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Converting large complex unstructured set to structured.

Explorer ,
Jun 05, 2014 Jun 05, 2014

I am converting a large complex unstructured doc set to Structured Frame. I'm starting off with Tom Aldous' webinars. I have many questions. First, I am performing my conversion to DITA (because this is how the webinar guides us). Is this the best format to use? I will have PDF User Guide with multiple role based outputs and Robohelp Webhelp output. Am I better with a DITA or Custom Structure?

I am using TCS 3.

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correct answers 1 Correct answer

Advisor , Jun 11, 2014 Jun 11, 2014

Amy,

   You do not need a structured application unless you are working with XML. Even if you plan on doing so eventually, from what you've told us so far, there's no hurry. Go ahead and work with your structured documents and let the EDD mature before you worry

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Advisor ,
Jun 05, 2014 Jun 05, 2014

Hi AMC...

The first question to answer is WHY are you converting to structure? And when you say "Structured Frame" are you assuming XML or are you just moving from unstructured FM to structured FM (binary files)? You should have a solid reason for doing this, and typically that reason will be based on the data model (DITA or other). Your question about which model to use leads me to think that you may not have done enough research to really justify the effort. Before you do anything, you should spend more time doing this research in order to determine the proper data model, and to justify the effort itself. This is not a simple task. Take the time up front to learn and understand what's involved and why it is (or is not) a good idea.

That said .. assuming moving to structure is a good idea for you, unless you have a really good reason to develop a custom model, I strongly recommend using one that already exists. The typical options are DITA (my preference), DocBook, and S1000D. Each model has it's pros and cons, and the appropriate choice is often determined by the industry.

The other issue of XML or structured FM is important to understand. In my opinion there is seldom a good reason to just move to structure without taking it all the way to using XML files as the source. Other people will likely disagree with me, but I feel like you often end up causing more problems and benefiting less by just using structured FM (binary) files. DITA won't work well as structured FM, and you won't benefit from the reuse possibilities as much. You also won't be able to take advantage of the wealth of tools available for working with DITA if you're not in XML.

If you do need to convert to DITA, you might want to take a look at a plugin that I offer called FM2DITA. Feel free to download the trial and use it to see what it can do. It also includes some documentation that may help you to learn more about the conversion process. Even if you don't buy the tool the sample field and information will help regardless of the data model you choose.

     http://leximation.com/tools/info/fm2dita.php

You may also want to watch this webinar that I did for Adobe ..

     http://leximation.com/downloads/adobe-fm2xml-2013/

Good luck!

…scott

Scott Prentice
Leximation, Inc.

www.leximation.com

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Explorer ,
Jun 05, 2014 Jun 05, 2014

Hi Scott,

Thank you for the very detailed response. I appreciate your time.

I do plan on moving all the way to XML, and I strongly suspected DITA was the way to go, but I'm hitting issues, so I wanted to confirm.

The reason I am moving is that I need more flexibility with my conditional output. I need to create boolean expressions around combinations of brand, output, and roles. I could not do it in unstructured Frame, and others on this forum suggested that Structured was the only way to go. I have just had a long enough break between releases to give this a shot.

I will check out your tool. I do also want to learn how this all works though. I feel I'm right on the edge of grasping it, and then it slips away from me.

Do you know any other resources you would suggest?

Thank you again!

--Amy

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Advisor ,
Jun 05, 2014 Jun 05, 2014

Hi Amy...

You should review the Structure Application Developer's Guide and Reference ..

     http://help.adobe.com/en_US/FrameMaker/8.0/structapp_dev.pdf

     http://help.adobe.com/en_US/FrameMaker/8.0/structapp_dev_ref.pdf

These are for FM8, but the concepts haven't really changed. I though there were newer versions available, but don't know where they are. This documentation is the definitive collection of info on the subject.

…scott

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Explorer ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Thanks, Scott. I have already downloaded these along with the DITA specification, so it looks like I'm set!


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Advisor ,
Jun 09, 2014 Jun 09, 2014

Scott,

   There are FM9 versions of the Dev Guide/Dev Reference. See:

http://help.adobe.com/en_US/FrameMaker/9.0/StructuredDev/Structure_Dev_Guide.pdf

http://help.adobe.com/en_US/FrameMaker/9.0/StructuredDev/Structure_Dev_Reference.pdf

To find the latest versions, go to adobe.com and start to type "FrameMaker" in the search box near the top. As soon as you get to the first 'a', a pop-up menu appears. The first section is called Adobe FrameMaker and it has three links. The last of these is "Get help and support". Clicking it takes you to the main FrameMaker help page:

FrameMaker Help

The right side of this two-column page is a list of available FM manuals, including the version with which they were last released.

--Lynne

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Mentor ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Hi Amy,

I think Scott asks some good questions and you gave good answers. With them, I might suggest that you look carefully before deciding that DITA is absolutely the way to go. It may, but then again it may not. DITA is very complicated and is certainly not required to enhance conditional output processing. You might find that a much simpler, self-designed structure model would be more appropriate. There is a pervasive gee-whiz factor with DITA that seems to drive people towards it, along with industry "experts" who say it is the only way. I have enjoyed a highly-sophisticated structure-based condition model for many years without ever dealing with the complexities of DITA.

Russ

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Explorer ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

That's very interesting, Russ. Thank you for the reply.

How would I go about doing that, just in basic steps? I thought I needed the DITA processing rules to get my complex conditions. Do I still convert all the way to XML, or does just applying a structure suffice?

If just the structure (and EDD I assume), how do I get to the conditional processing?

Is this process specifically described in a resource I could refer to? Frame is so powerful, but it's hard to track down just how to accomplish some of these specific requirements.

Thank you again,

  --Amy

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Mentor ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Hi Amy,

First, let me emphasize that I don't mean to say that you can't meet your requirements with DITA. I'm just suggesting that there are plenty of other paths, one of which might be more efficient and/or less complex.

For structure-based conditional processing within FM, there are basically two options:

- Use the native Filter By Attribute feature. FM provides a tool that you can use to filter structured content based on structural attribute values. It uses the concept of expressions like other methodologies.

- Use the AXCM plugin (AXCM Plugin - West Street Consulting). This plugin provides comprehensive conditional text management tools for the structured environment. All conditional assignment and processing is based on structural metadata, not unlike the basic DITA conditional model. This plugin is free but the disclaimer is that I wrote it. I use it extensively myself which is the reason it exists. I find the native Filter By Attribute feature hopelessly rudimentary for any high volume usage.

These two options will work without any need to go all the way to XML. And FWIW, I do disagree with Scott on the notion that structured FM has questionable value without the XML piece. As a technical writer, I am totally dependent on the efficiencies offered by the structured authoring environment. In some cases, I do use XML, but other cases not. In all cases, I would never dream of going back to an unstructured environment, because it just takes longer to get words on the page.

If you do go to XML (DITA or not), that's a whole different discussion with endless possibilities (and complexities).

No matter what you choose, I commend you for looking beyond the obsolete technology of unstructured Frame for a modern solution. There is a world of interesting and effective solutions for situations like this and all you need to do is make an earnest effort to find them. In time, you become the one in charge of your workflow, rather than the tools sitting on the shelf.

Russ

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Explorer ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Hi Russ,

So If I understand you correctly, you are saying yes, I can meet my requirement of Boolean conditional output using just Structured without going the extra mile to XML (dita or not). Is that right?

If so, then that is the way I should go: for two reason... 1) It is all that is required at this time to meet my requirements and should require less time overall; and 2) I'm far closer to an ultimate XML conversion should I ever need to do it.

Please confirm.

I'll also check out your plug-in because your description sounds like what I need.

Finally, what resources should I check out for how to structure my conditions? I understand the whole concept of applying structure to paragraph and character elements. Do the conditions just become a specific attribute? Is it a new attribute type? Is there somewhere I should go to learn more about this, or will your plugin make it all clear to me?

I think you may have just taken a three ton (or month) weight off my shoulders!

  --Amy


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Advisor ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Hi Amy...

As you see, Russ and I have differing perspectives on this. Everything he's saying is totally correct .. structured FM (binary, non-XML) is a very powerful mode of operating, and is definitely a step up from unstructured FM. There are good reasons to operate in that mode. The reasons that I discourage people from it are ..

  • Your publishing options are limited. If PDF is your only deliverable, that's fine, or if you want to publish to online formats through RoboHelp (or now directly from FM12), that's fine as well. But if you want to be able to take advantage of other XML-based publishing options, that's not easily available.
  • You may not gain as much of an ROI from translation costs as you would from XML (depends on your vendor).
  • It's easy to get sloppy with structured FM. Because it's a binary file, there is no real validation process on file save. Yes, if you violate the structure, you'll see red lines in the structure view (but you can still save). But the biggest problem is that you can apply formatting, using traditional unstructured FM methods, and it'll stick. It's not being applied by the EDD and context rules, but by direct application of styles or properties. If you ever want to go to XML, all of that will be lost. Also it's possible to apply styling and have it get lost because the EDD can get reapplied which removes that styling. To me, it's just an odd middle-ground that can be confusing and result in unexpected problems.

That said .. Russ' tools are incredible. AXCM and FrameSLT (with the Node Wizard) make it possible to efficiently work in SFM. If the publishing options are acceptable from FM, and you're careful to only use structure for formatting, this can be a viable option.

Cheers,

…scott

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Explorer ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

I'd like to mark you both "correct answer" and give you both great shout-outs. What help you have been for just a fellow tech author. I'm humbled.

I am using Robohelp for the Webhelp output (and perhaps other help outputs for different form factors in the future) and PDF output for the user guides.  I'm also working as a team of one for the time being, so adherence to my own rules should be doable, and the rules should make it easier if I ever get to build my team.

I'll keep plugging along and if you like, will keep you posted on what worked out for this project. I have a dozen books to convert, so I'll be busy for a while!

Thanks again!


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Mentor ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Amy,

Scott and I disagree on other things as well, but most of those have nothing to do with technical writing or FrameMaker. So, I'd probably get kicked off the forums if I went any further on that.

Regarding AXCM... the plugin works entirely within structured FM without any need for XML export. You can use attributes and/or element tags to denote your conditions... any attributes, values, and/or tags that you want. The logic of conditional evaluation (boolean or whatever) is fully customizable with whatever markup you choose to use. Incidentally, it could work on DITA files too but it's more likely that someone would just use DITA tools for condition management in that environment.

Given the scope of flexibility, AXCM can be a bit complicated to understand at first. It has some tutorials to help get you started... I'd recommend starting there. And, if it turns out to be the wrong choice, you aren't out anything. It is free and always will be, as long as I own it.

Russ

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Explorer ,
Jun 06, 2014 Jun 06, 2014

Thanks Russ.

I have downloaded your package and started to look through it. The description is precisely what I am looking for. But I need to get my docs into the structured format before I can use it. So that's my first step in all of this.

I already set up my conversion table to almost successfully convert using DITA elements (concepts, conbodies, titles, ps, etc). Can I continue down that path, import the database.edd and template, and then save my structured docs and work from there? (Seems to me that once I have it set up, I could import the EDD and Template into my conversion table and then convert all my unstructured to structured at once, no? Then I could use your tools to apply the conditions.)

Or is it  better that I go back and use one of FrameMakers structured templates (like their Book with the Chapter, Frontmatter, etc)? This structured template looks much closer to what I am producing and is much, much simpler, but it doesn't get me that extra step toward DITA should I want to go there ever.

thank you!

  --Amy

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Mentor ,
Jun 10, 2014 Jun 10, 2014

Hi Amy,

Apologies for the delay in response. I took a little time off.

Regarding your question about which structure definition to use, I think Lynne provided much better information than I could have, so let me defer to that wisdom. Probably the summary is that we can't answer the question for you. You need to understand your requirements and plan the solution that will meet them. This doesn't happen over night and likely remains a recursive process forever, if you are of the mind to continue innovating.

Regarding AXCM again, I want to note that it is not used to "apply conditions" like you suggested. You apply conditions by assigning the markup (attribute values, etc.). Afterwards, AXCM allows you to manipulate your content based on those "conditions," for example, coloring for visualization and filtering for publishing, like native conditional text tools do.

Russ

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Advisor ,
Jun 09, 2014 Jun 09, 2014

Amy's original question was whether to use DITA or a custom structure. Scott responded by asking the preliminary question of whether to use structure. I hope my responses to both questions is still relevant. I'm going to split them into separate messages. I'll start with the value of structure first, here.

Reasons for using structure include:

  • Promoting consistency of content organization and formatting within a single document and throughout a set of documents
  • Enforcing many of an organization's content requirements
  • Separating editing and formatting so that writers can concentrate on content rather than appearance
  • Promoting reuse
  • Creating documents that conform to the vendor-independent XML model so that they can be processed, if appropriate, by various XML tools
  • Simplifying porting to non-FM editors, for example, to collaborate with an author who wants to use a different editor even as the original author works in FM
  • Reducing the set of tags a writer must memorize (no need, for example, for different tags for the titles of chapters, appendices, and sections of various levels; they can all be formatted differently but still called the same thing)
  • Using knowledge of the relationships among various elements to simplify several editing operations. It's a dozen years old now but http://txstruct.com/papers/FrameUsers02.productivity.pdf is still relevant. It's a summary of a presentation in which two users, one editing an unstructured FM document and the other editing a structured version of the same content, were asked to make the same changes. The user with the structured content finished much more rapidly in all tasks.

For many years, I would tell people that the most significant difference between structured and unstructured documents was the underlying model of a hierarchy of elements versus a sequence of paragraphs; they understood the concept if they understood the difference between a second-level heading, say, and a second-level section. I now consider that point to be the second most important. The most significant difference is that the writer of a structured document is creating data that must conform to programmatically-specified requirements. Whatever those requirements are (a custom model or DITA, DocBook, S1000D, or many other publicly-available models) allows processing such as the creation of various extracts or conversion to different forms based on those requirements.

--Lynne

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Advisor ,
Jun 09, 2014 Jun 09, 2014

Amy,

   I don't know what experience you have in working with XML, structured documents, EDDs, conversion tables, read/write rules, application definition files, and the other components of a FrameMaker structure application. You may not need them all. Especially if you are new to structure in general, I recommend that you don't try to learn everything at once. Start with something you do need--a structured template and an EDD and branch out to other components as you need them. It is always tempting to start by converting legacy documents. If your schedule permits, I recommend first setting up a structured template that you can use to experiment with structured documents. If you start with the conversion table, you may wind up with a structure that is optimized for adding structure to existing material rather than editing it once it's been structured.

   As far as the question of whether to define your own structure or use an existing one, I do not agree with the logic that using an existing model (such as DITA) gets you started earlier and saves you analysis time. Structure is all about organizing content, that is, organizing ideas and your project will provide the most benefit if you take time for planning at the beginning. That analysis might take the form of designing your own structure; it may take the form of figuring out how the elements and attributes defined in an existing model map into your own content. Remember that the industry-standard models are designed to apply to the documentation needs at many companies. They often make great examples for preliminary study, but they tend to be huge and much more complex than you may need. If you decide to go that route, strongly consider using a subset or specialization of the original model.

    Using a large tag set off the shelf is parallel to using a word processor without a style sheet. If the model was designed to let writers create almost anything, the model won't help writers create documents that conform to their own company's conventions. For example, one benefit of FrameMaker structured editing as compared to unstructured editing is that the context-sensitive available elements listed in the structured Element Catalog show only elements the writer is likely to need at the current point in the document. In contrast, the Paragraph and Character Catalogs show all defined catalog entries. Thus, if certain formats are only available within front matter or only for a title at the beginning of a larger unit, the format catalogs still show them everywhere. Suppose you start with a model that allows dozens of inline elements within a paragraph (emphasis, foreign phrase, part number, keyword, quotation, and so forth). If writers at your organization never use more than five of the inline elements, set up your application so that those five are the only ones listed.

   One of DITA's original design goals was to reduce the overhead that large companies like IBM required to publish documentation from new partners. The only way that goal could be achieved was with permissive rules for what's allowed where. Yes, DITA can be customized to support more stringent rules. Learning how to do so is part of the cost of using DITA. That expense may be worth it, but recognize it is there.

  The dividing line between a custom structure and a customization of one that is widely available may be blurry. My mother once had a cookbook with a recipe that concluded something like "bake for 20 minutes, or more, or less, it all depends." Designing a structured environment is similar. It all depends.

   --Lynne

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Explorer ,
Jun 10, 2014 Jun 10, 2014

Hi Lynne,

Thank you for your reply.

I have basically zero experience with any structured frame before starting this process. I understand the purpose, but I have no experience either authoring in the structured environment nor developing structured templates. I am determined to learn, but it's coming very slowly.

I have come to the conclusion that a Custom Structure is what will work best for me. To that end, I have been working with modifying Frame's built in Chapter Structured Template. I'm currently having some trouble with nested bulleted and numbered lists, but I'm still researching and testing things out.

I still have not been able to find a definitive guide on converting Unstructured to Structured, so this is a very painstaking process.

Once I have a structured template that works and have converted one user guide over, I will try Russ's tools for building the conditional books.

I welcome any other advice you have!

Thanks,

  --Amy


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Explorer ,
Jun 11, 2014 Jun 11, 2014

After I convert my unstructured to a structured with a Conversion Table, and then apply my EDD, do I then have to create a custom Structured Application, can I simply save as a template and work from there?

I plan to ouput the Frame files to PDF and to single source them with Robohelp for Help output.

Any other steps necessary?


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Advisor ,
Jun 11, 2014 Jun 11, 2014

Amy,

   You do not need a structured application unless you are working with XML. Even if you plan on doing so eventually, from what you've told us so far, there's no hurry. Go ahead and work with your structured documents and let the EDD mature before you worry

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Advisor ,
Jun 11, 2014 Jun 11, 2014

Whoops, hit Ctrl-s before finishing the sentence:

...about XML.

   --Lynne

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Explorer ,
Jun 11, 2014 Jun 11, 2014
LATEST

Thanks, Lynne!

I just played around with it a bit using the Quick Start in the Stuctured Developer's Guide. At least I know what it is now, but I will instead now spend some time figuring out how to set my condition attributes. I think I have just about everything else in the EDD.


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