Look... nothing really about web development... ;]

[B i r n o u]

Adobe is more oriented towards Projects, Marketing...

By @B i r n o u

look... nothing really about web development... ;]

https://portal.adobe.com/widget/adobe/am21/sessions

[BenPleysier · Accepted solution]

Sorry @B i r n o u , I felt that this is a topic that deserves its own space.

Look Mum, no hands Dreamweaver

[B i r n o u]

Sorry @B i r n o u , I felt that this is a topic that deserves its own space.

By @BenPleysier

on the contrary, I think it's a very good initiative...thanks Ben

[osgood_]

We are just in denial......hoping. Its finished, the end. Dont want to compete in a competitive world. I cant say lm surprised and neither should anyone else be thats been around long enough to pick up signals.

[Nancy OShea]

Adobe's webectomy says it all:

• Muse is dead.
• Business Catalyst is dead.
• Brackets is dead.
• Flash is dead.
• PhoneGap Build is dead.

Adobe's web-based services  -- Portfolio, Behance & Spark  --  have no dedicated support boards on this platform.  When asked by a customer about Portfolio's status, an Adobe manager had this to say:  "...the Portfolio team asked us to close up shop here."  

https://community.adobe.com/t5/download-install/is-portfolio-still-being-developed/td-p/11583268?pag...

Apart from CF, DW, and Animate  -- which is arguably more design tool than web tool  -- Adobe has quit making Creative Cloud apps that produce usable code for the web.  Sadly, it is what it is...

[pziecina]

I don't look-in on this forum often anymore, but it's nice to see nothing has changed, (and I do really mean 'nothing').

Dw has not been for the serious web designer/developer for years now, and there is only those who are not professional web designers/developers, but whom Adobe listen(ed) to when it came to web design/development, to blame.

I doubt if the majority of users are actually building sites worth more than £250- £1000, with it. Most users are NOT serious about web design/development, and view it as something that is now 'fixed' in what is required and how it works, (with no inovation). Cheap and nasty, appears to be the rule, and if a client wants anything more, then the advice is to use wordpress or some other site builder, (and if you know code, some other editor).

Maybe most do not even know what can be earned by a professional web designer/developer, as I can remember someone quoting £35000 a few years ago, as though it was a 'fantastic' salary, (gods, my pension is more than that). The conception that web design/development is not a highly paid profession, may have made Adobe (and what is expected of Dw) think there is no point in developing a progran that is not used by professionals. After all if Dw is for beginners and 'part-timers', then Adobe may not really want to be assosiated with it.

(I know I no long do)

[osgood_]

Hi Paula,

Nice to see you around here again. I think unless you work for some City based web-development company, where its quite possible to earn 70k plus per year as a web developer or higher if youre a team leader then you will most likely be earning a lot less working in some out in the sticks company or freelancing for small locals.

I agree though a lot has changed in the 20 years lve been in web-development. I never wanted to work for a blue chip company as l always found the environment too back stabing and full of materialistc, souless robots. Not really my bag so was prepared to sacrifice that and not realise my full potential in exchange for much less money and more freedom. 

Its not that difficult to get a high paying job paid for by tax payers money, just look at the bbc or government departments full of box tickers, who then outsource the work. The pay today bears no relation to the skills one possess, its who you work for and how much that company or organisation can rip the general public off or the tax payer, think ppe.

As for Adobes involment with web develoment tools, they gave up years ago but wont admit it. Automation, AI and easy access to DIY products unfortunately change the landscape for many over the course of their journey. Some will be protected by attaching themselves to environments which arent as affected by change, ie we set the price, you pay, its not open to negotiation as we have workers wages and pensions to pay, not to mention those shareholders who also want a piece of the pie.

[pziecina]

Hi Os,

There is always a trade-off, when it comes to earnings vs job satisfaction, but what I am trying to point out is -

No company who claim to produce software for professionals, will invest in a product used primarily by beginners and part-timers. Which is the direction Dw has moved to. Also no one is going to get involved in a profession which does not provide a future, (be that money or satisfaction).

What I have read, (looking through this forums posts over the last few months and other sources) is that web design/development, has no middle ground. It is either cheap and chearfull, (or nasty) or highly specialised design/development, which is giving a false impression of what is possible and the knowledge required by everyone in my opinion.

[osgood_]

Hi Os,

There is always a trade-off, when it comes to earnings vs job satisfaction, but what I am trying to point out is -

No company who claim to produce software for professionals, will invest in a product used primarily by beginners and part-timers. Which is the direction Dw has moved to.

By @pziecina

I agree and have been repeating for ages, financially for Adobe its not worth it. They are leaving it to the smaller 'cottage' industry of tech companies which have sprung up on every street corner, who of course make a great living off a few thousand rotating subscribers to their software, many who use it infrequently, many won't get passed the first rung and many will become disillusioned when they realise they dont have the necessary skills to even get a job in the industry.

No one is going to get involved in a profession which does not provide a future, (be that money or satisfaction).

By @pziecina

I think there are still many in denial, who think a few courses taken on Udemy or following some YouTube channels will result in finding gold at the end of the rainbow. Alas for the majority this wont be the case in reality. Most people drop out long before the course has reached its finale or eventually realise that its not what you know but who you know and who you work for which will determine their fate and fortune. I was once lucky enough to work for one of the biggest Animal Welfare Orgainisation in the World for a few years and the bucks rolled in but I wasnt any better at what I did than anyone else. It was luck, being in the right place at the right time and having some good contacts.

What I have read, (looking through this forums posts over the last few months and other sources) is that web design/development, has no middle ground. It is either cheap and chearfull, (or nasty) or highly specialised design/development, which is giving a false impression of what is possible and the knowledge required by everyone in my opinion.

By @pziecina

Yup, I fully agree and I think you were correct some years back when you said for those at the bottom end of the spectrum it will be a 'race to the bottom'.

35k a year pension, are you by any chance looking for a partner to share it with, lol?

[pziecina]

Quote

35k a year pension, are you by any chance looking for a partner to share it with, lol?

Reply

I'm looking for extra donations, interested? lol

[osgood_]

Quote

35k a year pension, are you by any chance looking for a partner to share it with, lol?

Reply

I'm looking for extra donations, interested? lol

By @pziecina

Sorry can't help with the income I'm currently on - zero from the end of September as Covid SEISS grants have now ended. Things may look up later on in the year. Still only 3 more years and I get Government funding as I'll be officially classed as 'useless' and I'll tap into my private pension!! I pursue an economically lifestyle of sleeping all day and drinking cups of coffee, beer and inexpensive wine, watching the World go past, with a wry smile on me face - been there, seen it, done it and I have no intention of doing it again, if I can help it!!! We'll see lol.