AIR33 Where is it?

[Leo Kanel]

Is it me or AIR33 Beta is delayed? We are a few days before April and there is no beta version yet. It looks like the 1st quarter release is missed.

[PippoApps]

Personally, I love AIR, I put a lot of efforts in my current apps, and I want to do whatever I can to keep working with it

This is the key. Doesn't make sense to advocate other technologies on this forum. We are here because we love AIR. Once Daevid Allen defined a cult band like something that very very little people love very very much. I think with AIR nowadays is the same (personally, it also allows me to sell 3 days of work for the price of 10, since makes me really productive). We love AIR, and now wit Harman backing it we will hope and try to make it a more widespread, and very profitable technology.

It's a matter of love, not of numbers. So, if you do not love AIR, you can save time and hang around somewhere else.

Long live to AIR, lot's of profit for Harman, and a bright future creating with the tech we love.

[ASWC]

Here you have it: don't talk about other technologies and don't criticize AIR and go away. Let AIR stay in its own BUBBLE and surely this will ensure its rebirth.

Any of you who thinks THAT WAY here in these forums is actively working to END AIR for good, you might not know it, you might not realize it, but you are.

In today's world there are cross platform technologies that are successful and AIR is NOT one of them, there are cross platform technologies that are being abandoned and AIR IS one of them.

That's reality, if you can't realize that to start with, you are UNABLE to help AIR survive and you are probably helping AIR die for good.

- To become relevant again AIR MUST look at what makes other technologies successful.

- To become relevant again AIR MUST look at its own defaults and problems.

Trying actively to STOP that type of discussion as some of you do is trying actively to end AIR for good.

AIR is on life support right now and the "only send positive vibes" argument will help make recovery impossible.

[Frédéric C.]

@ASWC I know you didn't reply to me directly, and I think we are actually agreeing on what matters, but I'd like to add something. My post was related to the "Air is dead" statement. I never said that we shouldn't talk about what makes other techs successful (especially if that's something we could add to AIR). On the contrary, we could call this constructive criticism, to make AIR evolve in the right direction. But "AIR is dead" is not that. It doesn't open any door, it just closes them all.

So saying : "[Unity-Flutter-ReactNative-...] is great because ... (fill the blanks). It would be necessary for AIR to offer something similar" does help.

Saying: "AIR is dead. Sorry guys, I can feel it, and I'm the kind of guy who is generally right about those kinds of things. Run before it's too late!", doesn't help at all.

I'm not obsessed with "positive vibes", I just want "constructive vibes" (as opposed to "destructive vibes").

[ASWC]

From "AIR is dead for Adobe in June 2019" to "AIR is dead" is plain misrepresentation.

I know how this works, by quoting "AIR is dead" instead of the real quote "AIR is dead for Adobe in June 2019", you make sure to get more people agreeing with you and more disagreeing with me. This is a well known tactic of deception that is more and more used nowadays. If people fall for it then too bad for them, they should read posts more carefully. I know what I said and in what context I said it and it is NOT what you posted and complain about.

If you were commenting on something I said or implied I would respond but since you are just playing the "out of context" game I have nothing else to add except calling you out on it.

5 people already liked your post, misrepresentation is so easy and so efficient ...

[Frédéric C.]

OK mate, I think this is becoming a dialogue of the deaf, and that each post will just add more confusion and misunderstanding to this chaotic discussion. My intention was not to criticize you personally, it was just a general comment explaining that some people here were not just blindly positive, but they wanted constructive criticism.

I didn't aim that at you specifically (I didn't even remember this "Air is dead" quote was from you in the first place, as I was reacting to davidrenelt's post). I have nothing against you, or anybody else actually, I just wanted to discuss. Sorry if it seemed otherwise... And frankly, I don't write posts just to get people agree with me, this is a strange way of seeing things...

Ok you know what, I think all this is just a total waste of energy. I just can't believe how much misunderstanding there is on this thread. Maybe internet forums are just not a good way to communicate complex ideas after all, despite all our efforts to make sense...

Peace.

[federicor30206780]

Not worth the effort to try to explain anything or try to discuss different points of views when for someone the glass will be always half empty and the discussions are not constructive at all. What I don't understand like others said before is why if you're not using AIR, you dont believe in it and you dont like it ... why you still come back here?

[Flipline]

I would hope most people following this thread know the original context that what you said was AIR being dead "to Adobe in June 2019".  People are obviously fixating on the negative connotations of the use of the word "dead" in there,  I'm sure emotions and frustrations are running high for everyone on the forum right now -- who here hasn't been frustrated by Adobe's handling of this for at least the last few months, if not years? -- so I understand why people might fixate on that word and get riled up, feeling like they need to "defend" AIR or themselves.  For my part I didn't think Frédéric was purposefully misconstruing what you said (at least I didn't take it that way), I assumed his sentiment was that posts -- by people in general -- that were ONLY doom and gloom weren't really adding anything to the conversation, and constructive criticism of what Harman will need to focus on and improve would be more useful right now.  Like others have said, I think we're all on the same side, and I'd hope people realize that you HAVE provided a lot of constructive criticism and suggestions here and in other topics!  I realize that everyone won't agree on the same suggestions/direction that everyone is proposing, and we're all stressed out by the situation, but I'd hope everyone here can steer away from personal attacks and focus on providing feedback to Harman on what the community is looking for.

[Frédéric C.]

Thanks Flipline, that's exactly what I meant. This thread proves that attacking each other constantly would lead us nowhere, anyway. I respect ASWC too, and that's exactly why I wanted to exchange with him.

Moreover, let's be honest, among all the people reading thoses posts, nobody really cares about the ego of one or another (including mine), as if it was some kind of battle where someone's right and the other wrong. Let's try to discuss ideas for what they are, instead of focusing on who voices them.  

[zwetan_uk]

ASWC  wrote

From "AIR is dead for Adobe in June 2019" to "AIR is dead" is plain misrepresentation.

...

Could you avoid to play the victim here?

here your "conclusion"

ASWC  wrote

...

It gives me no pleasure to be right, but I was right about Flash and I was right about AIR and I posted for years on these forums to HELP people make the right decisions. Those who find themselves stuck with this dead technology with no replacement can ONLY blame themselves Today. You had the information, you didn't believe it, it's your OWN fault, all the SIGNS were there and you didn't want to see them.

...

so if I mention you wrote "those who find themselves stuck with this dead technology" and I shorten it to you saying "AIR is a dead technology", you gonna feel it is misrepresentation ?

also in that very same post, you use the word "dead" 4 times, you don't say it is slow, or this or that is lacking, or whatever, you explicitly imply that it is "dead", as "can not be revived" as "too late, already dead", as "don't even bother try resuscitating it" etc.

your only interest is to be right, I don't see how in any shape or form your comments can "help people make the right decision"

it is one thing to make fair criticism in order for the platform to improve, and it is another thing to continuously and repetitively make negative comments in order to "help" people arrive to the conclusion "let's not use that tech and move on to use another tech",

how that does help exactly?

you are promoting and encouraging anyone to abandon the tech based on the premise that you judge it "dead".

And now when countless people react and tell you "oh no we don't think it is dead", you over react and play the card "oh you misrepresented what I said"?

please....

you clearly said "AIR is dead" in so many ways

you know it, I know it, many other people in this thread know it

[ASWC]

You forgot the best part of the quote:

"Special mention to zwetan_uk for being so wrong about so many things .... No, AIR is not "fine", everything is not "normal", Adobe is not still "committed" ...."

Also just so you are up to date zwetan_uk, Adobe not publishing AIR33 is not just (quote) "a simple delay".

Moving on ....

[kheftel]

There will be an AIR 33, just from a different company. If AIR was dead, there would be no AIR 33, it would just end. It's not dead yet . Maybe mostly dead. But not all dead. IMHO not quite time to look through the pockets for loose change yet. Now if HARMAN kills it... then yeah, it'll be all the way dead.

also... yeah, I don't know why Adobe seemed so hostile to AIR over the years, never advertising it, treating it like the redheaded bastard stepchild... Regardless of the death of the flash browser plugin, I think Adobe's to blame for the current state of AIR not being well-known at all. It could easily live on as an app-creation technology, you could even rename flash player to something less hated, but adobe seemed determined to neglect it to death. Here's hoping HARMAN does better with it, it's in their hands now.

[davidrenelt]

I applaud your dedication and I really wish that things turn out well for air .. i really do. I do think that saying "air is dead" is constructive in a way. It channels the urge to resist and maybe people are starting to support the platform in all kinds of ways. Maybe we see Adobe Air evangelists again, maybe hype is something that can be fired up even for an old tech. I'm all for it.

I'm severely pessimistic, more then ASWC i think .. which blows my mind a little to be honest

I promise that i'll keep my pessimism to this forum. It's somewhat the natural place for it .. given that it's hosted by the company that treated the tech like a hot piece of garbage. When Harman creates a Site with a forum, I promise i'll keep my toxic doom and gloom to myself

[ASWC]

More pessimistic than me about AIR? Is this even possible? Challenging task for HARMAN for sure, who can argue with that (some do apparently and claim everything's fine and smells like roses)? I'm not even sure if that type of task has been attempted before at all, or even less attempted with success. This will be a "phoenix" type of rebirth if that ever happens. I guess if that does happen there will be something very special to learn from it, right now my mind cannot put a realistic scenario together where this is possible at all. I'd love to be wrong as always.

[ASWC]

Something that would clear this up is a roadmap or something similar. If I'm right then publishing a roadmap is gonna take a very, very long time, if I'm wrong then it should come shortly.

[hferreira80]

I agree @Leo, a lot of developers jumped out (I can't blame them).

@federicor, I doubt that one that managed to came out, will ever back.

Even me that I have a small mobile App with this news, will jump out (the decision was made before).

But I have a big desktop application, so there is no prediction to leave AIR.

Even so, I'm aware of other options to leave AIR but it's not easy:

1. Apache Royale - Jewels (maybe but it's not an easy way);

2. Apache Royale - MX/Spark Emulation (the best solution but is very alpha product to be considered) - I tested this one;

3. HAXE - perhaps this is the way - I need to manage time to evaluate first but I read that a folks managed to do that so I believe that this is the one;

4. HTML5 - No way, no. Don't get me wrong, I don't hate HTML5/JS and use a lot for Web.

Meanwhile, I will continue to use AIR on Desktop where is stable (on contrary to Android/iOS that are hostages of marketplaces rules that are changing all the time).

[federicor30206780]

And a last and very important point :

The people that are still here is because they really believes in AIR ( as a technology ) and I'm sure all of us want to participate / collaborate / help in all this transition and new AIR future. This community is actually not very big but very loyal and compromised, and the most important, experienced and that's very valuable for the platform.

Use the community as a solid base to grow. Take care of them and the'll respond. Ask them and let them help all that they can.

But keep the word "Adobe" as far as you can, we know that perhaps contractually has to be there, but better in the "legal terms" rather than beside AIR logo. They have made "enough" .

[hferreira80]

I read somewhere that they will keep the word "Adobe" but on contrary, I would change the all name and logo "if that would be possible".

AIR is related with Adobe and Flash and there is a huge negativity around it (I don't need to describe why, we all know very well the reasons).

[PippoApps]

"AIR is related with Adobe and Flash and there is a huge negativity around it (I don't need to describe why, we all know very well the reasons)."

I call it the "F" word never to be mentioned...

[ajwfrost75]

Yes I almost said the same

Officially it needs to stay as "Adobe AIR". As long as you don't expand the abbreviation, that works, otherwise it sounds silly! But yes I take the point from reply #169...

I think the Android platform details look the same - sorry, can't check that right now to confirm it for sure - it's the NDK that was updated but all this should be pretty backwards compatible. You'll end up with APKs for 32-bit ARM, 64-bit ARM, and x86, and as long as they have the same application ID then the Play Store works out the rest...

[el111]

I think the Android platform details look the same

Thanks for the reply.
That's a little disappointing if that's the case. The current Android platform would be from late 2017 so. The base native SDK on iOS and Android is the foundation for mobile. Extensibility through ANEs is a massive strength of AIR and what is possible is tied to the base native SDK. I do believe it's imperative these are kept (relatively) up-to-date and I hope you would take that on board.

[phillipkerman]

This is cool I suppose.  Too late for any normal sized project.  I'm sure many devs and their companies work faster than me, but most business averse to extreme risk and faith in a company that doesn't communicate have moved on.  Plus, exactly how do you get a version that works for 64bit?  I filled in the form on HARMAN's website--I guess I just have to have faith they'll follow up?  Has anyone heard back from them and gotten binaries to download or is this going to materialize July 31st? 

[Flipline]

They did a mass email early this morning to everyone that had contacted them by that point with more information about timeframe, you can read the contents here:

https://forum.starling-framework.org/d/21728-the-future-of-adobe-air/15

[jfw82]

I really appreciated the cooperation of Adobe and Harman and I'm really looking forward to it and also seeing AIR maintained well in the future!

+ 1 Vote for Webkit Update

[hferreira80]

I'm not desperate for updates, because my use case is Desktop (I was forced to go away on Mobile for the obvious reasons) however would be nice the have the following on Desktop version:

Updates:

* Webkit Update (I should be able to open google maps on Windows and macOS without ANE's)

* SQLite Update (It is super outdated and you will get new features, bug fixes and performance improvements with a single external dependency updated)

New targets:

* Add Linux support again, updated and with Captiva Runtime

New features:

* PDF render/viewer

[PippoApps]

I just released a windows project where using StageWebView pdf can be rendered without a problem. Maybe I still have to hit on the limitations?

Cheers