon Fritz
Community Expert
Community Expert
February 25, 2014

Strange mini rant aside.

You can create APDivs in CC, the process is a bit more complicated than the old "click the APDiv button" method since absolute positioning has fallen out of favor for more flexible methods of laying out websites.

1. In DW, click Insert > Div

2. In the Dialogue that pops up, click New CSS Rule

3. In the new dialogue, select ID from the drop down and give the div a Name (unique to this div only)

4. Choose where you want the css written from the bottom drop down and click OK

5. In the new dialogue, choose Positioning and under Position choose Absolute

6. Hit OK, twice

You will now be able to click on the new div in Design View and resize or move as you see fit.

Participant
August 14, 2013

I hate to re-open this debate as it seems to be polarising the percieved differences between coders and designers but I am in search of a long term or at least future proof solution...

Like a lot of graphic designers I work in print design as well as for screen. In my 25+ years in this business I have only be able to work 'visually' i.e. with things that I can see in front of me. I use AP Divs because I can actually design a layout according to the principles of graphic design (typography, hierarchy, colour, composition and imagery) I am however aware that there is a problem with them.

I have tried several times to learn and use 'normal' divs but frankly the process reminds me of trying to program my ZX Spectrum in hex code in the 1980's...

Does anyone think there may be a way in which we designers might be able to keep using dreamweaver without all this coding? Could Adobe make a DIV which keeps everyone happy?

(Oh and please don't suggest Muse, it's like using MySpace...)

Nancy OShea
Community Expert
Community Expert
August 14, 2013

I also worked in print before making the leap (and it was a mind bending leap) to web design.  I had to set-aside almost everything I learned about print and learn to think like a responsible web designer.  It's a totally different discipline.  And it's constantly changing with the steady emergence of new technologies.   

The holy grail you're seeking has almost nothing to do with Adobe or Dreamweaver and everything to do with evolving web standards and how various browsers  interpret them. 

Unfortunately, no 2 browsers or even 2 versions of the same browser do everything exactly the same way.  And then we have individual preferences to cope with which can destroy an otherwise perfect layout.   Print designers never have to deal with these challenges because printed media is static.

I don't like Muse either.  There are several layout frameworks & tools you can use to jump start your web projects in Dreamweaver.  Professional results.  No APDivs required.

Foundation Zurb

http://foundation.zurb.com/templates.php

Skeleton Boilerplate

http://www.getskeleton.com/

Initializr (HTML5 Boilerplate, Responsive or Bootstrap)

http://www.initializr.com/

DMX Zone's Bootstrap extension for DW

http://www.dmxzone.com/go/21759/dmxzone-bootstrap/

Project Seven's Page Packs (CSS Templates)

http://www.projectseven.com/products/templates/index.htm

Nancy O.

Nancy O'Shea— Product User & Community Expert
KaNe_NodAuthor
Participant
July 4, 2013

thanks for all

first think guys im not a web developer iam a graphic designer
i do my design in illustrator or some times photoshop and flash and then go to dreamweaver

to make my points to the programers in my company and make them understand my design i draw the website in dreamweaver with the APDivs

so i don't care if it's the not best selution or not effective or not powerful or old or any word you said

i just don't care

and i don't want to use the old dreamweaver it's disgusting that i update all my adobe programs and get used to the new designs and stick with dreamweaver cs6 it's just a stupid

and why they remove it anyway. they didn't remove the (red eye removal tool) from the photoshop .it never work's but you can't judge who and how they use it ??


and i know there is so many graphic designer work in the web design like me and do the samethings that i do

because it's the best tool for us

thanks for all

BenPleysier
Community Expert
Community Expert
July 4, 2013

Why not draw the website in PS and pass that on to the developers?

Having said that, many designers do learn basic markup and CSS and are quite happy to not have to revert to AP's

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KaNe_NodAuthor
Participant
July 4, 2013

i have to give them the html folder with separated jpg's and png's files because most of them don't know how to work with photoshop or illustrator

and if i didn't give them that they just start to ask millions of questions (where i should put that photo? is that for the button? where is mouse over button?) and it waste my time

and trust me as a graphic designer you just can't give your vision to some one by talking or sketch they need every detail

i learned the beasics of html and css and i can do the design with 2-4 hours but with APDivs at max 30 minute

thanks

Participant
June 28, 2013

I think the removal of DRAW AP DIV is going to be met with mixed emotions - probably more on the angry and upset side. Dreamweaver, for years, has appealed to the visual designer as well as the more code-oriented one. People use it at different levels and the nice thing about the DRAW aspect was that it allowed a person to quickly "layout" a site or page and then make adjustments to it to comply properly with code/best practices. With the layout feature gone, the product feels less about creativity and design and more about the professional. I can see both sides of the arguement, though.

This is a classic example of a product being developed with one customer group considered and not the whole.

I know several hundred students that got their first exposure to website design/layout by using the DRAW AP Div tool, plus from an accessability standpoint, now we have a challenge.

I think it should just be an option that can be hidden. It is really weird to see it go and sad that all user groups are not being considered. Yes, we need to move ahead but you need to inform and educate the customer as to why - not just rip it out.

I think the lack this feature alone will keep many in DW CS6 as the creative aspect and the intuative approach is gone.

My .02.

guptabhawna05
Adobe Employee
Adobe Employee
June 27, 2013

Please refer this link for more details.

AP Divs will throw all content over the page as browser sizes shift.

They may look good in dreamweaver or your own browser, but other browsers with different window sizes will "reposition" those divs and possibly make everything unaligned.

Jon Fritz
Community Expert
Community Expert
June 27, 2013

If you really want to see APDivs explode your design, go into Firefox and choose View > Zoom > Zoom Text Only then play around with Ctrl + and Ctrl -.

Since you can't control what your viewer uses as their default font size, you can't control your designs when you use APDivs.

Thankfully Adobe saw fit to remove them from DW. Up until recently, I would suspect about 10-15% of the problems brought to the forum were Absolute Positioning related in some manner.

Nancy OShea
Community Expert
Community Expert
June 28, 2013

Thankfully Adobe saw fit to remove them from DW.

Yes.  Good riddance to APDiv Layers.  It's a shame we waited this long.  Should have been removed 4 versions ago.

Nancy O.

Nancy O'Shea— Product User & Community Expert
C_F_McBlob
Inspiring
June 27, 2013

You should NOT under any circumstances, be designing a website with APDivs.

That said, those panels are gone in CC, because they were used for design techniques long abandoned by professional web designers.

KaNe_NodAuthor
Participant
June 27, 2013

come on man it's work fine for me and i been useing apdivs since it appear and you can creative web site's with it

BenPleysier
Community Expert
Community Expert
June 27, 2013

KaNe_Nod wrote:

come on man it's work fine for me and i been useing apdivs since it appear and you can creative web site's with it

You are one within a select group that can produce a web site using absolute positioning. I used to belong to your group many (about 10) years ago until monitor sizes changed from a standard 800x600.

With the myriad of current screen sizes, it is impossible to use AP's for layouts.

If you want to persist with old technology, you should continue using older versions of DW

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