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Are web dev forums part of the problem?

LEGEND ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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We are back in the school, college or whatever holiday periods, so little is happening.

My discussion is prompted by Nancys discussion on cheap web sites, (fiverr.com) and the rise of d.i.y. Site builders such as wix, and the frameworks such as bootstrap and wordpress. Along with the demise of Muse, and the lack of Dw having a clear plan for the future, (or do they).

Given that almost anyone can build a site now, cheaply, and to a resonable standard using site builders or even programs like Dw, Wappler and webflow. Is it unreasonable to expect anything other than clients turning to alternatives to the traditional web designer/developer?

We even offer to help those turning to those alternatives, simply by answering questions that they post in forums such as this. Some of us then go on to make public 'how easy it is' to build sites by those 'click to do' methods that Dw and other offerings use.

If we think it is easy, and everything should be easy, then why should clients pay us to do anything, after all if they get stuck, all they have to do is ask here or in one of the many other web dev forums. One of Adobes reasons given for EOLing Muse, was that wix, etc, does it better and cheaper. By that I would say they could see that the market for designers/developers building small static or simple cms dynamic sites was no longer profitable.

So should we even consider helping those creating small buisness or personal web sites, (in some cases almost building the site for them). Or should we stop and think about how much help we should give first?

No reply requirerd, just a few 'musings' I am having today.

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LEGEND ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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I dont mind providing help to those that want to learn the fundamentals correctly and maybe then go onto a web dev career armed with some knowledge which will enable them to have a transportable skill, hopefully an advantage in unlocking better opportunities and securing a long term future as a developer.

I dont have any time for the total framework, plugin junkie, click and drag, here today, gone tomorrow zombie though, although l can see what type of person those kinds of workflows maybe suitable for.

lm still learning and some of the requests are of interest, albeit few and far between these days, so responding will generally expand my knowledge too, it works both ways.

Also as you know these automated workflows are only capable to a point,  good enough for beginners but as you become more discerning and your visions and expectations grow their limitations start to show, quite frequently.

Not all websites are equal on account not all developers are as open with clients as they should be about what workflows they use. The unsuspecting client could end up with a pup on their hands, regardless of what they paid for it, a good reason for any client to think carefully when its too cheap to be true.

Its only going to get worse but its largely not my problem these days. Im just a voice for those that still have some pride in what they do.

Happy days!

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Community Expert ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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I hardly think this product forum is part of anything -- problems or otherwise.  As far as I can tell, it caters mainly to  the gray-haired, walker brigade (myself included) who remember building sites 10 years ago with relative ease.  The formula was simple  then:   Create a  template, add images, text and some MM behaviors. Voila! a site  that the client can maintain in DW.  

In fact, I'm looking at one such site right now from another forum post.   In its day it was probably very well received too.  But by today's standards,  it's an epic failure on multiple levels.  That just goes to show how complex the web is now and why serious developers must keep learning new skills or get out of the profession.

I'll happily answer product and coding questions but I am not here to apologize for how DW works, do homework or build a free site for someone.   My only goal is to inspire users to learn new things. 

Incidentally for anyone interested, the W3C is offering a  5 course certificate training program  for Front End Web Developers.  Cost: US $500.   According to their site, the average salary for front-end web developers in the US is $104,745.

https://www.edx.org/professional-certificate/front-end-web-developer-9

Nancy O'Shea— Product User, Community Expert & Moderator
Alt-Web Design & Publishing ~ Web : Print : Graphics : Media

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LEGEND ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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https://forums.adobe.com/people/Nancy+OShea  wrote

Incidentally for anyone interested, the W3C is offering a  5 course certificate training program  for Front End Web Developers.  Cost: US $500.   According to their site, the average salary for front-end web developers in the US is $104,745.

https://www.edx.org/professional-certificate/front-end-web-developer-9

Just to put that salary in perspective, the w3c also says a small web site costs under $250,000.00.

But yes the $104,745 is possible, (mine was more). What they do not say is at what employment level one must be, and what other skills on must have.

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