File management with lightroom and photoshop edits

[jj_345]

I'm transitioning to lightroom from bridge/photoshop.

Traditionally I have the following directory structure:

- Shoot name/date

  - Edits

  - RAW

Typically, in the RAW directory,  I go through the raw files, rank them (1 star etc) and edit a subset of those.  Now I can do 50% of the edits in lightroom only, and the rest I then go into photoshop. At the end, I normally copy the edited files (a subset of the starred files) into the Edits directory.

The challenge I have is that some of those files are lightroom files, and some are TIF files produced in photoshop.

What's the best way to do this?  Currently I "edit" the lightroom edited ones in photoshop and simply save them so that I have TIF files of all my edits..., but there must be a better way.

[dj_paige]

What's the best way to do this?

The best way? I don't think there is a "best" way, there are many ways to do this.

My opinion: I think first you ought to abandon the idea of having edits in one folder and RAW in another, that simply doesn't work within Lightroom. I would recommend you do all file management within Lightroom, and then only export the photos as TIF when you need them outside of Lightroom (for example, for printing or uploading or e-mailing or use in a non-Lightroom program).

[jj_345]

Thanks for your thoughts.  The reason I don't quite want to give up other directories, is that I edit on my desktop, yet travel with a laptop and may be require to access editied pictures when I'm on the road.  Having them live in a directory structure rocks.  It also means that if I want to access edited files, it's easy, I just go to the directory/edit and can export/make retouches on those without having to remember which is the latest edit...

With all the directories in one folder, how can you say see all edited final images (some in PS, some in LR)

[dj_paige]

jj_345  wrote

With all the directories in one folder, how can you say see all edited final images (some in PS, some in LR)

Because Lightroom always shows you the latest edited version, if you let Lightroom manage these things.

The reason I don't quite want to give up other directories, is that I edit on my desktop, yet travel with a laptop and may be require to access editied pictures when I'm on the road.

Consider putting the photos (originals and TIFFs) on an external disk, and attach the external disk to whichever computer you need it.

[jj_345]

I have my files on a NAS where the files are remotely accessible...  BUT my dilemma is how do I make lightroom edits available without exporting... 

I have 200k files in lightroom and the index (and previews) are quite substantial to copy when I'm remote...

[ManiacJoe]

The trick to using LR is that you need to let it be the master of the files. Ideally you put the files into the desired folder in the first place and never move them.

The way I do it:

Under each shoot/event folder are two subfolders "originals" and "exports" containing the respective files.

If I need to go to an external editor from LR, the resulting new file is also placed in the "originals" folder.

My original files (NEF, JPG) are named after the capture date (yyyymmdd_nnnn).

The externally edited files (PSD, TIF, etc) have the same root name plus "_edit_mm" or something.

In LR I always sort the files by file name, thus the originals and edits appear side by side in the grid and film strip.

Output files from the Export dialog go into the "exports" subfolder. Since these can be recreated at any time, usually they are kept but sometimes not.

[jj_345]

Thanks for your thoughts. So originals for you include destructive edits (like in Photoshop).

How can you say see all edited final images (some in PS, some in LR) in the originals folder?

[ManiacJoe]

Yes, all source and intermediate files are in the "originals" folder, for the lack of a better place.

When I edit in Photoshop or other editor, I launch the editor from LR, which imports the new file into the catalog when Photoshop is done with it. From LR I can continue non-destructively editing the PSD file or eventually export a JPG from it when I export the edits from my other originals.

All the edited files are viewable in LR. Once a file is imported into LR, LR is the master of the files and their derivatives.

After the edits are exported, I may use a color-managed external viewing app (ACDsee) to quickly view the JPGs.

[jj_345]

I used to love ACDsee many years ago...  but the product has evolved and last time I checked it, it wasn't easy to view files...

[GoldingD]

I keep wrighting this, but catch myself being wordy.

ok, shorter

keep your originals in one folder, perhaps name it 01 RAW, in that folder have perhaps two sub folders, 01 keepers, and 02 rejects. Never ever throw originals away. If you want to see the forest thru the trees, consider under 01 keepers to have 91 from camera, and 02 working on on.

do as much as you can in Lightroom before going to photoshop or third party programs.

create a seperate folder 02 TIFF

export your worked over RAW files as TIFF placing them in the TIFF folder. Note that you will not treat these as originals, that you will not be doing non destructive edits, that you will not be using the develop module on them (mostly)

edit thsee as needing it in Photoshop, you will be editing the originals, not copies, accomplish your content aware fills, your raster based edits, etc. need to use NIK? Need to use AUORA, etc.

If you need to use Lightroom on one of these TIFF files, then trash the file, go back to the RAW.

next up, any publishing to Facebook, etc, any thing going out to a print service? Create a seperate folder JPEG, export to it with appropriate settings.

my main difference is, I try nit to do Lightroom edits to the exported TZiFF files, that just confuses the history (my memory, not Lightroom’s history) on how I got to a final point.

[jj_345]

Ok, I think we're kinda doing the same thing.

In my raw I use the star rating to delineate keeps from rejects- easy to filter on those vs. different physical directories, but I suppose that since it's easy to go up one directory and view everything it makes sense.

So you edit in your originals, then export them to the TIFF directory?  That seems easier than opening in photoshop and saving.  Is that where you do your photoshop edits in that directory?

[john beardsworth]

Flags are meant for identifying keepers and rejects. Easy to filter, easy to delete the rejects - Cmd Backspace / Ctrl Backspace.

Exporting raws to a TIF directory is unnecessary and probably time-consuming. With the raw originals that you need to Photoshop, use right click, Edit With Photoshop. When you save the images in Photoshop, they will normally be saved in the same folder as the raw files and can be stacked with the raw (Preferences, External Editing, Stack with Original). Left this way, the raw file is stacked under/hidden under the TIF. That can be convenient.

Also consider the possibility of Edit As Smart Object in Photoshop, instead of Edit With. This produces a bigger file, but allows more flexibility re-editing the raw file.

If you need to make further changes to a TIF, it's possible to do this in LR but I find it's confusing to have some edits done in LR and some done with the PS file adjustment layers. For example, say you need to modify overall brightness. You could certainly do it in LR. But then let's say you want to do more Photoshopping to the file. One option is to open the file with LR edits which will have the brighter look but means you will confused by having a new flattened TIF. Another option, opening the TIF "as original", loses the brightness adjustment, but keeps only the one TIF and preserves adjustment layers. For me that's better. So whenever I want to do further changes in PS, it's Edit With Photoshop, Open as Original.

[Just Shoot Me]

I see your point of moving Edited TIFF files to some other folder, when you used Bridge/ACR/PS but you can Stop doing that now that you are using LR.

In LR you can use the Filter Bar to pick out, separate, types, kinds, of files in all sorts of ways.

I personally place all images in Dated folders, by years, and Dated Subfolder by Day/Month numerically (0311, third day of November and so on).

But it is similar to you using Shoot/Date folder names and then a subfolder (But you could do away with the RAW-Edit subfolders).

Then Filter images by one or multiple criteria.

That is the power of LR.

It takes some getting use to. I too was File Manager junkie and still am in all things other than images. But LR has changed that for my photography.

[jj_345]

What's an easy way to filter for lightroom edited images AND tiff files (i.e. all of my edits- some in lightroom, some in photoshop)

My main rationale is what happens if I want to access files on my NAS remotely where I may not have my complete library?  Or say the day I forget to renew my lightroom CC subscription?

[Just Shoot Me]

jj_345  wrote

What's an easy way to filter for lightroom edited images AND tiff files (i.e. all of my edits- some in lightroom, some in photoshop)

My main rationale is what happens if I want to access files on my NAS remotely where I may not have my complete library?  Or say the day I forget to renew my lightroom CC subscription?

As stated you use the Filter Bar. Use both the Attribute, to filter for LR Edited images (that is for image files that show the LR Edited and or Crop Flags) and the Metadata options, to filter for TIFF images.

But that will only show you LR edited TIFF file. In other words Tiff file that once created you Re-Edited them in LR.

For TIFF files only just the Metadata option and TIFF in File Type

For all LR edited images just the Attribute option and the Edit icon.

You really need to play around, USE, the Filter bar to get a better handle on how it can work, or not, for you.

[jj_345]

Thanks again for your insight.

What I'm struggling with is creating a "smart filter" that would display all my latest "definitive" edited files for a particular shoot (or all shoots for a year) even years down the line.

As you stated, I can't select one start AND edited as that wouldn't select files edited in lightroom then photoshop.

Also, I wouldn't want both TIFF and Edited versions of the same files- I'd just want the TIFF if it exists

The logic is:

- Filter on one Stared files

   - For those subset files if a TIF exists, select that

   - Otherwise if a lightroom edited file exists select that

Only work around I have now is:

- For each shoot, go through RAW directory to select files I want to edit

- Select files I want to edit with a one star

- Export those files to TIF and my "EDITS" directory

- Edit most  files in EDITS in lightroom, and the ones I need photoshop (Liquify, content aware fills, ...) - that way all FINAL edits are in that directory and are easy to find years down the road