Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 MKV support?

Report · Aug 01, 2008

Is there any way to get Adobe Premiere to support MKV files or it simply just doesn't support it?

Report · Aug 01, 2008

Cheers
Eddie

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Report · Aug 01, 2008

That kinda didn't help... It mentioned nothing about MKV files and whoever wrote that just called everyone an idiot instead of admitting the deficiencies of the program.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

I thought it answered the question very well, even without specifically referencing .mkv files.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

> whoever wrote that just called everyone an idiot instead of admitting the deficiencies of the program.

How right he was and how wrong are you calling it deficiencies. You obviously don't know the program, nor it's intended use. Anyone using an obscure wrapper like Matroska better use freeware or shareware to edit, not a professional program.

Report · Aug 14, 2009

Harm Millaard.... that's a pretty ignorant post. You do know that Matroska is being used by consumers (with over 40+ million downloads), as well as being used by CE companies like LG, Panasonic, Mitsubishi, Western Digital, Sigma Designs, DivX just to name a few. In production is being used for Film Daily's, TV Series Tagging and Storage, Movie Production, Content delivery, again... just to name a few.

My point is get the facts straight as its far from obsure (imho)... and adding to to APP is a must.

Report · Aug 14, 2009

You do know that Matroska is being used by consumers (with over 40+ million downloads)

That is why PR does not support it. PR is for professional formats and PE is more suited for consumers.

Report · Aug 14, 2009

its far from obsure (imho).

I would have to disagree. In the overall world of video, Matroska is extraordinarily rare compared to other file formats like .avi, mov, the various MPEGs and even .mxf. It's but a tiny blip on the video radar.

Report · Aug 14, 2009

I should have clarified the point I meant "imho" is from a design perspective it has always been made for 'professionals' (Some of us are in the production field for broadcast TV) and with 3 years since our last release is Matroska 1.0 is pretty bullet proof in it's design and flexability. We do have a ways to go before we release 2.0 with better support for streaming and more advance menu support, but we do not want to hurt its current adoption rate and hence that we feel that is way past time for Premiere to support it.

We invite discusions on the opportunity and would even dedicate an engineer to make this happen. If anyone wants to see the technical side of Matroska, visit here: http://www.matroska.org/technical/index.html

Report · Aug 14, 2009

We invite discusions on the opportunity and would even dedicate an engineer to make this happen.

Other than for the edification of us "users," this forum would likely not be the best place to hold the discussion. Adobe presence here is very limited, if it exists at all. However, we users can always stand to be educated. We may find benefits from using MKV, or, as the poster who reopened this thread did, may find that one, or more, of our clients requests it.

Many here handle the entire workflow and in so doing, determine the delivery package to their clients. Some, however, receive material, edit it, and then hand it off to someone else. These would be the most likely candidates, but the dictate for format comes from their clients, or from the next person in the production chain.

Most of us here are always ready to learn something new. Heck, there was a time that I did not know what JPEG2000 was, not that I use it much, even today. DNG was once a new format to me. Many of the newer Video formats and CODEC's are still not part of my vernacular - yet, but then I don't encounter them away from the forum.

I've read some articles on MKV, but have yet to grasp how it could help me. I feel that others are in the same boat. Can you give an abstract, that could give us "pointers" on the benefits?

Hunt, always curious

[Edit] As one who knows MKV, do you have any recommendations on how the poster, who re-opened this thread can best get their material into MKV format for delivery to their client? I made one rec., but it was based on suggestions in other fora and might not be the best route. Your assistance would be greatly appreciated.

PS in the edit of this post, it looks like I may have lost the block quoted text. If so, it should read "We invite discusions on the opportunity and would even dedicate an engineer to make this happen."

[Edit 2] Yep - block quote gone, but material still there. The first line of this post is the quote from the post to which I am replying - not my words, but another poster's. May have fixed it now. Or made it so ugly that no one will even bother with it...

Message was edited by: the_wine_snob Added [Edit] and PS

Report · Aug 14, 2009

Thanks Wine Snob for your assistance.

Sorry I reignited an old debate. My 2 cents is I think it comes down to the difference between production formats and delivery formats. A professional producer wouldn't use DVD source material to edit (well, unless really hard pressed!) but it's quite reasonable for a professional producer to want to export to DVD as a delivery format since that is a format that consumers can use. Or perhaps a more apt example would be the fact that Premiere Pro allows me to export 3GP files for mobile devices, definitely a consumer format that should never be imported for editing, but very useful to have available.

From what I read, Matroska is intended as an end-user format - not intended to be re-edited, but I am told it gives high quality playback, e.g. for HD digital theatre. (I will find out for myself soon.) I don't think it's mainstream at all, but if it becomes more widespread, I think it would be reasonable for Adobe to add it to Media Encoder as an export option.

Report · Aug 14, 2009

Sorry I reignited an old debate.

Let's change that to "an old discussion."

I only wish that I had more options for a converter. As I have never worked in this format, I cannot give you "first-hand" user info - only what I have read from others.

Fortunately for me, the only oddities are usually with regard to the Assets that I get handed. They are always "the ONLY copy of that file on earth... " Most of my delivery is straight forward - produce an SD DVD-Video. That's why I know almost nothing on MKV, but am always ready to learn.

I should have had the good sense to ask the poster, who recently responded to this thread for recs. on a converter/encoder for you. I assume that he/she at least has ties to MKV, so should also have knowledge of the best way to help you. I see that I need to make an [Edit] to one of my Replies, if still possible.

Good luck, and please update this thread with what you find works best. Someday, someone will benefit, especially if MKV becomes more mainstream, as some hope.

Hunt

Report · Aug 14, 2009

Ha! Yes "discussion" wouldbe the friendlier term.

Like you I actually often need to deal with less-than-ideal source material (if it's a rare enough shot, I'll try to make it work.) Luckily in this case the source is great; it's just the delivery format I'm unfamiliar with. But I'm used to working on the bleeding edge, so I'm happy to be a guinea pig, try stuff out and repost my findings.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

... What do you mean better use freeware or shareware to edit? Since when is it correct for a professional program not to support formats that freeware would support? What's wrong with the MKV format, I don't get it... Is it a crime to get a program to support more formats? The more formats it supports, the better it is. I just didn't like that the response was a smart-ass answer instead of directly answering to me how to get Premiere CS3 to support MKV/whether it's impossible.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

OK, the short answer is it is impossible.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

Most encoding software usually loads all the decoders installed on the computer. For that reason, Video Cleaner Pro for example can encode MKV files. Is there a way to do such a thing as that in Premiere CS3 and if not, may I ask you, why? Considering the fact that you say IT'S CORRECT for the program not to support certain formats with some lame excuse.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

There are a lot of formats that are not appropriate for Premiere Pro. Some should be included, some perhaps not.

The main goal of Premiere Pro is to edit video imported or captured directly from a video camera.

There are no video cameras at this time that use the Matroska format.

Hence, it would be inappropriate for the codec to be added to Premiere Pro until after all of the other codecs that cameras actually use are included.

Make sense?

Besides, that format is not designed to be edited, merely played back to be watched.

artofzootography.com

Report · Aug 01, 2008

Well. The designed or not designed to be edited doesn't matter. You can say that about most formats. I guess the camera thing makes sense. Although that's really just an indirect Adobe excuse for not needing to create support to many additional formats. That's also kinda bogus though because many times if you want to edit some video from camera, you'd want to import some clips you might have of some cartoon if its a clip for a baby's birthday or something. That's very common so that's what I'm saying. It wouldn;t be wrong for it to support those formats or to have a feature to import decoders on the computer already.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

I didn't say it would be wrong, just expensive. You are the only person to ever ask for it. Therefore, I doubt that it is appropriate to take all that time to code in a new codec for one person.

If enough people asked for it, then that would be different.

artofzootography.com

Report · Aug 01, 2008

David,

Adobe cannot possibly cover every possible file format. Photoshop has slowly added formats, as their use has increased to the point that it makes it sensible to do so. The same for Premiere, but it has been slower, as file formats in video seem to fade very rapidly.

The Matroska format is meant as a delivery format. Delivery formats are usually not meant to be edited. If a broad enough base of cameras used this format, pressure would be applied to Adobe to include it. Now, Premiere does not handle DivX, VidX, Vivio, and a host of other formats, regardless of which CODECs are installed on a system. Even Premiere's little brother Elements, a consumer application, does a poor job with many consumer formats, other than DV-AVI. It has real problems with .MOD files, and there are at least two popular camera companies, whose consumer models use this format.

There are many camera formats that are also not supported, yet. I'd think that Adobe would be putting their resources to work on them first, depending on how large each format's user-base is.

Give it time. If it becomes popular, then maybe Elements will incorporate it into its list of supported formats, but I'll bet not before they handle .MOD files.

I do not even know if any of my file converters handle .MKV files.

Hunt

Report · Aug 01, 2008

If you check any AMV forum, you'd see A LOT of requests for MKV support.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

>Since when is it correct for a professional program not to support formats that freeware would support?

Professional products being limited to professional assets is quiet common. There are a host of audio and video hardware that will only accept signals from a professional connection - like XLR for audio or BNC from video. I don't find it at all surprising that a professional NLE acts much the same way, working only with more professional media.

>The designed or not designed to be edited doesn't matter.

It actually does, from a software programming standpoint.

>you'd want to import some clips you might have of some cartoon if its a clip for a baby's birthday or something.

Most people doing those kinds of home videos are probably using Premiere Elements anyway. It's more oriented towards the non-professional.

>What's wrong with the MKV format, I don't get it

Then you would fall under the category of non-professional as described in the link supplied by Eddie, and should probably follow the advice given for such. Doing so doesn't make you an idiot, it just means you're untrained. And the easiest method for the untrained to achieve their goal is to use other, more consumer oriented software.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

I know well that these forums are no real place to discuss out feature wish-list for Premiere, but high on this list (for me) is native AviSynth input support. There is a plugin available, but built-in support would be better and more stable. (After Effects CS3 has it: Why not Premiere?)

AviSynth can be the vehicle by which almost any other format can be imported, including MKV.

David -- If you're already AviSynth savvy (and if you're into AMV then you probably should be), then this will be no problem for you. I believe you can simply create a script like...
DirectShowSource("filename.mkv")
... and import that into PPro with the avs import plugin above.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

Thank you Dan Isaacs. NOW THERE'S AN ANSWER!

Jim Simon - I know it matters in the programming standpoint, clearly. What I meant was that no matter what the format was designed for, the goal of editing software should be to be able to edit the video. I understand what's being said about MKV but I was getting angry that I wasn;t getting an answer like the one above.

Report · Aug 01, 2008

>What I meant was that no matter what the format was designed for, the goal of editing software should be to be able to edit the video.

But if the format wasn't designed with editing in mind, it makes it that much harder to design software that can edit it.