Mac vs. PC for Premiere Pro CC with a budget of...

Report · Oct 24, 2013

$3300.00 ... That's what I'm budgeting.

Warning:

I know any post of Mac vs. PC can spark a lively debate and I sense much of this forum's base are PC users but hopefully I'll get some honest and sound advice/purchase options.

Purpose:

I'm a current Mac user not wanting really to go back to PC but I'm about to make a purchase so I wanna be open to the idea if it's gonna make life better for me while editing. As crazy/stupid as it sounds...my fear of returning to the PC world is mostly because of my memory of the years of having to deal with the need for Virus Protection on a PC. I have bad memories from having to renew/pay for that every year and it slowing things down and ultimately my last PC was infected and crashed. But my editing is what I do 6 days a week on this computer for work. I used to be a FCP user so Macs made sense but now I'm all in on Premiere Pro CC so maybe a PC would be best...or maybe I should just stay with Mac. Who knows?! Bottom line: I use Premiere, Audition, Encore and Photoshop with 90% of it on Premiere (using basic cuts, cross dissolves, extensive use of Warp Stabilizer, and the occasional gaussian blur). I also use this computer to go online. That's about it. Mostly.

Current State:

I have a 2011 iMac with a 27" screen. Love that size. It has 3.4 GHz i7, 16GB 1333 RAM, AMD 6970M 1GB VRAM GPU, 120GB SSD (OWC 6G) running the OS and apps, and I also have a Elite Pro Dual eSata HDD + Thunderbolt adapter (RAID 0) from MacSales.com that I currently use as my scratch drive.

Option #1:

I was just about to purchase the newest iMac with most of the upgrades for what would be $3300. The upcoming 2013 Mac Pro looks nice and I love the idea of being able to upgrade as I go, but it doesn't come with a screen and I can't necessarily afford it when you add that in. Plus it doesn't come out for a couple months and honestly I have a great offer in right now on my iMac that I'm about to sell.

The iMac I was intending to get as soon as next week was:

2013 iMac with the 27" Screen

3.5 GHz Quad-Core Intel i7 ("Turboboost" up to 3.9 GHz)

1TB "Fusion" Drive (Apple's 120 SSD + 1TB HDD mix)

32 GB of 1600 MHz RAM

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M (4GB VRAM)

4 USB 3.0 Ports

2 Thunderbolt Ports

PRICE: $3300 (about)

Option #2:

A PC of some sort that's upgradable going forward and optimized for what I use it for primarily (see underlined and bold above). I truly have been out of the PC world sooo long and I know that each "side" has their advantages. I love Mac but I'm just wanting to get the best machine for Premiere for my budget. I've been a loyal mac user for years but I'm no fan boy (eg. I happily own a Galaxy S3 by choice) I was excited to get the newest iMac released just a couple weeks ago but then tonight I saw this site (http://pcpartpicker.com/) and started thinking about my options.

I will be selling my 2011 iMac to help pay for the new one so I can't keep this one. That money has factored into my budget. It's been great but I feel like it drags and hangs with MPE enabled sometimes so I figured a newer computer would help.

Also...SSD. I have read great things from various posts about the Samsung 840 Pro SSD's so I may pick one or two up eventually to supplement or replace my current scratch drive.

I'd love someone to toss out if I should go option #1 or if there's a better Option #2 out there.

Thanks!

Report · Oct 24, 2013

Look at Tweakers Page - What kind of PC to use?

and note how the BFTB ('Bang-for-the-buck') for a MacPro relates to any PC.

Report · Oct 24, 2013

cc_merchant wrote:
Look at Tweakers Page - What kind of PC to use?
and note how the BFTB ('Bang-for-the-buck') for a MacPro relates to any PC.

Thanks cc_merchant and Jim...

Okay, so I read that whole tweakers page and that helps understand certain things especially when you compare it to the older Mac Pro's BFTB. Understand though that I'm looking at a budget of $3300 with a monitor and no experience building any Windows machine. I'm computer savy but not THAT computer savy because I've been in a world of all-in-one's where things are setup for you. So I went to that partpicker website I mentioned above and taking your advice on the Tweakers Page (mostly from the Low-End Warrior build you mentioned) here's what I built having no real idea of what I'm doing but trying my best to pick what "seemed" right and I think I still have a few hundred to spare.

http://pcpartpicker.com/user/SMD/saved/

Thoughts? Now, I haven't added more hard drives because I have my current external HDD (2 x 1.5TB 7200 HDD setup as RAID 0). Its this one with the Thunderbolt adapter... http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/Elite_eSATA

But I guessed on the memory, I guessed on the monitor, I guessed on the case, I guessed on the operating system and I have so many questions about what I just did it's crazy. Like, oh I don't know...would one just buy all those parts and then put it together themselves? And am I missing anything?

The joy of the iMac is it's an all-in-one, so I don't have to worry about stuff. The disadvantage is I can't exactly change things on it except the memory and I had already planned to max it out at 32GB in my Option #1 above.

Please help.

Thanks.

PS. I edit mostly AVCHD right now (up to 1080p60), but plan to incoporate XAVC and XAVC-S stuff soon. I do multicam of no more than 4 cameras (usually 2 or 3). I don't usually render anything. And like I said before, besides straight cuts, I use lots of cross dissolves, warp stabilizers, and the occaisional gaussian blur).

Report · Oct 24, 2013

1. You don't need a separate audio card, audio is included on the motherboard.

2. Do you need wifi on the motherboard? Then look at the P9X79 DeLuxe.

Report · Oct 24, 2013

cc_merchant wrote:
1. You don't need a separate audio card, audio is included on the motherboard.
2. Do you need wifi on the motherboard? Then look at the P9X79 DeLuxe.

Re: #1) Done! No idea about that.

Re: #2) Again, no idea. You tell me, do I need wifi on the motherboard or not? And I don't see that DeLuxe option. I'm just picking things that sound nice outside of what you had for your "Low-End Warrior Setup". I'd honestly rather you tell me what works and what doesn't because again, I have almost no idea here.

Like I said before, I totally guessed on the type of RAM (brand? 1600 vs 1866? etc), the Case (all I knew was to get a Full Tower), the OS (8 vs 8.1 vs. 32bit vs 64bit), and the monitor (comparible to iMac's 27" monitor?) and other things like sound cards and wireless network adapters (of which I may not need apparently). Also, I switched the GPU to the GTX 770 because it's listed on Adobe's supported cards list. Not that the 760 wouldn't work but maybe this one "future proofs" it a bit more and plus most of the footage we handle is 60fps edited and exported at 24fps so according to that Tweaker's link above, a great GPU help. It does have 4GB VRAM instead of 2gb so I don't know what difference that makes but I figure its better. As for "brand" I took a wild guess and went with Gigabyte, not sure if that's good or not. FYI: By comparison the iMac I'm debating has a GTX 780M GPU with 4GB VRAM. You tell me if this was smart. Still under budget.

So many questions remain. cc_merchant, feel free to lay out your wisdom and help me shape my purchase based on what you know. I like hearing things like "don't need that" or switch it out for "this one" instead. If it goes over $3300 by a touch (not too much), that's okay as long as it's gonna be THAT much better than the spec'd out 2013 iMac listed above.

Thx again.

Here's where I stand...

CPU	Intel Core i7-4930K 3.4GHz 6-Core	$573.98
CPU Cooler	Noctua NH-D14 SE2011	$74.99
Motherboard	Asus P9X79-E WS SSI CEB LGA2011	$465.99
Memory	Corsair Vengeance 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR3-1866	$325.68
Storage	Samsung 840 Pro Series 256GB 2.5" SSD	$209.99
	Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM	$59.99
Video Card	Gigabyte GeForce GTX 770 4GB	$447.99
Wireless Network Adapter	Asus PCE-N53 802.11a/b/g/n PCI-Express x1	$32.99
Case	Rosewill BLACKHAWK-ULTRA ATX Full Tower	$189.99
Power Supply	Corsair 860W ATX12V / EPS12V	$166.49
Optical Drive	Asus BW-14D1XT Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer	$88.98
Operating System	Microsoft Windows 8.1 - OEM (64-bit)	$96.99
Monitor	Asus PB278Q 27.0"	$549.9

TOTAL: $3284.03

Any Suggestions? Changes? ....

Report · Oct 25, 2013

Only one drive besides the OS drive? You should have at least one or two more.

http://ppbm7.com/index.php/tweakers-page/84-disk-setup/95-disk-setup

Report · Oct 25, 2013

Peru Bob,

Thanks for your help. I've read that disc setup a couple times and I'm so confused as to what to do. I do know that more discs is necessary based on those conclusions, so maybe a smaller (128GB SSD for the OS/Programs) and several HDD for the rest. Or an additional SSD for the media cache? I get all mixed up because on one hand he says that media cache is accessed a lot so it would benefit from being on a SSD but then in his sample guidelines he always clumps it into what appears to be a HDD setup.

Plus, when it comes down to HDD's I really didn't know whether to choose Barracuda vs Constellation ES3.

Basically I'm literally driving blind here. And to make matters more confusing for me, I had another user on that forum chime in and say that my current setup is more suited for gaming and that for video editing he recommends this setup:

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/1T4Q6

As you can see, nothing on his list is the same. There's no "yeah, what you selected is good, but I think _____ is better". It's a totally different setup most notably 2 AMD video cards (which the Tweaker's page basically said AMD is no recommended). His cards are on Adobe's GPU list (OpenCL) and I've read in some threads that those cards are close to what the 2013 Mac Pro will have (the lower model)...but as you can see I'm all turned around now. Also in his message to me (which I did appreciate) he was trying to point out that I don't have to spend $3300 to get a great system. While that's all great, I have that right now so while my CFO (aka. wife) let's me, I'd like to spend it even if that means getting a few things that are overkill. Today's overkill is tomorrow's standard it seems.

Remember, I have NO experience with any of this stuff since coming from the easy all-in-one iMac world.

Report · Oct 25, 2013

The guy who recommended this:

I had another user on that forum chime in and say that my current setup is more suited for gaming and that for video editing he recommends this setup:
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/1T4Q6

does not know about editing with Premiere Pro and/or computer builds. Several basic flaws in this setup:

Only a quad core locked CPU, so it is hard to overclock.
Only a mid tower and with two crossfire cards in there it will get pretty hot and limit the number of disks you can install.
Only 650 W PSU, which is not enough with those video cards, some hard disks and fans to keep it cool, DVD or BR burner, USB devices, etc.
The video cards are suboptimal at best for Premiere Pro use, not suitable for any CS version and only somewhat usable with CC.
Dual video cards are a waste of money with that CPU.
Only a single HDD next to the boot disk is very restricting.
No mention of a CPU cooler in such a small case.
Only a single 92 mm fan is not enough.

If anything, this guy is a gamer with such a setup.

Report · Oct 25, 2013

cc_merchant wrote:
The guy who recommended this:
I had another user on that forum chime in and say that my current setup is more suited for gaming and that for video editing he recommends this setup:
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/1T4Q6
does not know about editing with Premiere Pro and/or computer builds.

Phew! I was starting to lose my mind. Thank you for clarifying where his flaws were because those were some of the same things I thought when I saw his setup recommendation.

CC_Merchant!!!...you seem very knowledgable with all this. I would love your assement of MY current/updated lineup of parts, etc. seen here:

http://pcpartpicker.com/user/SMD/saved/

NOTES/QUESTIONS:

According to that parts site, it claims the motherboard and case are "not compatible" despite it being the recommended setup on Tweakers link.
The Fractal design case is always listed online as a "Mid-Tower" and thae Tweakers site says "go for a full tower" but then recommends this case.
I took a wild guess on memory. Brand? 1600 vs. 1866? No idea.
OS? I know nothing about windows lately and what works best with Premiere so mine was a total guess.
As I mentioned above, my GPU I bumped up because I do edit 60p AVCHD footage on a 24p timeline with lots of little clips (hundreds) for every project (including a few 2-3 camera multicam sequences).
Regarding the Disc setup...I read the Tweakers page a couple times but I'm still a bit lost as to how to best spend the money given what I do (see the opening two paragraphs in my post #7 in this thread above)
Most of my parts came from either the Low-End Warrior or Warrior list.

You're advice and thoughts are GREATLY appreciated.

Report · Oct 25, 2013

According to that parts site, it claims the motherboard and case are "not compatible" despite it being the recommended setup on Tweakers link.

If you look at the warning at the bottom of the page it says you may need to update the BIOS, before installing an IB-E CPU and that can be problematic if you don't have a SB-E CPU to first update the BIOS.

The Fractal design case is always listed online as a "Mid-Tower" and thae Tweakers site says "go for a full tower" but then recommends this case.

See http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/arc-series/arc-xl

I took a wild guess on memory. Brand? 1600 vs. 1866? No idea.

Example: G.Skill Ripjaws Z 1866. Make sure that it operates at maximum 1.5V and that latencies are around 11 for maximum stability. Faster memory shows a marked increase in price, but only marginal performance gains.

OS? I know nothing about windows lately and what works best with Premiere so mine was a total guess.

I would go for Windows 8.1 Pro 64 OEM.

As I mentioned above, my GPU I bumped up because I do edit 60p AVCHD footage on a 24p timeline with lots of little clips (hundreds) for every project (including a few 2-3 camera multicam sequences).

The GTX 760 seems enough within your budget limits, but you can upgrade to a 770 to be on the safe side. However, without a raid setup (and raid cards are pretty expensive) and overclocking the system it seems somewhat overdone.

Regarding the Disc setup...I read the Tweakers page a couple times but I'm still a bit lost as to how to best spend the money given what I do (see the opening two paragraphs in my post #7 in this thread above)

Constellation ES drives are Enterprise 24/7 class drives that carry a heftier price-tag than consumer disks like the Barracuda line. For large raid arrays, Harm says:

Note that for the parity raid arrays in the Warrior and Monster category, I opted for the much more expensive enterprise 24/7 designed Constellation disks instead of the consumer disks, because of reliability considerations.

Hope this helps.

Report · Oct 25, 2013

Thank you cc_Merchant!

I've made some adjustments and look forward to your input. The appartent incompatiblities of the motherboard/cpu combo as well as the motherboard/case combo that is suggested on that Tweakers page leave me at a bit of a loss on what to do. Advise welcome.

I've gone over budget here in the current setup but as I go down the list I either say "well, I'd rather be safe than sorry" or "that's what's on the tweaker's list so it must be good". And I'm okay with that if it means that it's gonna be WAY better/faster than the iMac I listed in the original post. That's ultimately what it comes down to...otherwise I might as well just stick with that iMac setup (post #1).

I've also updated my disc setup but that's a total guess.

http://pcpartpicker.com/user/SMD/saved/

Report · Oct 24, 2013

I think for any given dollar amount, you can get better performance out of a Windows machine than a Mac, especially if you build it yourself.

The corollary is that for the same performance you get on the Mac, you can easilly spend less money on a Windows machine and use the leftover to buy other gear (or maybe even a new HDTV )

Report · Jan 24, 2014

get an imac thats it i have the same one and it rocks

Imac2013#24gig of ram #128 ssd boot drive # 2gig vram grafics card# i7 3.5 intel # lacie 3 tb for video editing

Report · Jan 25, 2014

I'm not a computer putting together genius myself, but I put together my first one a couple months ago and it's not that big a deal. OP, go for the PC and put it together yourself. The BFTB factor will be far ahead of what you can get from an apple at this price point. If you wanted to spend around 10 grand and get the new Mac Pro that might be a different picture though. But in the $3,000 - $4,000 range Apple is not really competitive, and you are just paying to be lazy.

Report · Mar 22, 2018

I completely understand where you are coming from. I have a lot of friends that are doubtful about switching from Mac to PC. But once they see the performance on the PC they are blown away.

Here's my recommendation:

Custom (mid tower desktop) from digital storm.

GPU: Atleast a GTX 1070

CPU: atleast i7 7700K preferably a i7 8700K

Memory: at least 16gb. 32Gb is really where you should be.

Storage: investing in a 1TB SSD is expensive but it's worth it if it is to far out of your budget get a 1TB HDD and anything above or at 128Gb SSD for a boot will be great.

Benefits:

You can always upgrade your RAM or GPU and even your CPU if your up for it. For example if you noticed 5 years that the application was requiring more buy a new card and swap it out. Instead of buying a whole new computer! This should be all in your budget. If you do get this computer with the options I said you will be flying through premiere and nothing will stop you. Hope this helps!

Report · Mar 23, 2018

Did you realize that this thread is over 4 years old?

Report · Mar 23, 2018

Nope Haha. Responded to this last night after a long night of editing was even looking at dates.