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9

P: Adobe Adaptive Profile (Beta)

Adobe Employee ,
Sep 05, 2024 Sep 05, 2024

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This post applies to Adobe Camera Raw plug-in.  

 

The Adobe Camera Raw team is sharing an early look at a new category of profiles that adapt to image content. The first profile is Adobe Adaptive (beta) and is available for raw images only. 

 

Getting started with the Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile: 

  • Access the profile inside the profile favorites menu. 
  • In addition, there is a new section for Adaptive profiles in the profiles browser. 
  • Enable the profile and adjust the ‘Amount’ slider as desired. 
  • Use the rest of the Camera Raw tools just like you would otherwise. 


Check out the Help Page for more detailed usage information. For more technical information on the underlying technology, please refer to this Blog post.
 

 

Please try the profile and share feedback in this community forum. It would help to include details like how you access Camera Raw (via Adobe Bridge or Photoshop), your computer system details, and as much information about what you like or do not like about the resulting image quality. Our team will continually monitor this thread to track issues to improve the future experience. 

 

Best practices for using the Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile
 

For best results, try the new profile in the following scenarios: 

  • For food scenes. 
  • In situations where simply moving Tone and Color sliders may not be sufficient, such as for: 
  • high-contrast scenes, or 
  • landscape or cityscape scenes with skies. 
  • For High Dynamic Range (HDR) photography.  
  • Simply select Adobe Adaptive (beta) as a profile and click on the ‘HDR’ button.  
  • Note that Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile generates HDR and Standard Dynamic Range (SDR) data jointly, creating photos that look consistent with one another. In other words, after applying this profile, if you toggle the HDR button on or off, you will see either the adaptive HDR or SDR look, depending on the position of the toggle.  


To maximize the value of using Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile, please follow these steps:
 

  • Always start from the Adobe Default or Camera Default rendering (with no other edits) and enable the Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile first. 
  • Reset any other settings before applying the profile. 
  • Make additional global and local edits after assigning the profile, just as you would begin to edit photos with Adobe Color or any other profile. 



Boris Ajdin: Product Manager, Emerging Products Group
 


Posted by:

Rikk Flohr: Adobe Photography Org
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macOS , Windows

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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Since feedback was requested, here are my considerations.

 

The idea is potentially good, but unfortunately, many complexities are evident both in the final results and in the application. However, these are inevitable when developing new solutions.

 

The results are reasonably decent for standard images taken in typical shooting conditions. If we stick to the scenes used for the presentation, there are interesting corrections on macro photographs of flowers or insects, and on well-balanced images. If considered as a product aimed at an inexperienced and amateur audience without particular shooting needs, it may be acceptable, although the reference models for the images are extremely limited, and the analysis of the obtained results does not seem accurate. If these shortcomings are overcome, it could lead to acceptable and already interesting results.

 

The process tends to flatten the images, stripping them of their structure and depth, which means it is unusable for high-key or low-key images, in product still life, for portraits taken in a studio or on location, in landscapes with strong visual impact, and in shooting situations where depth and volumes are essential. The approach is quite simplistic in this regard.

 

Unfortunately, nowadays one would expect sophisticated depth and structure mapping of the image in order to generate corrections based on a three-dimensional logic. But as can be seen from how the Lens Blur panel works, Lightroom still lacks the ability to map the scene for volumes and subjects. This issue affects the correction of high-light and low-light areas: a shadow caused by a decrease in light is perceived as a dark area and is balanced accordingly, rather than based on the volume of the scene. These limitations are still evident in all AI applications.

 

Therefore, if the goal is to create images with a high dynamic range, we are really not there yet. When working in color grading for professional HDR solutions, readability in shadows or highlights is not considered the final element; instead, the aim is to extend the dynamic range as much as possible to deepen the scene. Thus, in this case, the application of corrections is simply terrible. The images become flat, structure is lost, and above all, the photographic intent is lost.

 

Errors are obvious on high-key landscape images such as snowy northern landscapes, studio photographs with deep shadows, and portrait photographs with pastel tones. The aesthetic reference standards are too limited, and the application often produces worse results than the original image. Verifying files from different cameras, photographers, and manufacturers, I can state that, on a very limited sample of about 300 images, only in 10% of cases was the result potentially interesting.

 

The main limitation is in the application to the Adobe Standard color profile alone, which, by its very design, does not allow the full gamut of the sensor to be rendered, with obvious difficulties in reds and blues. It is also impossible to select a 3D LUT within the profile to properly correct the starting base. Other main limitation of this solution, besides the extremely limited data source, is the inability for the photographer to allow the app to train on their own files, thus providing the ideal working base for making corrections.

 

If the goal is solely to normalize the image in order to start working on it, this process often makes the photographer’s work more laborious, as in most cases the starting point for their work is already the image they have created.

 

I hope to soon see a more accurate development of the product and be able to apply it proactively to a large number of images. I trust that there is the ability to create a new tool that enables professionals to integrate a series of solutions that allow for maximum customization of the individual photographer’s experience. More than a multitude of generic references, it would be useful to have a private and non-shareable AI training area dedicated to the individual photographer, as well as the option to use a specific color profile and proprietary 3D LUT that can provide the correct mood to the image. Obviously, in color grading, the AI should be trained to maintain the deviations expressed by the LUT so that specific tones of the image are not corrected. This approach would better assist all photographers and allow reportage photographers to maintain compliance with the C2PA standard.

 

Note: to provide accurate feedback, I tried modifying the starting data of the adaptive XMP profile by inserting different references for color profile and look-up tables, obtaining better results compared to the initial setup, but with clear limitations imposed by the AI control system.

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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i tested a broad range of image from my commercial work and have a very different impression, could it be that you simply oversaw to reset your old develompent settings first ?    

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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I’ve tested numerous images from various photographers, using clean, fully reset RAW files from multiple brands (Leica, Sony, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon, Fujifilm). The images span across different genres—landscape, F1, MotoGP, portrait, advertising, and more—reflecting the diverse sectors of the professional market my partners work in.
I also included images from amateur and reportage photographers. While I tested only 300 images, I achieved satisfactory results in just 10% of them.
 
I encountered significant color deviations from the required standards and major issues with dramatic images, which appeared overly processed and unsuitable for commercial or international distribution. As discussed by Florian Kainz, Marc Levoy, and Lars Jebe in their article, there are still substantial limitations, and the tool doesn’t work well for all types of images. I’ve identified and reported these limitations, and I’ve also pointed out that relying solely on a single Adobe Standard profile presents considerable restrictions. In our workflow, we use high-end profiles with dedicated 3D LUTs, which is a more advanced process. While it would be promising to see this tool evolve, at present, it feels more like a beta version with potential rather than a polished solution.
 
Although I can manually adjust the standard settings of the Adobe Adaptive Profile XML and apply a different profile or LUT that better suits an image at the start of the process, it’s cumbersome. The adjustments are only valid for one specific setting in a single scenario, and every time I need to close Camera Raw, edit the Adobe Adaptive Profile XML, save it, reopen Camera Raw, and continue editing. Additionally, the tool doesn’t support multiple profiles, limiting your ability to use invariant solutions or switch between LUTs as you would with an XMP profile.
 
Lastly, if the tool works for your images, it can produce great results, but it struggles with proper color management. The AI tends to alter tones based on its interpretation of reference images, forcing you to fine-tune each image individually rather than apply a consistent look across a series of images. I could elaborate further on the complexities of this tool—it has potential but feels underdeveloped for a beta, more like an alpha version. I hope to see significant improvements soon, especially for professional-level editing workflows.

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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as I wrote in my earlier posting  I think we should get a separate slider for luma and color corrections  or be able to at least turn color corrections off but otherwise i don't see the same issues like you but maybe this is because I do not expect miracles but see it just as an improved adjustable starting point nothing more.    

I do also not buy the high end profile BS as there is not such a thing as a perfect camera profile, the adobe profiles are well balanced., when you build a custom profiles which should work with different content and illuminations you just end up with something very similar as adobe.  as someone who had made a very large number of art reproductions I have a rather clear picture what profiles can do.  

 

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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If you work in the reproduction of artwork, you must adhere to FADGI or Metamorfoze standards, which require the calibration of the entire reproduction system. This is a separate issue and involves far more complex considerations, as it requires the calibration of the whole system, including a specific color profile. However, that’s not the point here.

 

I’ve provided technical feedback based on what I’ve observed in the field and what I’ve known for over twenty-five years, particularly given the resources available to me. It’s not my intention to argue or prolong this discussion. Adaptive profiles introduce corrections that should greatly simplify the development process, but right now, they have many limitations. They are still in beta, and I hope they will improve, just like Adobe’s other software has over the years.

 

That being said, if these profiles work perfectly for someone and solve all their problems, I’m not here to judge, because, as I mentioned, in some cases, they do solve issues. However, what we are waiting for is a more functional solution that can cover a broader range of scenarios. As things stand, I see the potential, but I don’t see the utility or any significant improvement in time and quality.

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Explorer ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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@Gotchakaboomba I haven't tested on as many images as you, but instead I tried applying the new Adaptive profile to event images that I was halfway through editing (to provide me with a direct before and after comparison) and since I prefer to edit towards a more flat target (not unrealistic HDR, but rather just more shadow and highlight detail than one usually gets with fill flash event images) and I was hoping that the Adaptive profile would work in my favor.  Unfortunately, it falls short.  I agree with your detailed observations. 

One consistent artifact I'm encountering is a weird tonal shift between the edges of objects.  For example, between someone's face and the contrasty background lighting.  Applying the Adaptive profile not only reduces that contrast as expected, but also adds a weird flat gray "haze" across the faces along the side of the face with the contrasty background lighting.  Folds in clothing and other textures also look more flattened and lose depth (often making the clothing look mottled or stained instead of just lumpy or wavy). 

I see these same types of tonal artifacts when using the Shadows/Hightlights tool in Photoshop and always have to push multiple sliders back and forth in the Shadows/Hightlights tool to find a balance in the settings that allows for recovering highlight and shadow while minimizing the tonal artifacts that appear in the modified image. 

Since I'm having to do the same with the tonal sliders in ACR with the Adaptive profile for each image, it's not really saving me any editing time at this point.  It has promise though.

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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I completely agree with your observations. The current configuration profile excessively compresses tonal ranges, resulting in very flat and uninspired images. This flattening strips away the depth and texture that are essential in many types of photography, particularly in scenarios where volume and lighting nuances are critical.

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New Here ,
Oct 16, 2024 Oct 16, 2024

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i really would like to see a sample of the artifacts discribed here because in my testing i could not find anything different than what a similar correction applied manually in ARC would also sometimes introduce.   

 

so i wonder does the camera play a roll or NR and sharpening settings ?  i use sony a1,a7r5 and GFX100II,  my files are also always on the (sligth) underexposured side could it be that this is why i don´t see the same artifacts and the adaptive profiel works better  ? 

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New Here ,
Oct 18, 2024 Oct 18, 2024

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The benefit of the tonal correction the AP applies is undoubtedly great but how can we obtain color consistency when used on sets of images like in professional interior or architecture work ? 

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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Some feedback - how it feels so far and what the results look like.
I shoot a lot of street and urban situations, sometimes with very changing light conditions. The whole thing with a fairly modern camera, 47mp.
If you take a picture without strong contrasts and provided you really start at 0, the result is okay. The colors are ok. The contrast is very flat, which is fine as an output. What you get here is a flat preset and a very neutral starting point. Nothing more and nothing less.

 

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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Works suprisingly well even with rather challanging images, what i would like to see is an option for separate controll of applied color and luminance corrections. 

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New Here ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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Funzione eccellente aiuta molto nel flusso di lavoro

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Engaged ,
Oct 15, 2024 Oct 15, 2024

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I would advise not using the new Super Resolution in combination with the new Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile unless you want this

 

ACR17.0_2043_Super_Resolution01.jpg

 

to become this

 

ACR17.0_2043_Super_Resolution02.jpg

 

It looks a bit like the Adobe Adaptive (beta) profile creates some kind of "mask" based on the original image size and leaves it in place when applying the adaptive adjustments. If it is a "mask", it is also resized because the adaptive profile seems to apply to the whole image, but the small "mask" is also applied to the top left quarter of the image.

 

I hope this bug gets fixed soon.

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 16, 2024 Oct 16, 2024

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Just playing around with it for the first time today. So far, I'm liking what I see. Of course you don't select "Adobe Adaptive" and be done editing, so I've found any tonal issues can be dealt with easily you start off with the image quite a bit closer to what the end result is going to be. I'm surprised and very satisfied so far, though I'm only on my third photo...

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 16, 2024 Oct 16, 2024

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Gentlemen,

I did try with different on some landscape picture and it works wery well, surprisingly well, the same with some picture of the interior of my house.

"Well" means very good dynamic range, no color shift and good luminosity and contrast, the picture does not need many adjustements after the application of the new peofile, basically most part f the job is done simply appling the new profile.

In my experience, the application of the profile is absolutely the first operation to be done on the workflow of the         RAW.

Good job and.....bravi!

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 16, 2024 Oct 16, 2024

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Hi! Will this feature be available in LRC too? I was excited to give it a try yesterday and got a bit disappointed. 

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Contributor ,
Oct 17, 2024 Oct 17, 2024

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I suspect that it will make its way there once it's tested sufficiently, feedback gathered, and finalized! It's currently a tech preview, which they often release in one product or another before it gets rolled out more broadly.

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 17, 2024 Oct 17, 2024

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Since it's the first time I use Adobe's adaptative Profile, I can agree that it flattens the image, and yet, it corrected highlights which is quite good for certain images. Of course it all depends on the intent of the image we are editing  image. As I am going to print later my birding images, some of them were benefited with the A. Profile , and other's were not.

It might be a very interesting option when it can be sudivided into categories , as we can do with our cameras (cars, people, birds, insects, etc) . On the other hand, I think it's a good starting point, and I wouldn't use it in the middle of the photo development. I have used the other Adaptative included profiles (the long list) and generally it doesn't work for me. As I said, we are all different photographers, and with different aims and styles.  One recommendation would be what ON1 Photo Raw already included last year, which is to train those profiles according to what we wish on a session of photos, that might be interesting. Right now, and as it is, at least for me, results are very limited. Yet I think that as it is a work in progress, it has potential. Thank you.

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Contributor ,
Oct 19, 2024 Oct 19, 2024

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It's mentioned at the bottom of this blog post that you're looking into generating JPEGs with both the SDR and HDR versions. I assume this is just making the HDR version display via a gain map on top of the SDR rendition. This is awesome—the current base SDR rendition tools for HDR images can be really rough. Please be sure to include AVIF/JXL in that file format pool now that you're supporting gain maps there, too!

 

I'm a big fan of being able to switch back and forth between HDR and SDR mode without having to suddenly re-edit massively for one or the other. This is obviously crucial to that first piece—editing in a way that'll produce great SDR base renditions for an HDR gain map. But it's also just useful when deciding whether it's worth keeping something in HDR.

 

Broadly, that ability to switch back and forth between SDR and HDR without a massive re-rendering would be great in much wider use. More options for how it actually handles the image colors and curves (ala Color/Landscape/etc as we have today), and the ability to apply across a wider range of file formats. Please include HEIC there. I know we're just getting treated to this in beta and more is coming, so this isn't a criticism of what it can do now—more a "this seems like a good path" encouragement!

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Contributor ,
Oct 19, 2024 Oct 19, 2024

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A more amateur take:

 

I've been particularly pleased with how this is handling landscape/wide angle scenes in HDR with slightly broken overcast skies. The skies, and the broken portions in particular, are by far the brightest portions of the photo. It's hard to get that sky to look good in HDR. It's getting the curve and intensity of the HDR about right behind some nicely toned clouds. So, it does a great job with that. The rest of the frame needs a bit of masked adjustment to make the appropriate objects pop (it's a pretty low contrast scene all around; it would need this no matter what). But, it's a really good start.

 

Flipping back to SDR on the same image is less impressive in terms of how it handles the sky. It's definitely better than any of the "standard" profiles off the bat (and better than standard profiles + auto settings), but I'm happier with the sky in SDR if I mask it and add +10 dehaze to kick up the intensity/contrast a bit. The rest of the image is about the same.

 

Using ACR 17.0 via Bridge 15.0 on MacOS 15.0.1, MBP M1 13" 2020. Working on Halide Process Zero DNGs shot on an iPhone 12.

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Community Beginner ,
Oct 20, 2024 Oct 20, 2024

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Get it over to the regular PS as soon as you can. On another front, hope you find a fix for my having to open PS in Rosetta on my Apple chip iMac, and thus losing the Remove Tool in the process.

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Contributor ,
Oct 21, 2024 Oct 21, 2024

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Actually I like the location of the Amount slider for Profiles compared to LrC. I don't use it very much in LrC but I can see myself using it more with the Adaptive Profile as the results are interesting. Sometimes Adaptive Profile is pretty close to Adobe Color and Auto and other files can be quite a bit different.          

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New Here ,
Oct 22, 2024 Oct 22, 2024

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I often work in photo studios with models (portrait, fashion, nude - with Leica SL2, Leica SL3 and Leica lenses). Sorry, but “Adobe Adaptive” usually delivers bad results - especially with photos in front of an LED wall, the results are absolutely unusable. Even “light” and “dark” are not convincingly processed for my DNGs with “Adaptive”, colors and contrast are too flat for my taste, It's certainly not a “one click and all is well” application and I'm not looking for one. What ACR offers (I'm not a Lightroom fan) is good for me. However, I hardly ever use the AI options - as far as “explicit nudity” is concerned, Adobe's guidelines still seem to be stuck somewhere in the early 1830s.

 

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New Here ,
Oct 23, 2024 Oct 23, 2024

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Lots of detailed replies 🙂 So I will keep my feedback short.

 

I applied this profile on a near-city night sky photo, with minor landscape. It's turning the photo to a much brigher result like dusk time. Normally the night sky is the ambience so we want to keep it dark.

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