full quality screen shoot of my view

Hi

Thanks for the files. One of your documents is in sRGB the other in CMYK (GRACol_20006_Coated1v2)

Both how the color shift in Photoshop's on screen preview when merging the spot color channels. At first I suspected that the change might be due to the spot colour being out of the gamut of the document profile. However, in the sRGB document, the colours used appear to be in gamut and the color shift in the on screen preview was quite substantial between before and after merging.

I'll tag a couple of the forums colour experts to see if they can shed any light on this @D Fosse @TheDigitalDog 

Dave

here are 4 project files 2 for coconut project and 2 for orange project... for testing i painted full contrast circles in chanels to show you how big diference merging chanels will create

I do merge theese chanels with this dropdown menu

Hi 

There is still insufficient information in your screenshots to show exactly what is happening. Can you attach two PSD files, the first immediately before the merge that shifts colours, the second immediately after and I will take a look when I get back to my office this evening. Crop them to remove any intellectual property, I am only interested in the color change.

Dave

for example i recreated something that seems almost simular to how it was before merging that pantone spot chanel...
needed diferent colors for diferent colors for places where was diferent amounts of that dark green pantone color... but why should i be editing it by my eye when i could just take screen shots which would be simular to how it looks like before... (but i am expectation that photoshop shows it correctly before merging chanels)

this will show better what is happening
when i merge only 317C that collor is fine... but when i merge 7474C that makes the visible diference

Hello,

so i will try again... i for example i have 2 pantone spot chanels... and as i expect when viewing project with theese pantone chanels it should be shown correctly... and i also expect when i merge chanels to rgb it is not correct... i would love to get the same resolut which was before the merging becouse i expecting that is correct... i can get the same resolut of colors which i saw before (expecting that is correct) with print screen... but i would need to merge multiple printscreens to get correct quality.

But if you tell me that photoshop showing the colors wrong allready before merging pantone chanels than it would be diferent story.

picture below shows compareson before and after merging spot chanels to rgb (when i take screenshoot it shows the diference... (both screenshots are png - RGB - so there is color possibility to get the resolut using RGB)) - (i tryed editing merged image so that i would get correct somewhat simular resolut to how it looks like before merging chanels... so there is possibility in RGB colorspace to get the colors which were shown before - but it takes so much time and it must be manualy done for every single project... would be faster to do multiple screenshoot and manualy merging them into one - but still my case is based on my expectation that adobe displaying pantone spot chanels corectly)

theese are the 2 pantone colors

I was not tallking more about blender becouse my issue is not about final product but about preparing the texture(material)... (i would like to have correct texture before using blender) i know that final product will have again diferent color becouse of multiple reasons as you said...
And also if someone is creating fake 3D with photoshop they will have the same issue. While preparing textures

answares to your 1. point:
1) yes they are spot colors.
2) do not know what do you mean by document profile... i have RGB mode if that is what you ment
3) I had not checked real pantone swatches with what i see on my display. I am expecting when photoshop uses pantone spot chanels it calculating the color correctly... is not he ?

answares to your 2. point:

1) yes the color shift happend when i convert pantone spot colors to my document color space as you can see on screenshot higher

2) i did not checked if spot colours are actually within the gamut of your document space? but my screenshoot shows the diference between before and after merging pantone chanels... so png - rgb can reproduce the color which i saw before merging

answares to your 3. point:
do not wory about blender... that was just info for what i am using final export from photoshop... and why i would like to merge pantone chanels to rgb color space.

thanks a lot for your time... and again sory for my bad english 🙂

Hi

You have introduced all kinds of additional variants into your question and in your workflow. So step by step:

1. You mention using Pantone colours in Photoshop and Illustrator. Are these spot channels? What is the document profile? Do they look similar to your printed swatches at that initial stage?  Note : A screen and a printed Pantone swatch - designed for a specific media type are not going to look identical, on is emmisive one is reflective, but can look close with correct lighting on the swatch and a correctly calibrated and profiled screen, set up for matching output.

2. You mention merging channels - are you converting the spot channels into your document colour space at that stage and is that where you see the colour shift?  Did you check whether the spot colours are actually within the gamut of your document space? If they can't be contained in the document colour space then you are indeed going to see a shift.

3. You mention using the colours in Blender, and I asssume you mean as material colours, but have not mentioned how you have Blender set up for colour management. Blender does not use ICC colour profiles but, as default (you have not mentioned setting up Blender for ACES so I assume you are using it as default), expects sRGB in the Base Color channel and raw/non colour in the other material channels (Metal, Roughness, Displacement and Normal).  How are you generating the other channels? Roughness and specular will both influence the look of a colour at render time.

As default Blender does not use the ICC monitor profile, so your monitor needs to be calibrated to one of the standard available spaces e.g. Rec709 or sRGB in order to view with predictable results. I switch my monitor to restrict its gamut when using Blender.

On rendering, colours will change according to the lighting set up used in Blender and the output colour space. If you are using the standard Filmic transform then you will need to assign sRGB to the render (it will be untagged when rendered) and then adjust as the standard output is designed to be somewhat flat in order to retain detail. Of course any adjustment then changes output colour.

None of this would be resolved by taking screenshots which as mentioned earlier are in the monitor colour space (although usually untagged).

Dave

yep i know about color management... and display diferences... but i does not compare color which i see with my own eyes to printed pantone colors... i compare before pantone chanels are merged with after pantone chanels are merged (to rgb)... (with expectation that before pantone chanels are merged is that is displayed correctly)

but to claryfi what i do: i will get print data with pantone colors and from theese data i will make 3D remakes of theese products in blender... so i need as simular resolut as possible to pantone colors but in rgb... (and i am expecting that when project has pantone colors inside it is displayed correclty) But when i merge chanels it is rly diferent on diferent parts of image... sometimes it get less saturated in darker places or staff likethat... (it is not just tyni color diference it is dark and light places diference and saturation on some places) merging just one pantone chanel seems fine but 2 pantone chanels or more will make big diferences before and after merge (i have before and after the same color space)

mabie i am missing something about theese colors...
I am able to edit image with merged pantone chanels to looks simular to image before merging chanels... with expectation it was correct before... so there is color possibility to do that... but it takes so much time and it is so frustrating to see correct colors before merging...

hope this message is understandable.. it is for me rly hard to describe in english

Your idea seems somewhat confusing in terms of what issue you are attempting to resolve.

Photoshop and Illustrator are both colour managed so will display colours correctly, provided the colour profiles of the document and the monitor are correct.

Colours values in a document are just that - numeric values. That applies whether they are RGB or CMYK. What makes those values represent real life colours is the document colour profile, e.g. sRGB or Adobe RGB...etc. the same values represent different colours if the document colour profile is different.

To display colours on your screen, the colour management system translates the colour values in your document to those values sent to your monitor in order to display correctly. It does this translation using the document profile embedded in your document and the monitor colour profile installed in your operating system. That of course can only work correctly if the monitor profile represents your monitor in its current state of adjustment. That is why we use calibration devices to calibrate and profile our monitors. If you change a monitor control, e.g. brightness or contrast, then a new profile is required as the old one can no longer describe the monitor.

You mention screenshots. If using a screenshot then the values taken will begin the monitor colour space. So a screenshot should always be assigned the monitor colour profile then converted to a document profile when used in another document.

Dave