Legend

Question

OT: When is a client no longer a client?

Forum|Forum|3 years ago
May 11, 2022
3 replies
1007 views

I'm rapidly approaching the end of my tenature as a web-developer but I still have several clients, managing their websites, updates mainly, a few times a year. However I also have several 'dormant' websites where not much gets updated from year to year. These particaulary clients are becoming a PITA (although I have known most of them for 10 or more years). When they do contact me they talk as if they are spending 1000's of pounds with me, are pretty arrogant, rather insulting and annoying.

At what point is the financial return considered to be so small that it's ok to politely wave them goodbye? I dont really want to upset them but they are really at a point where I consider they are of no use to me any longer. I wont be re-designing their websites in the future as I have no desire to do so.

Does anyone have a minimum financial limit they set per client per year before it becomes a case of 'on ya bike' this is just not worth the bother?

This topic has been closed for replies.

Liam Dilley

Inspiring

Smaller clients tend to be the less profitable (Obvisly).

- They tend to be the ones who do not want to pay for things they want on the site or want to pay less for what the feature/functionality is and should be worth

- They are the ones who want more support and also not pay for that support

- They tend to be the ones less tech savvy and create more problems/issues and break things due to that lack of understanding yet want to be "do it myself" and not look to have you/your company do things for them or pay someone else to do it.

- With that lack of understanding they do not understand why something may take x amount of time and money to build or create and argue that

- They are less happy, want more for less all the time.

While these are not nice things to think about they are 100% the case.
20 small cients vs 2 big ones (which in this example has more work load) your better off with the two bigger clients.
Bigger clients have bigger budgets for sure but while there are other challenges (Things like more meetings than you should have, more roadblocks or more hoops to jump through sometimes, multiple people you got to deal with on any given project..) they tend to be less hassle overall, easier to support and have a better understanding of what they want and what it takes to get there.

You also need to know enough is enough, Even if your friendly they are friendly and really nice and you have supported them for 4 years. If they are costing you money or taking up your resources with 2 developers on things because they are cosntantly calling, breaking things or wanting things (and not want to pay for it) you need to know when to sack those clients (If you can).

As with big companies, even if your a smaller business or even a freelancer you need to consider resources to the same or greater extent the finacial side.

If a client is paying your hourly rate or you have a monthly plan with them of x hours and your on that.. If your team or yourself is spending good portions of time on that one client and could have done 3/4... other clients work in that time then this is another key consideration. If 1 client takes your time and you could loose or have 5 clients not happy with work delays due to resources being limited - Then you also need to consider having that client. If those other clients are bigger you need to continue to impress to get bigger jobs and work and good word from that company and the companies they work with.
If Jane and John's lock smithing business is paying you for everything but taking 40 hours a month of your teams time and 3-4 staff members across different departments who could have done 4 other clients jobs in that time whom may be bigger - You got to consider letting Jane and John go.

O

osgood_Author

Legend

Bigger clients have bigger budgets for sure but while there are other challenges (Things like more meetings than you should have, more roadblocks or more hoops to jump through sometimes, multiple people you got to deal with on any given project..) they tend to be less hassle overall, easier to support and have a better understanding of what they want and what it takes to get there.

By @Liam Dilley

Absolutely correct. I've worked for a few large clients, some worldwide and the process, while sometimes pain staking, given the departments involved, the process is much more professional and usually more financially rewarding. They employee profesionally trained/experienced employees which helps the workflow process. They have realistic budgets.

I've also worked for the small to medium sized companies who are family based (alert!, alert!), most of which have no members of staff that have any experience in public relations/marketing. These companies can be frustrating to work for because generally they have no concept of what they really want, do not supply the information which helps get the job done, have limited budgets and almost never respect the skills and knowledge which you have.

B i r n o u

Legend

by reading these last exchanges, I have the impression to have passed in the twilights zone... certainly they are obvious and have no age... and which fully reflect the market of the great consumption, but certainly not the real life.

the question is not, and cannot be, about the size of the customers, but about the size of the companies.

today, the size of the companies defines everything... the thirty glorious years of the web are over... we must put our feet on the ground.

let's take out the niche markets, let's take out the ancestral markets that have united links... let's take the market as it is today.

there are a lot of free platforms, or inexpensive premium accounts... look at the templates... today a very good responsive template, with online support and all that is needed to secure its sustainability, costs between 60 and 100 dollars... complete platforms are almost free access... going premium costs almost nothing... institutional platforms give access to application sites, my city hall dot com, my company dot fr, my services for you dot info... in short, the market is large, open and competitive for all the small companies...

what is left for these small companies... uh... big customers...???... you're kidding... if you are not a big company, it's hard to get credibility, and to be able to respond to markets that are too big to be followed by small ones... and to have mono-clientism, it's too risky... especially in these days.... so for small companies there are only... small customers left... 🙂

to make a small company grow... that's another business, and the problem is that today, we are not yesterday, and there are many, many people on the market.

It's been a few years since we entered the small grocery store era, when the big distribution relocated the shopping malls in busy cities, and took over the mass food market.

BenPleysier

Community Expert

I have my client's webistess hosted on a server that I have leased. I also am the registrar of their domain names. I charge my clients $AU250 per year to manage their sites, mail boxes, DNS settings and SSL. Their .au domain name registration is charged at $27.50 a year, something that would pay $33 per year elsewhere. That way they think that they are getting a bargain.

3x $250 paying customers cover my cost of hosting, the rest is pure profit. Small changes taking less than 5-10 minutes are free of charge.

If they want, they can have their own Plesk panel with no extra charge.

Wappler is the DMXzone-made Dreamweaver replacement and includes the best of their powerful extensions, as well as much more!

O

osgood_Author

Legend

I have my client's webistess hosted on a server that I have leased. I also am the registrar of their domain names. I charge my clients $AU250 per year to manage their sites, mail boxes, DNS settings and SSL. Their .au domain name registration is charged at $27.50 a year, something that would pay $33 per year elsewhere. That way they think that they are getting a bargain.

3x $250 paying customers cover my cost of hosting, the rest is pure profit. Small changes taking less than 5-10 minutes are free of charge.

If they want, they can have their own Plesk panel with no extra charge.

By @BenPleysier

It's a plan and if it works for you then that's great but lm not that interested in making a few bucks a year as l move towards wrapping up my career and after.

I've reached a point where l personally don't see this as a viable thing going forward, apart from filling my time. After 47 years do l really want to keep smacking my head against the wall. You know how draining it can be these days keeping up to date with all the new workflows, the constant debates of which is right or wrong or neither and if you don't participate and make it your business to at least investigate, youre really just history and of little importance.

B i r n o u

Legend

The question of the economic model is in my opinion a concept specific to each activity... in any case, any service requires a corresponding charge.

Whether a project is dormant or not, and whether it costs you in terms of hosting, this charge must be valued at the one who consumes it.

The idea then is not to generate a surplus value, but to find a balance on the table of income / expenses.

Having a minimum billing delta can quickly fall into a concept that drives consumption.
Like Ben we offer shared services that allow everyone to gain an unbeatable price/quality ratio. No one is forced to consume more than they need, while keeping the most efficient service slider they can.

As you say OS, it may be easier to pass on your files to potential buyers, and free you from charges that pose more questions than they bring you solutions.

Nancy OShea

Community Expert

I don't know what your financial arrangement is. IMO you don't have to take ANY projects you don't want to take. This goes for everyone regardless of age. It's your prerogative to take their calls or not. It's different when you're starting out and trying to grow your business through word of mouth but that changes over time.

If you want to go the extra distance, you could send them a nice letter explaining that your priorities have changed and you're not able to service them anymore. If you're really nice, you could refer them to another service or colleague they can contact. But that's up to you. That's why we are freelancers.

Nancy O'Shea— Product User & Community Expert

O

osgood_Author

Legend

I don't know what your financial arrangement is. IMO you don't have to take ANY projects you don't want to take. This goes for everyone regardless of age. It's your prerogative to take their calls or not. It's different when you're starting out and trying to grow your business through word of mouth but that changes over time.

If you want to go the extra distance, you could send them a nice letter explaining that your priorities have changed and you're not able to service them anymore. If you're really nice, you could refer them to another service or colleague they can contact. But that's up to you. That's why we are freelancers.

By @Nancy OShea

Yes of course you are correct. I was just trying to get a feel how others run their business financially. I have a policy of if I wasn't making 1k+ a year out of each client then it wasnt worth my time. The majority of the 'dormant' websites I mention don't get any where near that so I'm asking myself why keep them going just for the benefit of the client and not myself. I'm just being nice! Of course until recently there was the prospect of greater returns should the websites need re-designing but that's no longer applicable as I've decided not to go down that route.

I've never really recommended other developers simply because if they dont deliver then it looks bad on me and I like to keep my good reputation intact.

Nancy OShea

Community Expert

Do you provide hosting & SSL certs as part of your service? I don't. Who handles the domain names? My clients are responsible for their own domain names. At project completion, there are no strings attached on either side. If they need upgrades later and I'm available, I'll happily do it but they need to pay me. My hourly rates are not cheap.

Unless clients have a thriving business attached to their site, most of them lose interest after 1-3 years. The web is full of idle websites that just take up space. Perhaps that's why SSL certs have to be renewed annually even when they are paid up 2-5 years ahead.

Nancy O'Shea— Product User & Community Expert

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