Lightroom changes the appearance of my images after import

[ninjapimp]

I dont understand this or why it does it. my preferences has everything unchecked.

I import my images

i see the thumbnails which look fine but when i click on image, it displays on my 2nd monitor and looks perfect. but here is the problem, a second later it makes an adjestment to it which ruins my image, it makes it too bright. its like its auto toning yet i dont understand why it must do this.

my goal is to simply view my image on 2nd monitor w/o lightroom making any adjustments to it.

how can i prevent this or why is it happening?

can anyone please help me...any help would be greatly appreaciated.

Message title was edited by: Brett N

[ssprengel]

Can you post a public download link for one of your images after uploading them to something like www.dropbox.com or www.yousendit.com? The graininess is normal if you are brightening dark areas, because that brightening is a digital increase in ISO of those areas. The camera-JPGs will have had noise-reduction applied to them and in LR you need to turn up the Luminance NR because the Adobe factory-default is zero.

Since there is so much difference in exposure between the LR and NEX7 images, perhaps you have a setting enabled in camera that auto-fixes exposure problems or auto-compresses highlights. Highlight compression is done by the camera unexposing the images by a stop or more, and then digitally adding brightness to only the darker area—like Fill-Light or increasing Shadows does in LR.

If you are going to be using LR then you should turn off the camera fixes because they mask exposure problems when you view the images on your camera’s LCD.

What version of LR are you using, specifically?

[mcrckrck01]

I am using Lightroom 3. 

I just re-imported a set of pictures and took screen grabs showing what is happening as previews are rendered. 

Each photo starts off with quality in the thumbnail, then one by one, they turn dark.

The below links are to my dropbox showing the screen grabs.  I want to stress that each of the photos in the series shown were taken with the same ISO, shutter speed, and aperture value.  In the camera, they look great...in LR they go black as the previews are rendered.  I have also included a full size showing with the exposure and fill light added. total grain! 

One set of pictures was shot at ISO 200 so I cannot understand why so much noise is visible.

Thanks in advance for any help.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2ntsml4qsd6wwyw/Screen%20Shot%202012-09-15%20at%2010.28.44%20AM.png

https://www.dropbox.com/s/r98rsaos5n01l05/Screen%20Shot%202012-09-15%20at%2010.20.33%20AM.png

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1ypt0cd4jav8c4i/Screen%20Shot%202012-09-15%20at%2010.22.37%20AM.png

https://www.dropbox.com/s/62wpo2bvoldx2ne/Screen%20Shot%202012-09-15%20at%2010.23.03%20AM.png

[ssprengel]

We believe you as far as what it is that is happening that the image starts out ok and then darkens, it is why and what to do about it that is in question.

Do you have any in-camera lighting or toning or highlight-compression settings set, anything that changes the image before it is written as a JPG?  Another reply, above, mentions a specific setting to check as DRO – perhaps Dynamic Range Optimization.  If you have this enabled it explains what you’re seeing and the remedy is to turn it off so that your camera is properly exposing the images. 

To reinterate, with DRO enabled, the camera is purposely underexposing your images then brightens the shadows in camera and applies noise-reduction before writing the JPG or embedding the preview.  This is only convenient if you are using camera-jpgs and only confusing if you are doing RAW with a non-Sony product such as LR or Photoshop from Adobe.   Using Adobe products you can brighten the shadows yourself and apply highlight compression and add noise-reduction, but because LR is written by Adobe not Sony, the adjustments are not automatic like they are in the camera.  You are in charge and you have to do them. If you need to underexpose your own images using a negative EV-setting to keep the highlights from clipping, then you can do that, yourself, but you'll know you've done that and will expect to do your own boost in exposure in LR and add more noise-reduction than normal.

If you still need us to look at things, please upload ORIGINAL raw files to www.dropbox.com and post the public download link so others can try and see if the results are the same for them.   It’s possible something else is going on like you've set your default settings to extra dark when you import the images.

For screen-grabs as you’ve used dropbox for, this time, it is easier for anyone reading your message if you just attach the screen-capture image to the message on the web version of the forum using the camera icon above where you type in your message on the forum.  This makes them visible within the message instead of having to open them in another browser window. 

[mcrckrck01]

Thanks to both.

I did have Dynamic Range Optimization turned on and set at the highest setting.  I now know to keep that thing turned off.

Also, if it helps anyone else with the same issue, I used my original Sony CD and used their import software (Image Data Converter) and this program imports the photos similar to the Sony Image.  It doesn't really help with the Lightroom issue but I at least am able to see the images now as the camera shows them to me and I can convert to JPEG with more info in the file. 

[areohbee]

mcrckrck01,

Assuming Sony's DRO is not doing something to the raw data itself, other than a reduced exposure I mean (and *probably* it isn't), it may still have the same value to use it in conjunction with Lightroom, as it does in conjunction with any other converter. The difference is that you will need to take responsibility for compensating for the underexposure in Lightroom. i.e. what it does is assess whether highlights will be blown out at normal exposure, and then "exposes to the left". It then records the fact that this has happened, so processing software can compensate. Lightroom misses the memo, so to speak, so your photo appears dark (and maybe overly contrasty). DRO is still good to have on in-camera *if* you are shooting high dynamic range shots where highlights should be protected if possible, *otherwise* it's better to turn it off.

Don't get me wrong: if you want your pictures to look in Lightroom, after initial raw conversion, more like they looked in camera, then you must turn DRO off. But if you want the full advantage that DRO offers, in Lightroom, then turn it on when it's appropriate, off when appropriate, and compensate in Lightroom, either manually (how I do it) or use ExifMeta/CollectionPreseter combo to auto-compensate in Lightroom, like your camera and Sony software does - more info available upon request.

Rob

[richardplondon]

Rob Cole wrote:

But if you want the full advantage that DRO offers, in Lightroom, then turn it on when it's appropriate, off when appropriate, and compensate in Lightroom

As far as I can tell, the "full advantage" that DRO (and similar) offers, is functionally identical in the context of LR Raw development with what we get by carrying out normal exposure compensation (with the feature turned off). With the latter method, we do at least avoid building an extra, invisble, systematic, Raw vs JPG offset into what the camera histograms, blinkies etc are telling us about the metering of the scene - as well as, telling the auto exposure function of the camera.

[areohbee]

If the camera does meter-based optimization of exposure, it must be 'On' in camera (to benefit). I don't know about Sony's DRO.

In the case of Nikon's ADL, the exposure optimization is not fixed (it's dynamic: based on measurement of reflected light), so there is value in using it regardless of raw converter / post-processor.

Normal exposure compensation just adds a fixed offset to what the camera thinks is reasonable exposure, but ADL is adding some "expose to the left" on top of that, to try to protect highlights. Otherwise, reasonable exposure means expose more to the right.

Does that not sound right? Or not make sense??

Rob

[richardplondon]

Rob Cole wrote:

Normal exposure compensation just adds a fixed offset to what the camera thinks is reasonable exposure, but ADL is adding some "expose to the left" on top of that, to try to protect highlights. Otherwise, reasonable exposure means expose more to the right.

Does that not sound right? Or not make sense??

I think this is all getting a little OT for this particular thread, for which I apologise. I take no issue with what you say. If ADL/ DRO is doing something specifically clever with the metering, on a shot by shot basis, then yes that may be an extra convenience benefit. However, we should balance that against some possible extra inconvenience once we come into LR... for example, if the needed exposure boost becomes awkwardly large. LR cannot lift exposure linearly, so is IMO less appropriate for deliberate exposure offset techniques (e.g., so-called "ISOless" working) than some other converters are.

I'll just add that certain cameras are already doing their best to protect highlights shot-by-shot when metering in Matrix (Pattern, super-E-Z-psychic, whatever) mode - or if not, that is what the camera operator is there for (grin). I'll fully stand ready to be corrected about ADL and/or DRO, if it emerges that LR can make use of the resulting Raw file in any different way, leaving aside how this has affected the absolute exposure - and all which follows from that.

regards, RP

[areohbee]

I definitely can see some merit in leaving it off all the time, especially if you primarily use Lr/ACR for post-processing. Probably better than leaving it on all the time, which is what a lot of people do until they learn to leave it off all the time . IMO, it should be a camera control instead of a menu option so it could be more easily toggled per scene. But, it's not... - definitely something to be said for simplifying shooting, and reducing the number of things to worry about before triggering the shutter - that's one of the great things about shooting raw anyway - you don't have to think about camera controls that are getting baked in. Cheers, Rob.

[RikkFlohr]

Just set your camera to Adobe RGB, and turn the contrast way down (in Camera) and your JPEGs will then look like your Raws and you won't stay up late at night worrying about it.

[areohbee]

I always shoot with a modified neutral style - reduced contrast and enhanced saturation. I want to be able to see what tonal detail there is to work with, and what colors are present, not to make a result that looks good out of camera. Added bonus: my images usually look a lot better after Lr's default processing .

[toemanh83045779]

hi

do you have a solution to your question yet? my thumbnails turn dark one by one too after they finish importing. please help me out if you know how.

[richardplondon]

You might try turning off "DRO" when you are shooting Raw.

As I understand it, this feature (each camera brand uses a different term for it) works by underexposing the image in absolute terms so as to reduce highlight clipping in the Raw sensor data. The camera then adds back custom processing later, to brighten the picture up to a normal looking JPG result. When it comes to Raw, certain software - but it seems, not LR - will automatically do the same.

Lightroom, where it lacks this special corrective function, simply sees the reality - an underexposed Raw file - with some increased shadow noise, as an expected consequence. This naturally tends to appear darker overall, and that takes some care to retrieve. Some methods are better than others, for doing that.

Disabling this special mode in the camera results in a more conventionally and properly exposed image with Raw values and highlight information that are closer to Lightroom's expectations.

Given good camera technique - avoiding both undesired highlight clipping AND systematic underexposure - optimal results are IMO more easily achieved, this way, out of LR.

[HAHPHAEK]

Indeed something is happening. LR is changing the appereance of the RAW files, just as described (loads fine and after a second or two, it changes its looks).

In my case, it is applying some color tone and vignetting, it is not helping the look of the image at all.

I have been a user of LR since its first version and had not encounter this problem until recent. I shoot on Canon's 5DM2 and for what I have been able to tell from the posts, it is also happening to Nikons and Sonys. It is not a monitor issue since mine are also calibrated. I do architectural work and my camera settings have not changed, I shoot RAW with everything zeroed out and neutral. I have tried several options, including going back to Adobe's default settings without luck.

So far I have not been able to figure out what is wrong nor find an answer or explanantion for this issue.

[dj_paige]

Indeed something is happening. LR is changing the appereance of the RAW files, just as described (loads fine and after a second or two, it changes its looks).

...

So far I have not been able to figure out what is wrong nor find an answer or explanantion for this issue.

As has been explained in this thread numerous times, there is nothing wrong, this is the way Lightroom is supposed to handle RAWs. It shows the JPG preview embedded in the RAW file until it has time (usually a few seconds) to render its own version of your RAW photo, which of course looks different than the JPG preview.

I understand you do not like it. But you cannot turn off this behavior of Lightroom. You can adjust your Lightroom import preset to produce photos more to your liking. Or you can shoot JPG, in which case Lightroom does not change the appearance of the JPG created by your camera. Or you can use the manufacturer's software. You have an abundance of choices.

[areohbee]

HAHPHAEK wrote:

I have been a user of LR since its first version and had not encounter this problem until recent.

I would think if this is the phenomenon everybody thinks it is, that you would have noticed it long ago.

HAHPHAEK wrote:

In my case, it is applying some color tone and vignetting, it is not helping the look of the image at all.

Are you saying there are actual (non-zero) vignette/color setting being applied, or you are just noticing a difference in vignetting and color/tone, but no non-zero settings have been applied.

Perhaps an example? (I've not noticed anything inexplicable...)

Rob

[missclaire101]

It is a problem for me. I shot a wedding and edited a handful of photos for a blog post, I have come back to the photos to continue editing and LR3 automatically contrasts my images. I click on the image I want to start editing and it becomes a lot more contrasted. This happens even with images I have already edited so I have no idea why this is happening. And it didn't happen the first time when I was going through them. Have you found out what to do about this? It is making my work load double now that I have to go over and re-edit my photos from my blog post.

[dj_paige]

You shouldn't have to re-edit anything, when you use LR correctly.

So please clarify what you mean when you say "I have come back to the photos to continue and LR3 autmoatically contrasts my images". Are you perhaps exporting and overwriting your original? Are you exporting the photos and then deleting them from LR? What exactly is your process here?

[missclaire101]

I have created a collection for the wedding I am working on. I have worked on some for a blog post and successfully exported them. I am now trying to complete them. I haven't deleted them from LR. I went back to the collection and when I click on any photos, both the originals and the photos that were edited and exported previously, contrast automatically. They do not look anything like the photo that was previously exported. I edit photos all the time in lightroom and notice this happened a couple of times in another bunch of photos I was sorting, but just re-edited them.

[dj_paige]

Missclaire101

It still sounds to me like you have exported your edited photo, and selected the option to overwrite the original.

Could you please confirm or deny that this is what you did?

Thanks.

[missclaire101]

No I do not think that is what I did. I still have the original file, when I exported the photo it was to a new folder.

[areohbee]

missclaire101 wrote:

I shot a wedding and edited a handful of photos for a blog post, I have come back to the photos to continue editing and LR3 automatically contrasts my images.

How were they edited originally? (for your blog post) i.e. using Lightroom, or some other software?

Lightroom knows nothing about in-camera (or in-other-software) edits, if that's what you mean (except ACR-based edits. e.g. Photoshop).

If edited previously in ACR-based editor (e.g. Lightroom), you should be able to continue where you left off...

R

[missclaire101]

My photos for my blog have been exported, but they are still being held in my collection for this wedding in lightroom. I have gone back to the folder to continue editing the other ones. Nothing has changed since I last worked on them in lightroom. I go into the collection they are under and click on a photo to begin and it makes the photo a lot more contrasted. It does this on photos I had already edited and exported that are still in the collection in lightroom. I have never had this problem before. I thought I was seeing things and compared the photo that was already exported to the one that lightroom contrasted and they are completely different photos now. So, yes, I have to re-edit it to look the way it originally exported to be like.

[areohbee]

Photo should always look, in Lr, next time, same as last time, *unless*:

- there is a bug, or (perhaps more likely, especially if you're a newb):

- you've inadvertently applied some other develop setting since, e.g. via auto-sync, or inadvertently reset them...

- some other operator error I haven't thought of.

I've never had a problem as you describe that wasn't the result of operator error, unless I've misinterpreted what you are saying...

Cheers,

Rob

[missclaire101]

I'm not sure then. Because I haven't done anything differently. I'm just trying to figure out how to fix it, so I'm trying to rack my brain why it is doing this.