Has anyone starting using the new HDR feature in v13?

[greggplu]

I'm still trying to get a handle on the new HDR feature in v13.

I have a Gigabyte AERO 17 HDR XD laptop. It has a 17" 4K display that is both HDR capable and has a 100% AdobeRGB color gamut.

I use a Datacolor Spyder X Pro to calibrate my screen. Datacolor says that the calibration only works if you disable the Windows 11 HDR feature. Datacolor also explains that most so-called HDR displays use a 'dynamic technology' to create an image with higher brightness levels. While in HDR mode the peak brightness level of a HDR monitor can be only displayed on 10% of the screen area or for parts of the second (to show explosions etc.) on the entire screen. Because of this dynamic technology a correct reproducible stable color reproduction is not possible during a calibration process. Therefore, HDR displays cannot be calibrated with these functions enabled. Only a very few HDR displays (very expensive ones) create an image with static image enhancement technologies. These can be calibrated with no issues. I believe mine is the former.

So based on their advice, I am supposed to disable HDR if I want to properly calibrate the colors of my screen.

I've tried the HDR feature on my laptop with HDR enabled in Windows 11 and disabled. When the Windows 11 HDR is enabled, and I use the Windows HDR calibration app to set my display profile, AND I pick HDR in Lightroom v13, the highlights of a photo look great. There's more color and detail than there is in just SDR. If I disable Windows 11 HDR and use the datacolor Spyder X calibrated profile, there isn't really much difference between the highlights in SDR or HDR mode. However, according to Datacolor, since Microsoft's HDR calibration app doesn't use a sensor, like their Spyder X Pro, it can't do a very good job of calibrating the colors.

Also, the white bar under the histogram is the display compatibility marker. When my Windows 11 HDR is enabled, this white bar only extends to about halfway between SDR and 1 stop. So I'm wondering if it's even worth trying to edit in HDR. My laptop's HDR capabilities are probably just isn't good enough to use Lightroom's HDR feature.

Does anyone have a similar laptop with HDR capabilities that they've tried with v13's HDR feature? Do you also calibrate your screen with something like Datacolor's Spyder X?

Also, since I'm not sure where to export my photos and take full advantage of HDR. If I upload images to Instagram or Facebook, I don't think they display HDR anyway. Nor does Google Photos, right? 

[Conrad C]

I don’t know the answer to most of your questions (because I’m using a Mac), but about your last question, I think social media services and websites aren’t yet serving up images in HDR file formats that work with web browsers. Some, such as Instagram, have started serving HDR video, but not still photos as far as I know.

The one place on the web that does support HDR still photos is the Lightroom web gallery (lightroom.adobe.com). If you sync HDR photos there from Lightroom Classic or Lightroom, it does show them in HDR in Lightroom on the web. I tried this, and it works, and of course you can share a web link to that gallery with other people. However, the usual limitations apply: Anyone who wants to see the photos in HDR must view the Lightroom web gallery in a compatible web browser such as Chrome or Edge, on a true HDR display.

[greggplu]

Thanks for the info. Have you tried the HDR feature with your Mac? If so, take a look at the white bar under the histogram. It indicates your screen's HDR capability. My screen can only display about 1/2 stop of additional dynamic range. A recent YouTube video demonstrating the new HDR feature seemed to show his white bar extending to a full stop. I know the YouTuber has the latest MacBook Pro, but does most of his video editing on a late model iMac. Maybe his iMac can display 1 stop and his MacBook Pro can do more?

What is your's capable of displaying?

[Conrad C]

I’m using a 14" MacBook Pro; the 14" and 16" displays are HDR-capable to 1000 nits sustained, 1600 peak.

I took a screen shot of my HDR histogram, remembered I had taken another one earlier, then noticed they were different. The white line extended to different distances. Well, I had to be able to explain this before answering your question.

Then I remembered that the Adobe article “High Dynamic Range Explained” (written by the chief engineer behind HDR) says:

If you’re editing on a laptop or mobile device, and you have automatic/adaptive brightness enabled, be aware that moving into a brighter or darker environment will cause your display’s available headroom to change. You’ll see these changes reflected dynamically in the histogram and on-image overlays as the balance shifts between yellow and red.

OK, but…I shut off adaptive brightness, so now what? I decided to see what happens if I manually adjust brightness while watching the HDR histogram. Sure enough, changing HDR display brightness changes the available headroom marked by the white line in the histogram (see the demo below). That means it isn’t really about adaptive display brightness, it’s only about the brightness level itself.

Now we have the answer to your question: On my Mac, the white bar can extend from almost 2 stops beyond SDR at maximum HDR display brightness, to all 4 stops at roughly 45% HDR display brightness or below. I figured those out after recording the demo below, so the full range is not shown in the demo.

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@greggplu wrote:

I know the YouTuber has the latest MacBook Pro, but does most of his video editing on a late model iMac. Maybe his iMac can display 1 stop and his MacBook Pro can do more?

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I could be wrong, but I don’t think any iMac has an HDR-capable display, they all seem to top out around 500 nits. But I’m also not sure what level Adobe defines as maximum SDR. If the YouTuber set the brightness of an iMac display 1 stop above maximum SDR as defined by Adobe, then maybe that explains it. Google seems to say that SDR video is mastered at 100 nits, with a typical range of 100–300 nits, and an iMac can be brighter than that of course. However…if I create a display preset that limits my HDR display brightness to 500 nits, Lightroom Classic won’t enable HDR. So if that was a valid test, Lightroom Classic probably won’t enable HDR editing for the iMac built-in display.

The only desktop display Apple makes that meets the Adobe HDR editing specs of 1000+ nits is the 32" Pro Display XDR. All the other Apple HDR displays are mobile: Those two MacBook Pro models, the 12.9" iPad Pro, and some iPhones.

[greggplu]

Thank you for exploring this on your Macs. I've observed that I can also make the HDR capability white bar shift to about 3-1/2 stops above SDR by adjusting my brightness settings. In the case of Windows 11, the process is slightly different. They provide a general brightness setting and, under HDR settings, a slider for 'HDR content brightness.' It's worth noting that modifying the HDR content brightness alone doesn't affect the capability bar in Lightroom.

To achieve the desired shift in the white bar, you have to first lower the general display brightness. Subsequently, adjusting the HDR content brightness results in the shift. Interestingly, on my system, I've encountered a situation where dynamically changing these brightness settings doesn't produce the expected shift in the white bar. I'll need to further experiment to determine the specific combination of settings that influences my screen's HDR capability. Although I did notice a change from 3 to 3-1/2 stops, the exact steps that led to this increase remain unclear to me at this point.

In addition to understanding the relationship between my screen's HDR capability (as shown with the white bar) and the two different brightness controls, I am trying to figure out how the Windows HDR Calibration tool effects my HDR capability. Yesterday, while exploring the HDR feature, my HDR capability showed the white bar at about 3-1/2 stops. After this, I went about editing several photos without HDR because the exported images will be viewed on non-HDR screens. Then I exited Lightroom. Today, I ran Lightroom to edit some more images and decided to rerun Windows HDR Calibration. Before running the calibration, the capability white bar was only at 2 stops. I have no idea why it changed from 3-1/2 yesturday to 2 today. I didn't change any setting in between exiting and rerunning Lightroom. After rerunning the calibration, the capability white bar jumped up to 3 stops.

I might be wrong, but when you run a calibration. You make adjustments to the brightness levels. So if you set your display's color profile to a new HDR calibration, and then adjust your brightness, aren't you messing up your calibration? 

[JtheNinja]

The Windows HDR Calibration app is for testing how bright of HDR signals your display will handle without clipping. Displays are supposed to specify this to Windows automatically, but often do not do so correctly. The calibration app is just to find the true max point. Since this is unrelated to your brightness and SDR content appearance settings, it won't break the calibration. Those settings just alter how far up the scale the SDR "paper white" level sits. Since calibration is only for locating the top of the scale, they don't conflict.

The reason the available stops in the LR histogram moves, is because that is based on the difference between your current SDR paper white setting, and the max HDR white signal your display has. The latter is fixed and a physical property of your monitor. So raising the SDR paper white level eats into your HDR headroom above that, which is why the HDR capability bar in LR decreases.

[30898239]

I can share some testing I have done:

jpeg hdr does not seem to work on iPhone 12 with iOS 17.0. jxl hdr does work though. I was a bit surprised by this, I almost expected the opposite, but maybe the jpeg hdr is more of a hack than a real standard, whereas jxl supports HDR in the standard.

[kaz219]

Important bit to remember when testing on iOS: the low power mode (yellow battery displayed top right of the iOS screen) disables HDR, it should thus be turned off when testing HDR pictures.