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FrameMaker-dk
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FrameMaker-dkCommunity Expert
Community Expert
August 23, 2023
Answered

Tricky formatting of crossreference formats

I can't figure out why the formatting of my cross references is working unpredictably.

I have two character formats, "Bold" and "Blue"

 

I want my cross references to look Bold and Blue when applied, so I am adding this code to the definition:

<Blue> <Bold>Chapter <$chapnum>, Section <$paranum>. <$paratext>

This code will produce this cross reference:

While it works, I am consternated about the code applying Bold and Blue.

I want to get rid of the space between <Blue> <Bold> because it adds an unwanted empty space in front of the cross reference. But if I remove that space, this is what's happening:

But why? Should the bracket not be enough to separate the two formats? And it is not even consistent behaviour. Some cross reference formats do NOT have the empty space, but works nevertheless!

 

 

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    frameexpert
    frameexpertCorrect answer
    Community Expert
    August 23, 2023

    I would define a single character format, maybe called "Link" that has both Blue and Bold properties. That way, you are only dealing with a single character format building block in the Cross-Reference.

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    10 replies

    Dave Creamer of IDEAS
    Community Expert
    Dave Creamer of IDEASCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    March 8, 2024

    I came across an inconsistent bug (?) with x-refs--if you have to sequential character styles, it can sometimes not read them properly after updating the book. (I've gone for 40 years without running into this bug until today!!)

     

    I found that if you use ONE style that combines the settings, it works. So basically, do what @frameexpert suggested. 

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    David Creamer: Community Expert (ACI and ACE 1995-2023)
      frameexpert
      Community Expert
      frameexpertCommunity ExpertCorrect answer
      Community Expert
      August 23, 2023

      I would define a single character format, maybe called "Link" that has both Blue and Bold properties. That way, you are only dealing with a single character format building block in the Cross-Reference.

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      www.frameexpert.com
      FrameMaker-dk
      Community Expert
      FrameMaker-dkCommunity ExpertAuthor
      Community Expert
      August 25, 2023

      Thanks @frameexpert This is where finally gave up on making them combo of formats work. The behaviour of two character formats beside each other is highly erratic, so a new character style became the solution. Which works!

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      Bjørn Smalbro - FrameMaker.dk
      Community Expert
      Winfried RengCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      August 23, 2023

      I always heard that two character formats on top of each other do not work reliably.

      Therefore I would recommend a format which is blue and bold.

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      Bob_Niland
      Community Expert
      Bob_NilandCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      August 23, 2023

      WR: I always heard that two character formats on top of each other do not work reliably.

      Interesting. I've not heard that (until now), but it is often a problem, where people are creating a new Character Format without taking care to set the whole thing to
      ⦿As-Is
      before specifying only what needs to be changed. That doesn't seem to be an issue here. Failing to do this often results in ChrFmt1 being stomped by ChrFmt2.

      Applying multiple ChrFmts by select-and-click can be iffy because it's hard to know what ordering is being used (if that matters).

      The ⦿As-Is attribute aspect was likely mainly intended to protect the PgfFmt. It may well be that ChfFmt stacking was not contemplated.

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      Barb Binder
      Community Expert
      Barb BinderCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      August 23, 2023

      Unicode to the rescue, again! 😂

       

      I was going to just say make a new character format that includes both attributes but you knew that, so Bob's second suggestion looks like the way to go. Did you give it a shot, Bjørn?

       

      ~Barb

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      ~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training
        Bob_Niland
        Community Expert
        Bob_NilandCommunity Expert
        Community Expert
        August 23, 2023

        Be mindful that I haven't tried this, and there are a couple of caveats:
        1. FM is apt to collapse >\u200c< to >< in the dialog, making it invisible to future stewards
        2. FM frequently does not honor Unicode semantics This would be a problem for \u200d (ZWJ), but for ZWNJ, perhaps not a problem.

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          FrameMaker-dk
          Community Expert
          FrameMaker-dkCommunity ExpertAuthor
          Community Expert
          August 23, 2023

          That WAS an interesting trick you suggested. The font is Roboto, but it seems "\u200c" won't work. I get a "?" for the "invisible" character.  And same goes for "\u200d", unfortunately

           

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          Bjørn Smalbro - FrameMaker.dk
          Bob_Niland
          Community Expert
          Bob_NilandCommunity Expert
          Community Expert
          August 23, 2023

          A look at the MIF for both cases might turn up something.

          If a fix-now understand-later solution is needed, a new Character Format of Bold+Blue would do, but you could also try:
          <Blue>\u200c<Bold>Chapter <$chapnum>, Section <$paranum>. <$paratext>
          U+200C being ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER

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