From Apple and Extensis: Font management under Mac OS X

That said, update to the current version of Suitcase -- it's far better than Apple's fairly remedial FontBook. It allows for sorting out duplicate fonts and damaged fonts as well as auto activation of fonts as they are needed. Check the Extensis.com page: http://www.extensis.com/en/products/product_family.jsp?locale=en_US&id=1054

Neil

> Every time I opened Suitcase to work on that project, it would activate the fonts kept in the brochure folder. This way I was not "stealing" the font by installing it on my computer, just borrowing it to use in the piece it came with. Have I understood this correctly?

Aandi beat me to it. He is right. And I'm not a lawyer either, but...

Fonts are licensed software, just as QuarkXPress or Photoshop are. Technically, "borrowing" fonts as you described is stealing the font. You need to have the license to use fonts on your machine. Some foundries (but NOT Adobe) allow for fonts to temporarily be used by service bureaus and prepress houses for output or plating only. Other fonts may have licenses that allow for "x" number of computers to use the fonts simultaneously (Adobe does), but only as long as they are connected to the same printer. Other foundries may have other more stringent or less stringent licenses. There is no industry-wide "standard" for font installation and usage.

Yes, it's complicated and not easy to sort out. Consider doing an organization's magazine with advertising. Unless the ads are provided with fonts converted to outlines or as PDFs with embedded fonts (and even with PDFs there can be licensing restrictions), you've got a nightmare on your hands sorting through the licensing from the various foundries, if you are to remain completely legal.

Neil

Aach! I thought I was at an Apple forum site. I'm at Adobe's site! I'm sure there are others much more knowledgeable here, that I. But, I think what I said is correct.

>>In the old days I used to easily be able to see if I had a printer font for each screen font, but no more.

That is true. You can no longer open a Font Suitcase. ( Me thinks Apple should change this. ) You can, however, start up from OS 9 and then you can still open your font Suitcases and make sure that you have one screen font for every printer font for your Type 1 fonts.

>>> some fonts don't show any printer fonts outside the suitcase at all

Those might be TrueType fonts. Apple also supports Open Type fonts and PC fonts. The open type fonts appeared one file at time, that is say that there is one file for bold, one file for regular, one file for italic, etc.. Fortunately, Font Book recognizes that these or all of the same type family and will organize and under one heading for you.

>>I'm trying to understand the difference between using OS9 and Suitcase and OSX and FontBook.

You know, there is an update for Suitcase which works under OS 10. I'm using Font Book though because it is free. Actually, that is not entirely true. I bought a copy of Suitcase and abandoned when Apple came out with Font Book.

>>>I get page layout files from outside my company that I work on or revise, and they come with their own fonts.

Aagh! I hate working on other people's files. BTW, if you ever change to Adobe InDesign, Adobe uses a special font folder which generally takes precedence over fonts in other locations, making your situation easier. Sorry, I got ahead of myself...let me re-read your question...

>>> Every time I opened Suitcase to work on that project, it would activate the fonts kept in the brochure folder.

Suitcase makes the System think the font is installed, or something like that, yes.

>>> they have to be installed on my computer. I can't do what I did with Suitcase, right?

Suitcase virtually installs the font. But it sort of does that remotely, without the font having to be in a specific location.

>>>But I could install the borrowed fonts on my computer, put them in a collection in Font Book

In order to keep your fonts and your "borrowed" fonts separate, you might want to place the borrowed fonts folder in one of your font folders manually, say, your home/Library/Fonts folder. That way you would know they are not yours and you can dump them later. If you double click on a font suitcase and say Install, so that Font Book installs the font, Font Book will mix the fonts up with your other fonts. That is what a Microsoft program did and I was so angry at the company.

Now, I don't know how QuarkXPress decides which font to use. I believe that Adobe does not use the same convention that Apple uses. Apple says that the fonts in your home directory are used first, then the fonts in a Library/Fonts, and the fonts in System/Library/Fonts, and finally the fonts in your old System Folder. But, Adobe chose to ignore the convention. I believe he uses fonts found in Library/Application Support/Adobe/Fonts first. Then it uses the other folders. But, still, if it finds to duplicate fonts it will compare the fonts and use the one with more characters thinking that he wanted more characters are newer fonts. That drives me crazy, sometimes. Apple has a Gil and I have a Gil and sometimes the Adobe programs will only see one so I often have to uninstall the Apple font for the Adobe program to see mine. It is slowly getting worked out, though, I think. (Anybody from Adobe reading this is sure to correct my errors.)

Assuming that core is the Apple convention of guess that you could dump a folder full of fonts in your home fonts folder. Oh! Did I say? Apple fonts folders will read fonts inside of folders. Also, if you ever switch to InDesign, the Adobe fonts folder will read aliases of fonts; so, you can stick an alias of the fonts for your job inside the Adobe fonts folder. I don't believe Apple font folders will read aliases, still.

I was getting corrupted font error messages erratically from various files. However, using this managing fonts guide, I am reorganizing my fonts and already one font that looked corrupted on the screen has righted itself. So I think it is like the conflict you described above and it will look better when I get it sorted out. It is very confusing telling which Type 1 suitcases might be missing printer fonts because sometimes they are with the suitcase and some fonts don't show any printer fonts outside the suitcase at all, but are working fine. In the old days I used to easily be able to see if I had a printer font for each screen font, but no more.

I'm trying to understand the difference between using OS9 and Suitcase and OSX and Fontbook. Could you backtrack a bit and check my questions that appears before the one where I asked about corrupted fonts?

Thank you so much. You have no idea how hard it is to get real help with font problems.

Sorry. Don't know the answer to that...Don't know if it checks. I know the system gets messed up and Apple programs will not launch if, say, there are 2 Palatino Suitcases containing Type 1 Screen Fonts and only one Type One printer font available...but, that is not a font corruption problem. Are you having problems?

What means does OSX use to indicate when a font is corrupt?

Okay, that sounds good, I want to keep it as simple as possible. Now:

I get page layout files from outside my company that I work on or revise, and they come with their own fonts.
When I used to use Ext. Suitcase (which I always had problems with) this is how I thought it worked;
I would have a brochure folder on my desktop with the fonts folder in it.
I would open Suitcase, make a folder for the brochure and add the fonts to it, thinking Suitcase would link with the font from the brochure folder and make it available in my menu, without me actually installing the font on my computer. Every time I opened Suitcase to work on that project, it would activate the fonts kept in the brochure folder. This way I was not "stealing" the font by installing it on my computer, just borrowing it to use in the piece it came with. Have I understood this correctly?

I appears that to organize fonts in Font Book, they have to be installed on my computer. I can't do what I did with Suitcase, right? But I could install the borrowed fonts on my computer, put them in a collection in Font Book (which I understand does not provide a separate location where the fonts are organized, it's just a window into the Library/Fonts folder where things are arranged differently, right?) and just turn them on and off when I needed them.

The fonts should be available to all of your Mac OS X native programs. (Not available for Classic, OS 9 apps; but, who uses those, anyway?)

Font Book isn't really a place to put fonts. It is really just a way to see what fonts you have and to turn them On and Off. If you turn a font Off using Font Book, the font will remain where it is; but, the System (and your programs) won't see them.

It doesn't sound as if you have so many fonts as to create a problem...if the font menu in your apps appears too long for you, you might consider turning a font or two Off. You might wish to check out the preference setting in Font Book before using it.

Adobe programs and Quark do not take advantage of Apple's Font Sets, so disabling a Font Set in Font Book will have no effect, unless you have chosen to Disable the fonts within the Set in stead of just the Set in Font Book's Prewferences. Disabling a font with Font Book will delete teh font from Quark and Adobe's font menu.

I hope I have not confused you more with this...

Great! After trying to learn about font management in school, on the job, reading books and help sites, and consulting others for about 5 years now, I am as confused as ever. So I am going back to the beginning, pretend like I'm in Kindergarten, okay?
I've upgraded to OSX 10.3 and have a Mac G4. I mainly use Quark, Illustrator, & Photoshop. I have about ten dozen fonts. I keep them only in the fonts folder of my main Library folder on the hard drive.
won't these fonts be available in all my programs without my doing anything else?
what further purpose does it serve to put the fonts into Font Book?

Thanks! Colleen