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R. Neil Haugen wrote:
coroner ...
"When a company casts aside a portion of their customer base and ignores their business $ there is little doubt for many they could do it again on another issue..."
as you seem SO certain of and horrified about ... Adobe's bottom-line profits dip for a bit, what in the world is it of concern to you? You clearly are shouting you hate them ... the evil money-grubbing secret-stealing hacks! So, I'd think you'd be thrilled to sit back and chuckle about their imminent demise. You KNOW this model can't work and is going to break them.
Or are you really afraid it's going to work out just fine in the end for them? Either way, it will be more amusing to me to listen to the worries, frights, and concerns of the folks screaming of the horrors of the cloud than about anything else out there.
Because no matter what Adobe decides to do at any time, I and the others choosing to utilize their products will always have our own options separate from Adobe. Just as you do. Wow. Did you know there are alternate programs for every single one of the video related programs they have? That many top-line pros actually ... I know this may be a shock ... don't even USE Adobe software.
Go figure ...
Neil
Next time read my posts. I'm not shouting I hate them. I'm shouting what they don't want to hear - That I'm willing to pay them, as many others are, 2x the original cost of the perpetual license to get non subscription software. You see, I want to pay them more $ than I would pay them via subscription.
The major problem with Adobe is that they told their customer base they were all about CHOICE and then with CC they took CHOICE away.
Oh I know about alternative programs. I've already purchased Edius. Just finishing up two long projects already started in CS6.
Andy,
Your arguments and comments are based several things. First, on presumptions of another group's future behavior ... which is, as we all know, a heavily fact-based way to argue a point. Right! 
Especially from someone who is far removed from those who will make the decisions over time, and has clearly ideas of the World and Humanity which seem to be different than those other humans who are going to ... over time ... and in varying arrays of individuals involved ... make those decisions. It's such a solid, tight basis for an argument. In this thread, I've used the term "argument" as meaning something used in a rhetorical discussion, not something used because of being angry or upset. Just ... a rhetorical argument. Please do understand that.
But in any rhetorical training I've been through, suppositions about future behaviors by other unknown persons are not considered "facts". In any way, shape, or form.
Next, you seem to have a very strong personal feeling against renting or leasing. Fine. I've known many people who feel just like you do. In many cases, renting costs more over time, and purchasing a "finite" product is more advantageous. Yes, more people choose to buy a car rather than lease one. Which doesn't say anything at all about the reasons, many very valid, for when leasing makes as much or more sense. I've got acquiantances who are going to always be in a newer car, and fairly nice one at that. Period. It's the way they like to live. They see no reason to buy and sell, since they'll always be turning their cars over in a couple years anyway. Leasing works perfectly for them. For us, we like nice transportation but at a lower cost ... so we tend to buy 2-3 year old vehicles and sell them between 8-10 years. Leasing a car isn't out best option currently, but I don't rule out that I would never lease a car.
For many businesses, leasing an asset like a car or truck or ditch-digging equipment makes a LOT more sense than owning the thing. Most contractors around here don't own a backhoe, for instance; they rent by the day. Why? Blame things are spendy and it would be stupid to pay all that money for something they use a couple days a month, maybe up to 10 days in a busy month. At what point does it make sense for them to buy such a tool? For many contracting businesses, they don't buy major tools, as it gives them a definitive cost-per-job to lease/rent as needed. Direct expensing on tax reports and financial statements. Whether or not it "sounds smart" to you is completely irrelevant. It's smart to them. And very common.
So just because you don't like renting or leasing is irrlelevant to whether or not it is a viable or at times even preferable option for other people. Renting and leasing all sorts of things are both here to stay. And valued by many for parts of their lives or their businesses.
My "emotionally charged" comments are becuase I'm laughing so hard at times. Not to be mean, but ... wow. And no, my comment about survival had actually nothing to do with survival. Maybe you missed something there ...
And next ... Yea, you've got "const control" with a perpetual license ... for a product about two generations out of date. Enjoy it all you want, no one is standing in your way. It's your choice, mon ami, you know? You're welcome to stay back with that version, as it was offered with a perp license. But there's nothing anywhere that says every company has to continue doing business the same fashion in which they started forever. And either way, if you choose to come up to a newer product, you'll have to pay something to someone. I'm choosing to stay with the newer product, so of course I'll have to pay one way or the other.
I cheer for reactionary behavior? Wow. I plan more than most people, I've had this business for 35+ years and we would not have survived had we not been able to plan and follow through better than most people. However, I know darn well that NO one sees the future too well. Even most science fiction writers were blindsided by the sudden creation and over-whelming use of cell-phones. All their books ... many scrupulously thought through ... of life in the future, and they didn't see that coming. All the time some of those authors spent with physicists and engineers and cosmologists to "see" what The Future might hold ... and before we even got near that Future, they got blasted with cell phones in current use.
So, you who knows the future, tell me exactly what your next NLE is going to cost you ... and the precise date you'll buy it ... or do you plan to use an already 2-year old program 20 years from now?
No, I don't need a lot of convincing as to how un-intimidated I feel. But every argument you've used is based on the ability of Adobe and the NSA (which you've somehow conflated) to coerce behavior out of their (supposedly tiny) remaining user-base. And therefore, as I'm one of that user-base, me. That I'll be forced to pay outrageous amounts ... that at some point I'll suddenly never be able to use my own files ever again ... that everything I do, say, and create is certain fodder for the NSA in their devious plot to apparently steal ideas and content and portrait-client videos to push American business interests. That one's a bit of a stretch, but well ... you've made it clear you know this to be the case. Of course, as I am an American, apparently the NSA is going to steal my little videos to push ... oh wait, that's kind of ... convoluted. Huh. Well, something you're sure I won't like. Right.
And as someone who's been in business coming close to 40 years, I've seen little and massive recessions, interest rates from 25% to 1.2%, unemployment from 22% to 2.5%, and noticed that these things are predictable only in that the present is never the future, and business cycles will cycle through. No matter what one does, one does need to move with the flow as things go by. No one knows exactly how long any growth period will last, nor the date of the next downturn, nor the date of the upturn ... nor what industries will take hits unforeseen by nearly any anlyst (as always happens).
My peers in the portrait photog business that did not do so as well over the last decade as my wife and I are now doing things like driving city buses, working in call-centers and such not. People who'd had good businesses with very good incomes much larger than ours for 20 years and more. But the last ten years have so changed the portrait-photo market that few studios make a good living as many of us used to. No one had predicted such a massive loss of that trade. Not until it was well underway, and by then, it was too late for many businesses.
We had to change everything about our business, our products, our model, and our very idea of what our business was about at heart to STAY in business. If we didn't have a better-than-average ability to react to changing situations, we wouldn't BE in business. Because it isn't just "predictable costs" that matters, even though our ability to reduce and control costs has been part of what kept us in business. You've got to be doing a business that clients want NOW, not one that could sell ten years ago. And at times, in business, one gets blindsided. You try to hold this down as much as possible, but it will happen. And if you can't react, if you can't roll with it and come up still selling to a willing clientele, you're hosed. Find a way to turn troubles into possibilities. Do some head-scratching.
We work hard to plan and plan well, and to work a plan over time. We also know we have to constantly revise the plans based on many factors well beyond the ability to plan or predict. Such as client tastes for photo-imaging products. Wow, the last 35 years have seen some swings and changes. Photographer-client relationships ... um ... vastly different now than even ten years ago. One used to need to cultivate one's Professional Status in the community. Now ... one needs to become friendly on one's blog and other online presences where your potential clients might see you, because they aren't going to be coming to you because you've been a stable business and constant award-winning artist: they'll come because your pics look good and well, it seems like you'd be nice or fun to work with.
Those changes that I'm reacting to include the need to introduce video products, and mixed stills/video products into our studio. Not currently because we'll sell big dollar amounts of video footage, but because by offering and featuring those products, we'll get people in the door ... who'll then still buy our wall prints and groupings and albums. This is how a lot of the successful portrait studios market these days. The guy that most predicted this would come ... and that only about three years back ... was thought nuts. The lone voice in the wilderness. But it's here now. So we adapt. We react. And our business survives.
As it will in the future, both planned and un-predicted. What's Adobe going to do with their pricing? Not a huge concern. With their model? Not a huge concern. If it becomes in my interest to jump to a different "brand", fine. I've done it before, will certainly do it again. And in the meantime, I do so enjoy the direct-link over to Speedgrade for grading, the similar link to Ae for graphics and some other things ... Audition for sound if needed (not often, but hey, it's there and I've used it) and Encoder to prep for delivery. Getting more into both Story and Prelude because I'm learning how to use them to get a better focused control of my projects with them. Life's good.
And of course, I do let 'em know when I've hit a bump with their software. And also when it's been great for me. Which is is the vast majority of the time.
Neil
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I know darn well that NO one sees the future too well
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In New Hyde Park, NY , on Jericho Turnpike, there is a palm reader. It's a mother and daughter who live in an apartment on the 2nd floor of a little building and the ground floor has the magical palm reading room they use. It is across the street from a bar that recently burned down ..but a few years ago it was more than a hot spot... it was the neighborhood old man bar... shots and beers and nothing fancy.
One patron of the bar ( a regular ) happened to be moseying past the palm reader across the street on his way to the bar.. and said hello to the mother and daughter who were sitting on folding chairs on the sidewalk on front of their palm reading shop. It was really hot out and humid. He asked them, " Why are you sitting out here in the heat ? " They replied, " The electricity went out and there is no AC ". He looked at the shop window with all the astrological symbols and the palm reading ads which proclaimed magical powers and back to the mother and daughter.
He asked them, " Didn't you see that coming ? "
most science fiction writers were blindsided by the sudden creation and over-whelming use of cell-phones
" Didn't you see that coming ? "
Good one Rodney.
Hunt
If you like the cloud, and it works for you, you don't need to be on this thread. Your comments are irrelevant.Are you serious!. Very open minded of you to call anyones opinions "irrelevant".
Do you work for the government?
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"Noise"...yep..I am part of the noise. Forums are a conversation and reading and responding is how that works.
I am largely here for the entertainment since the arguments have long since been exhausted.
FWIW - I have never argued for against the CC model and never tried tro convince anyone either way. ( I dont care ).
I do enjoy arguing the arguments those.
So you don't care. You're here for the entertainment.
Great... that really helps.
Thank you for that. And you want me to think your comments are relevant?
I simply want Adobe to offer a perpetual license.
It really doesn't need any more discussion.
Why else would Adobe not want to please everyone by offering subscriptions and perpetual licenses side-by-side?
One possibility is that's it's just not practical. They tried offering both with CS6, and we subscribers really got nothing new (at least for PP) during that period, which is really the key benefit of the subscription model.
Then the perpetual was dropped, and we've now had three feature updates in less than a year. 
My point was that they will know that, after they have tried do it themselves once.
If only that were so...
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