Answered
Can't join two paths on the same layer
These paths can't be joined with cmd-j or the pen tool, the'yre not grouped, can someone explain please 
These paths can't be joined with cmd-j or the pen tool, the'yre not grouped, can someone explain please 
ANSWER They needed to released from a compound path but the alt-shift cmd 8 shortcut doesnt work on multiple paths at once so it wasn't working when I thought it would
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