Skip to main content
Inspiring
March 27, 2018
Question

CMYK to RGB - RBG to CMYK conversions

  • March 27, 2018
  • 6 replies
  • 2815 views

Hi,

I need an urgent help here, here is the situation:

I create artwork / designs using adobe illustrator CC 2018 to print on clothes such as T-shirts, Hoodies, Dresses, Leggings...etc and the printer that i will use requests that i submit a 300 DPI png file in RBG and the printer then will convert to CMYK but as we all know, the RGB color mode is for web and monitor view, meaning that i can't get a closer look at what the design would look like after printing because they are two different color modes and that's why my printer provider offers color swatches printed on different garment so that their customers ( me ) would choose the color they want as seen on the fabric and because it would take a long time to ship the color swatches plus they charge a lot for it, i asked them, if i did not wanna use their color swatches, could i work in CMYK color mode, to get a bit of a close look at what the design would look like after printing ( would not be exact but close ) they said yes, and that they actually recommend that i work in CMYK mode then when im done with my design, i convert to RGB then submit the png file to them for printing, i then asked them about the CMYK profile i should use, they gave me the following profile:

color settings: custom

working spaces:

RGB: sRGB IEC61966-2.1

CMYK: U.S. web coated (SWOP) v2

conversion options:

Engine: Adobe (ACE)

Intent: Perceptual

And that's what i have been using for my designs, now my question is, using the aforementioned color profile and when i work in CMYK then convert to RGB after i finish my design then save as 300 DPI PNG and send it to the printer that will then convert it to CMYK, would the printer convert to the same CMYK values that i initially worked with? in other words, would i get the same color tones that i initially worked with in CMYK after the printer converts from RGB to CMYK?

PLEASE HELP

    This topic has been closed for replies.

    6 replies

    Legend
    March 27, 2018

    Depends I guess on whether you're planning to print a couple of shirts to test, or a thousand to sell...  if it really is print-on-demand (customer wants one shirt, they print one shirt) then the waste should be small. Fabrics and printing techniques vary enormously, so I'd go for the swatches if it were me. Perhaps with a fave design on one tee, at the same time.

    Inspiring
    March 27, 2018

    Yes it is print on demand, its not bulk orders, and I'm not planning to just test designs on t-shirts, im planning on creating multiple designs for many products, not just t-shirts, advertise them on my website and start selling.

    I almost bought the color swatches when i first dealt with that printer but the long shipping time threw me off but i guess it would be better for business on the long run instead of going through all the other hassle of color management.

    Anyway, thank you so much for all the help, the answers and your time, greatly appreciated

    Legend
    March 27, 2018

    I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, we hear constantly from people who assume that buying pro software will give them the ability to pro work at pro quality. We constantly hear that "Photoshop is broken" because it doesn't do what was wanted after five minutes random clicking. It amounts to buying new carpentry tools, and blaming them when your first furniture is a bit shaky. I wouldn't try to put anyone off, so long as they have the time and dedication to give to the task. As a new business founder you're probably full of energy, which is a great start. You might consider graphic design training, there's a lot online now but be sure to find reputable info (free is often worth its price). If on the other hand you just want (for example) witty political messages and a black and white cartoon, you may not find it's worth getting deeply into this. You know your customers expectations better than we do!

    Calibrating your monitor is about MAKING a profile for the monitor. Once you have that in the system, colour managed apps (which is less than you'd think) are able to show accurate colour. I'd like to hear recommendations rather than make them.

    By the way, did the company give any kind of swatch (printed or fabric)? It would be nice to know if they have any reference point and what they say on them.

    Inspiring
    March 27, 2018

    i was not being too serious about the sarcastic part, its all good.

    as for color swatches, yeah, i actually mentioned that in my first message, they do offer color swatches printed on fabric, they have two kinds, swatches printed on white garment and swatches printed on black, they offer two because they use a white under base when printing on black and dark garments so they want their customers to have an exact /  or very close match between their designs on the screen and what is printed on both colors, white and black / dark, the problem with that is that i live in canada and the printer is in the US so ordering color swatches would take a long time to ship and i have already setup everything for the business so i dont wanna wait you know!! besides, they charge like 25 bucks for each color swatch so that is 50 bucks, its not much and thats not the reason i dont wanna order them, time is my main issue here!!

    what do you think?its better to wait for 10 days to get the color swatches and put the business on hold until i receive them which would be better for business later to have all colors match or just get into this whole calibration and color management hassle?!!

    going crazy here

    Monika Gause
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    March 27, 2018

    Maverick_007  schrieb

    actually mentioned that in my first message, they do offer color swatches printed on fabric, they have two kinds, swatches printed on white garment and swatches printed on black, they offer two because they use a white under base when printing on black and dark garments so they want their customers to have an exact /  or very close match between their designs on the screen and what is printed on both colors, white and black / dark, the problem with that is that i live in canada and the printer is in the US so ordering color swatches would take a long time to ship and i have already setup everything for the business so i dont wanna wait you know!! besides, they charge like 25 bucks for each color swatch so that is 50 bucks,

    Go for it.

    This is money invested well.

    In textiles it's even worth buying printing color charts for every different fabric you're planning to print on.

    Legend
    March 27, 2018

    Yes, I'm saying Illustrator will convert to an RGB PNG because there is no such thing as a CMYK PNG. It will do this using options you didn't choose. If you have trouble believing it would do such a thing (it is surprising), open the PNG in Photoshop, and use Image > Mode to check. When you export, it doesn't change the original at all (export is not like Save as) so nothing changes on screen.

    You may not be a pro designer but your questions indicate you want to get the RESULTS a pro designer does, so you need to learn that trade. It isn't about clicking the right box and suddenly you have all the skills you need... Sorry, but that is part of the business you really need to know: just like if you open a repair garage you need to know how to repair cars, or employ someone who does. Calibrating your monitor is a vital first step, without it nothing will match except by accident. (Accidents are the worst, because you can get a long way with happy accidents, and then have a really big fall).

    It may also be useful to consider that you're printing garments, not coffee table books. How good do this company offer to deliver? Are most of their customers happy if their reddish colours are some kind of red, or are they offering fine art reproductions? Costs will vary radically, so will quality. The very fact that they only take PNG suggests they are consumer level commodity printer with no great expectations of quality (I do not know their reputation).

    You ask "just use the internet to look for the RGB color values". Absolutely not. That follows from the idea that "this RGB colour #123456 is a standard colour you can use and it will be the same everywhere". This is completely wrong, but the internet is full of people repeating this nonsense. Unfortunately nonsense on the internet is one of the biggest obstacles to learning how to do colour correctly. Knowing how to make a Youtube video doesn't mean someone knows anything about anything!

    Inspiring
    March 27, 2018

    ok first thank you for the detailed answers, really appreciate it, did not appreciate some sarcastic remarks though, lol come on, i just said im not a pro designer, I'm new to this whole printing industry, so lets take it from the start, you said that its best to work in RGB mode and the first step is to calibrate my monitor, ok, how exactly do i calibrate it when i don't know which settings or profile i should use?!  give me some information and tips on how to do that please, lets finish this step then go over the rest to achieve the best results.

    As for CMYK PNG, i think the confusion came from the difference between save as and export, thanks for clarifying that

    Legend
    March 27, 2018

    CMYK is one way of mixing inks for colour printing. There are many others. For example 6-colour printing is often used. Very simple printing may just use CMY. For garments it's often necessary to start with printing white ink. Some providers may select spot colours as needed. All of these special things aren't done with CMYK, and so you wouldn't be working in the same colour model as them at all, if that's the case. Some garments may absorb huge amounts of ink too, so you might need to allow a dot gain that is out of the ball park; depends on the technology. This is why you should let them do the conversion; and why they will just convert your CMYK back to RGB before using the own setups. By choosing CMYK you are making colour matching virtually impossible.

    You in any case have to send PNG, I think? There is no such thing as a CMYK PNG, so when you saved PNG it would be converted - perhaps without your knowledge, and without the chance to choose the correct settings. This would be risky indeed.

    Colour matching RGB is a matter of using colour management correctly. This includes working with a good quality monitor which you have calibrated, the correct selection of profiles, and correct profile embedding choices; knowledge of gamut issues and how to prevent them. You have the secondary issue of previewing things on a garment that isn't white; this needs special expertise and cooperation with the provider, because it won't be the same as previewing on coloured paper.

    Inspiring
    March 27, 2018

    ok first of all, i never said that i would save in PNG CMYK, i said that i work in CMYK mode and when im done with my design, i convert to RGB then export in 300 DPI PNG then send to the printer, so the exported png is in RGB mode, having said that, yes there is PNG CMYK, at least, adobe illustrator 2018 CC allows me to export in CMYK PNG, or are you saying that the program does the conversion automatically when it exports it?! even though the artboard color mode stays the same (CMYK)!!!

    As for the rest of your comments, I'm not a pro designer here, I just started a clothing line business and I'm using the print on demand company called " Printful " so I'm not familiar with all those detailed settings you mentioned, i just want my designs to have ( not exact because i think that is impossible ) but at least very close match between what i see on the screen while creating the design and what is printed, I have avoided to calibrate my monitor because i dont know which settings i should use so keeping all that in mind, you still think i should work in RGB and just use the internet to look for the RGB color values that i like in my designs and just keep in my mind that there will be a slight color variation when the printer converts to CMYK?!

    Doug A Roberts
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    March 27, 2018

    Maverick_007  wrote

    yes there is PNG CMYK, at least, adobe illustrator 2018 CC allows me to export in CMYK PNG, or are you saying that the program does the conversion automatically when it exports it?! even though the artboard color mode stays the same (CMYK)!!!

    try it. then open the PNG in photoshop and see what you have.

    Legend
    March 27, 2018

    No, it won't convert to the CMYK values you worked with, that's not how it works. You should note that RGB is now the preferred way of colour design for many  professionals, who do not use swatches. Instead, they rely on colour management, the careful use of good quality hardware, software and settings so that what you see on screen matches what you print. Designing in CMYK may be completely wrong for this workflow: they might not even use CMYK inks to print on a garment.

    Inspiring
    March 27, 2018

    Thanks for the response ( Test Screen Name ),

    Could you please explain what you meant by they might not even use CMYK inks to print on garment?! the printer provider will use Direct To Garment method not screen printing.

    and if i work in RGB mode, and bearing in mind the aforementioned profile in my first message, how exactly could i match what i see on the screen with what will be printed on a garment like t-shirts, hoodies, etc?!!! can you please give me the right set of settings for that?

    Monika Gause
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    March 27, 2018

    This doesn't sound too comfortable.

    Since nobody knows how the printer will be doing the conversion, you can't be sure. You'd better do some test rounds with this printer.