Silly Databases

Report · Nov 19, 2007

Hi Dear,

I downloaded couple of ready-to-run programs from internet to testify my obligation. I was surprised to experience that there was not even a single example of relationship tables in server-based programming.

I would like to know about the status of relationship among tables in a database. Is it recommended or not and why?

Regards.

Report · Nov 20, 2007

You really need to read up on the basics of database design and database
normalization. Databases are a totally seperate mindset/technology that
should not be wrapped up under the tag of server-based programming as they
require an independent skillset and demand at least a basic understanding if
you wish to build successful applications.

I would suggest you get hold of a good book on database basics and do some
reading. You will then have a greater understanding of how to setup and
handle your backend database as this is the backbone of any data driven
application.

Pat.

"Nasik" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
news:fhtvsd$ntb$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> Hi Dear,
>
> I downloaded couple of ready-to-run programs from internet to testify my
> obligation. I was surprised to experience that there was not even a
> single
> example of relationship tables in server-based programming.
>
> I would like to know about the status of relationship among tables in a
> database. Is it recommended or not and why?
>
> Regards.

>

Report · Nov 20, 2007

> I would like to know about the status of relationship among tables in a
> database. Is it recommended or not and why?

If you have relational data, then, of course, a realtional database would be
recommended.

MOST systems will have realtional data, IMHO.

-Darrel

Report · Nov 21, 2007

"require an independent skillset"

A NEVER-ENDING LIST OF INDEPENDENT SKILL SETS... In other words, you
invariably will end up faced with the fact that you are lacking in one
skill set or another that is critical to accomplishing what you need done.

This stuff is like an onion or layers of cake if you prefer;)

Report · Nov 21, 2007

But unfortunately that is the way it is and this is what sorts the men from
the boys. That is just a fact of life.

A good developer will have at least a fair grasp of database technologies
because he/she has taken the time to learn about it and then used that
knowledge to gain experience, and while they may not be DBA standard, they
know what they need to know and understand it.

A crap developer doesn't. End of story!

Pat.

"Art" <lee_nospamification@artjunky.com> wrote in message
news:fi1h6j$q03$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> "require an independent skillset"
>
> A NEVER-ENDING LIST OF INDEPENDENT SKILL SETS... In other words, you
> invariably will end up faced with the fact that you are lacking in one
> skill set or another that is critical to accomplishing what you need done.
>
> This stuff is like an onion or layers of cake if you prefer;)

Report · Nov 21, 2007

> A good developer will have at least a fair grasp of database technologies
> because he/she has taken the time to learn about it and then used that
> knowledge to gain experience, and while they may not be DBA standard, they
> know what they need to know and understand it.
>
> A crap developer doesn't. End of story!

The spectrum of skills to be a good web developer is broad. Way to broad for
anyone to truly be an expert in all.

That said, all good web developers should have a basic understanding of it
all. From DB Schema to Font Styles. From CSS standards to Server Config
files.

Me, I'm a really good generalist. I know enough to be dangerous in all
areas. ;o)

-Darrel

Report · Nov 21, 2007

Yes, that is very true Darrel, but to be a decent data-driven developer you
must have at least a moderate understanding of databases. If you don't then
sooner or later you will fall over. That is my point.

Too many new learners treat the database as an afterthougt and don't realise
how important it is for their application to work well. The spectrum is
broad and yes, it's impossible to gain expertise in all, but a good
grounding in database essentials is essential if you want to develop
successfully.

"darrel" <notreal@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:fi1rf6$7kt$1@forums.macromedia.com...
>> A good developer will have at least a fair grasp of database technologies
>> because he/she has taken the time to learn about it and then used that
>> knowledge to gain experience, and while they may not be DBA standard,
>> they know what they need to know and understand it.
>>
>> A crap developer doesn't. End of story!
>
> The spectrum of skills to be a good web developer is broad. Way to broad
> for anyone to truly be an expert in all.
>
> That said, all good web developers should have a basic understanding of it
> all. From DB Schema to Font Styles. From CSS standards to Server Config
> files.
>
> Me, I'm a really good generalist. I know enough to be dangerous in all
> areas. ;o)
>
> -Darrel
>

Report · Nov 21, 2007

> Too many new learners treat the database as an afterthougt and don't
> realise
> how important it is for their application to work well. The spectrum is
> broad and yes, it's impossible to gain expertise in all, but a good
> grounding in database essentials is essential if you want to develop
> successfully.

It sure helps. But I've seen PLENTY of bad DB's in my time (and if *I* can
tell it's bad, it must be REALLY bad) that have worked fine for years if not
decades and may likely chug along just fine for some time to come.

I did the front end production on an ecommerce site for a firm that had
outsourced the PHP work. I know enough PHP to see how they were generating
the master product list (maybe 200 items).

They had a PHP loop that, in turn, would query the DB for each item row.
Furthermore, instead of a join, they used multiple queries to get the data
for each row.

For this page to load, it was sending maybe 800 queries.

I pointed this out a few times, but no one cared, and the page load was
maybe 30 seconds as opposed to 10 if they had fixed it. In the grand scheme
of things, it was 'good enough'.

Yea, makes us cringe, but, alas, 'good enough' is often 'good enough'.

(But, no doubt, we as developers should know better! ;o)

-Darrel

Report · Nov 21, 2007

Scary stuff mate! Nice story.

"darrel" <notreal@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:fi26um$jtv$1@forums.macromedia.com...
>
>> Too many new learners treat the database as an afterthougt and don't
>> realise
>> how important it is for their application to work well. The spectrum is
>> broad and yes, it's impossible to gain expertise in all, but a good
>> grounding in database essentials is essential if you want to develop
>> successfully.
>
> It sure helps. But I've seen PLENTY of bad DB's in my time (and if *I* can
> tell it's bad, it must be REALLY bad) that have worked fine for years if
> not decades and may likely chug along just fine for some time to come.
>
> I did the front end production on an ecommerce site for a firm that had
> outsourced the PHP work. I know enough PHP to see how they were generating
> the master product list (maybe 200 items).
>
> They had a PHP loop that, in turn, would query the DB for each item row.
> Furthermore, instead of a join, they used multiple queries to get the data
> for each row.
>
> For this page to load, it was sending maybe 800 queries.
>
> I pointed this out a few times, but no one cared, and the page load was
> maybe 30 seconds as opposed to 10 if they had fixed it. In the grand
> scheme of things, it was 'good enough'.
>
> Yea, makes us cringe, but, alas, 'good enough' is often 'good enough'.
>
> (But, no doubt, we as developers should know better! ;o)
>
> -Darrel
>

Silly Databases

1 Correct answer