Legacy Title: Why are you still using it?

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hello fellow editors. I know that a lot of us are still using the Legacy Titler for our titling duties in Premiere Pro.

While "change" is never fun, my impression is that some people just have not taken the time to learn or become fluid or fluent with the tools, and that's understandable.

I've found the new title tools pretty compelling. I've swtiched to them. I found that some people are not even aware of the tools or how they function. Surprisingly, making a simple .mogrt is something many have not even tried. Sound familiar? No problem, here's the documentation.

Please respond here as to why you are using Legacy Titler below and I will pass along the feedback to the Premiere Pro team. Not here to judge, just to provide good feedback. 

Thanks in advance for your feedback.

Kevin

[R Neil Haugen]

Hey, totally agree on the Encore bit. That was a lot easier to use than most others. And you're also pretty accurate on the whole archival thing. Bit of a problem there ... ahem.

As to the Titles thing ... actuully, the EGP and mogrts work quite well with that by design. You can organize your CC Libraries and Local Folder storage, and grab mogrts from there across projects.And if you work in Productions mode like I do, you can simply drag anything from one project to another. Open a sequence with something on it you want, drag/drop it onto a different open sequence.

Personally, I don't understand why so many people still work in stand-alone old style projects.

Neil

[JOHN MONDO]

Neil, my only problem with that is the incredibly clunky media browser that's built into Premiere. Perhaps if they update that so it can read as quickly as finder or explorer? I'm obviously not working in production mode.

[JOHN MONDO]

Oh and I just had a look at Productions and I'll be using it from now on. Basically saves you from creating template projects and makes it very quick to access old projects. My only question - why only for Premiere - why not After Effects as well?

[Peru Bob]

 why only for Premiere - why not After Effects as well?

By @JOHN MONDO

You can post a feature request here:

https://adobe-video.uservoice.com/forums/911311-after-effects

[edwardc41603475]

Becuae its simple and it works for my needs for creating rolling credits and simple titles with strokes.

It takes too long to do the same thing with graphics.

Why not have both.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi edward,

Becuae its simple and it works for my needs for creating rolling credits and simple titles with strokes.

It takes too long to do the same thing with graphics.

Why not have both.

Let the product team know your thoughts. I agree that rolls and crawls are harder to do. https://adobe-video.uservoice.com/forums/911233-premiere-pro/suggestions/34577332-please-do-not-elim...

Thanks,
Kevin

[bruces96534395]

Thanks Kevin, but I can't imagine that you don't know that essential graphics is not even close to as good as legacy title. 

It's like trying to convice us that we should replace our LED lights with a karoene lamp. Yes we can all learn to fill and light the lamp, but why in the heck would we? .  

[R Neil Haugen]

As someone who started of course before the "Legacy Titler" was "legacy" ... I'm interested in rather more a specific answer than a generalization.

I haven't needed to use the Legacy for some time, personally. And thankfully we've got the capability in the EGP now to generate all sorts of shapes and round corners and what not.

So ... specifically, so it is USEFUL to people like the developers ... what is missing in the EGP, or is slower? That is useful data.

Neil

[Zeppedeus van Hoygsma]

I posted this before and never got an answer. The old title tool let you add depth to the font, which is important for Japanese and probably Chinese subtitles. I'm winging it at the moment with a non-blurry shadow, but it's not the same.

Also, the new title tool makes it reeeeeally easy to accidentally change the size by double clicking on a given title and then somehow making it smaller or bigger. Just a few percent, but it happened to me on a regular basis. So I'm using the new title tool but still not liking it for the most part.

[R Neil Haugen]

Thanks for the post! There's so many ways to use any tool in these apps, and everyone does everything differently as far as I can tell. So it's always good to know exactly what and how we all work with things.

I think I understand what you mean, though I never used that much on the old Titler. The rock-hard-edge shadow, right?

Neil

[Zeppedeus van Hoygsma]

I posted a screenshot before, I have to find it again (not on my computer now to check the correct name of that particular thing).

Something like outer/inner strokes, and you could choose depth, bevel and another one. I did it so often that I never looked at the words again...

[Ann Bens]

Yes I miss that too: inner, outer, depth, edge and drop face.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Some Friday fun: This thing in Premiere was so much better than the Media Composer or FCP "Classic" Titling tools. FAR beyond. I think that's why Apple licensed the "Boris Title 3D" Titler - cause their stuff was kinda weak. I had no idea about Premiere Pro at the time, early 2000s.

Zach King tutorial - used to be Final Cut King, became popular on Vine. Now he's huge on YouTube. Here he is showing Title 3D.

[R Neil Haugen]

Ah, yes, that!

I never used it much, but I can see how it would be spiffier than cat's paws for some things.

Neil

[Warren Heaton]

I'm not sure if this information is helpful or not:  Going back to Premiere 3.0, I've always made titles in Photoshop, Illustrator, and/or After Effects.  

[shooternz]

Long time fan and advocate for the Legacy Titler but I have been away from Premiere for about five years and things have happened.

Thought I better give Essential Graphics a  fairtrial run and explore and see how it would have fitted into my well established work flows...mostly in the post production of TV Commmercial spots. ie graphic and images.

I usually worked with a client art director/ designer in the room at this point FWIW

So a basic easy start...how do I get super imposed  letters over my video frame?

From the Edit Work space I simply select the T Icon and click it on the Program Monitor.

Yes I can type on Text and it appears directly on the sequence above my video frame. So far so good.

Now I need attributes for the text so ...I guess I open Essential Graphics Pane...Whats this. BROWSE TEMPLATES...huh?...art director looks at me!!!

Oh...there is an EDIT Button...oh...ok....Yep ...confusing...but that works

Now I probably need some controls...EFX Control Window and keyframes maybe. Yep that works.

Ok leave it there for now and do the next graphic...and so on...

Thing is...where is my Title Asset in the Project when we want to revisit, duplicate, modify, do an alternative based on same title, use in an alternative edit/ project....... Reveal in Project (greyed out)

Might have missed something...but I never had a graphic I could not achieve in Premiere Legacy, Photoshop,, AEFX from a blank video frame.

Maybe I am too Legacy myself to work without assets in Bins or Project but it was common for me to stack graphics, titles, logos all from different asests and sources.  PSDs, AEX, PNG, Premiere Titler...etc

Question...why is it called ESSENTIAL GRAPHICS? Meaningless to me.

[Warren Heaton]

If we use Graphics > Upgrade to Source Graphics then the Graphic behaves like any source clip, including being in the Project tab or Bin tab as well as any edits made to the Source Geaphic showing in any instances of it.

[R Neil Haugen]

You can do pretty much most of that, but yea, it's not nearly as obvious as before. Natuarally, @Ann Bens is a great resource ... I believe you two know each other 'here' ... lol

I think the biggest problem is it doesn't work in general with graphics stored in a project bin. And for so many projects, that's a handy workflow. Especially when you archive the project at the end of it.

You organize your graphics in the EGP ... you can set it to 'browse' your CC libraries, Adobe stock, or "Local files". CC libraries are great for deploying graphics, but not so easy for basic projects. So store the graphics you create in the "Local Folders" ... and just set that to a folder in the place you're storing your media/other project assets.

So ... you can use "local storage" option and just view/organize your graphics in their folder in the EGP, then of course ... they're actually 'living' with your other project assets so they get copied/moved with the rest of the project.

There are two text entry options: box and point. Box ... click the T, drag a "bounding box", and then click inside to type. Your text is limited to being seen within the box, and will auto-wrap. But you can select and animate box contents to scroll down/sideways within the box.

Point means just click on the monitor & start typing. Your text will go out to the right from there, and you need to 'organize' it by the way you type, and placement. For some things this is faster, for others, a box is best.

The EGP layer stack is the same as other Adobe apps. So ... you create text, shapes, whatnot, and the way you stack them creates the order of what's 'on top' and what's underneath.

Any item can be animated by itself, of course.

Grouping elements in the layer stack means you can then animate that group together.

And they've given us nearly all the keyboard shortcuts from the old Titler panel so working is a lot better than it was. You need to go into the key-shorts dialog and actually set a preferred key-short for most of them, but they are available.

Neil

[AnnikaKoenig]

Hi shooternz!

I'm a Quality Engineer that works on the Essential Graphics features. You are correct that for regular Premiere titles there is no project item in the Project panel. There are three things you can do for finding/reusing your graphics:

1. Turn your "regular" graphic into a source graphics. These behave very similar to Legacy Titles in the sense that you will get a project item and all instances used from that project item will be dependent on each other (change one will change the others). In order to accomplish this select the track item, go to the top Graphics and Titles menu and select "Upgrade to Source Graphic". 
2. Use the Graphics tab in the Text panel. Here you see a running list of all the text that is used in your sequence. It has search and replace functionality as well as spellcheck. 
3. Create templates and reuse them over and over by dragging them on the timeline. To do so select the track item, go to the top Graphics and Titles menu and select "Export as Motion Graphics template". As you wrote: "Whats this. BROWSE TEMPLATES...huh?...art director looks at me!!!" ...that's what that is, it's the place where you can find all your templates. Even though you never created a template the Browser is not empty. That's just to give users a head start and see what they could look like.

Let's keep up the dialog,

Annika

[R Neil Haugen]

Annika,

The problem with not getting 'regular' graphics into the Project panel/bins is rather straightforward ... and it's frustrating that three years in we still haven't had this fixed.

In most professional work, you create graphics that are used 1) ONLY for that client and 2) ONLY for that job.

If that job comes back, for re-work or reuse, you need those graphics. And you need them quickly to hand with that project.

If not, you don't want to keep them ... they clutter everything up.

So storing graphics in the project panel bins is really both useful and necessary. Especially for 'archiving' projects.

The 'create master graphics' option is not a full substitute. In any way, shape, or form. Why?

Take lower thirds. You may have 50 different ones based on a style in a sequence. As you have interviewed a ton of people. So let's try the Master Graphic ... ah, OOPS!!!!!

Every one of those 50 different lower thirds, with all the names spelled correctly, is now screwed up. And if you change any of them, you still screw up every other one.

And there's no way to simply upgrade say the color for part of that lower third for all of the graphics while keeping the names. You have to rebuild every freaking one of them.

The only workaround is to set your graphics to be stored in a "Local Folder" and set the physical folder on-disc to within the folder-tree for project assets. At least then if you simply copy the disc folder to archive, you get the graphics.

But you don't see them when you reload the project of course. Especially if you removed unused local folder links. Or something in their location name is not exactly the same. You probably have to add their folder back into the "Local folders" setup.

And ... if you archive projects with the Project manager, this doesn't work because it doesn't copy the items in that graphics folder as it doesn't see them as belonging to that project.

So ... allowing us to us bins rather than Local Folders or CC Libraries would really make most projects work a lot easier.

And CC Librarires are great for sharing graphics ... great for deploying graphics to a team. Lousy for profesional workflow for different projects for different clients.

Neil

[Ann Bens]

You are correct that for regular Premiere titles there is no project item in the Project panel.

By @AnnikaKoenig

I do like the Ess Graphics more and more, but having to convert every title you make into a Source graphic is a bit of a pain.

Should be an automated feature.