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Kingsfoil
Participant
January 22, 2019
Question

Colour differences between sRGB working files and exports

  • January 22, 2019
  • 2 replies
  • 1316 views

Hi everyone, I have searched as much on these forums and the wider internet as I can and have tried everything that seems vaguely applicable, but I still have the same problem, which is:

I am getting significant colour changes between images sent to Photoshop CC (v 19.1.7) from Lightroom Classic (v 8.1, Camera Raw v 11.1). I am using a wide gamut Dell U2713H monitor (hardware calibrated using Spyder 4 Pro yesterday - which changed nothing). The image sent from LR is a RAW image (which looks just fine and normal in Windows Explorer). I am using Windows 10.

In LR preferences, the 'Edit in Photoshop CC 2019' color space is set to sRGB. The working color space in PS is set to sRGB (as most of my images are for the web).

When sent to PS from LR for editing, the image looks fine. After performing a Save for Web from PS (JPG, Embed color profile checked), I get a wildly different-looking resultant image than the image within PS (the exported image is very highly saturated and has a completely different histogram to the original), and nothing like the export dialogue box preview. To investigate, I set proof setup to sRGB in PS - and got the overly saturated colours just like the JPG export. I am no expert (which is probably fairly apparent), but would have thought that if the color space exported from LR and the working space in PS were both sRGB, that a sRGB proof setup would not change the image? Investigating further, if I select 'convert to profile' in PS, with source profile being sRGB and destination profile also being sRGB (with preview checked), the image changes to the over saturated version while the 'Convert to Profile' dialogue box is open. If I press 'OK' to convert, the image goes back to normal.

The images that I'm exporting all look horridly over saturated in Windows picture viewer, on the web using my PC, iPad and phone. I understand that things will look a bit different in non-color managed applications, but PS disagreeing with itself in terms of what the image in the sRGB space looks like is doing my head in. I really don't want to edit with 'proof colors' on all the time, which at the moment seems to be my only option to end up with an exported image that looks how I want it to look on the web. 

I understand that some images of the issue would help, however every time I tried to insert/upload an image to this post (either jpg or png) I got the message 'that image type is forbidden'.

Can anyone shed any light on why this may be happening? I start off with a normal looking image (RAW), which looks the same in Windows Explorer, LR and PS, but when exported from PS looks like a gaudy mess even when no editing at all was done, with everything set to sRGB.

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    2 replies

    D Fosse
    Community Expert
    D FosseCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    January 22, 2019

    Rereading your post it's apparent that you are simply not viewing the file with proper color management. Which you must with that monitor, as per above.

    Make sure you are viewing in a color managed application. Make sure the file has an embedded profile.

    That's basically it. If you've changed anything in Color Settings, change it back - default settings are fine. The exception is Save For Web, which has color management off by default. Use these settings:

    Proofing to Monitor RGB disables the whole color management chain. So that shows you how it looks in a non-color managed application.

    K
    KingsfoilAuthor
    Participant
    January 23, 2019

    Thanks very much for answering and for your help, I very much appreciate it.

    I am on Adobe subscription, which says I have the latest versions of PS, LR and CR?

    My monitor settings are at default with the hardware calibrated profile loaded, and I haven't changed anything since.  I am using sRGB proofing in PS, as opposed to Monitor RGB (which looks different again).

    When viewing the images on the web on standard gamut monitors they are still awfully over-saturated. The only way I seem to be able to produce an image the looks decent to my target audience (people viewing on the web) is to edit in PS with sRGB proof colors on. Even then, the output isn't even quite the same as it is in PS with 'Proof colors' on.

    This is actually starting to make me stop doing my main hobby (photography) as all my images are being mangled, and am getting many comments along the lines of "maybe take the saturation down a bit?". So much time spent editing images in PS to de-saturise them when they didn't require editing for anything else.

    I'll do another hardware calibration, just to see if it makes any difference, or change calibrators to something else.

    D Fosse
    Community Expert
    D FosseCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    January 23, 2019

    A calibrator should normally work out of the box, requiring no special settings and no user intervention except setting the parameters and push the button.

    Here's a general checklist:

    • The file must have an embedded profile, and it must be the correct one (sRGB, Adobe RGB or ProPhoto). Check the file itself, the embedded profile should always override the working space.
    • View in a color managed application, and make sure color management is fully enabled.
    • Don't change anything in PS Color Settings - if you have, reset everything to defaults. Above all, make sure policies are set to "preserve embedded profiles".
    • The monitor profile is set up automatically at system level, where PS will find it by itself. Leave this alone, it takes care of itself.
    • The monitor profile needs to be a description of the monitor's actual, current response. If anything changes, a new profile is required.
    • Never mix up document profile and monitor profile. Both are needed, each in its proper place. One is converted into the other.

    If it still doesn't display correctly, it means that some link in the color management chain is failing. Usually that's an application that just doesn't do it. But it could also be a defective or corrupt profile - or simply the wrong one. More rarely it's a video driver bug, in the cases where color management is handled in the GPU.

    D Fosse
    Community Expert
    D FosseCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    January 22, 2019

    Kingsfoil  wrote

    Photoshop CC (v 19.1.7) from Lightroom Classic (v 8.1, Camera Raw v 11.1).

    First off, update Photoshop and ACR to the current version. You need to have ACR at version 11.1 too - Lightroom and ACR must be matching versions. So that's Photoshop 20.0.2, with ACR 11.1.

    Second - if the exported jpeg displays correctly in Windows Explorer, on a wide gamut monitor, something's very wrong. Explorer is not color managed and sRGB should always display oversaturated. You cannot use software that isn't color managed with that monitor. No exceptions, that's the deal.

    Photoshop working space doesn't matter. What matters is the document's embedded profile, which will always override the working space.

    Third - don't change any settings on the monitor after you made the profile. If you do, the profile is invalidated and you need to make a new one. If you change profile, relaunch Photoshop. It loads the profile at application startup.

    As long as you have a valid monitor profile, the file has an embedded (and correct) document profile, and you are viewing in a color managed application - it has to display correctly. That's the definition of correct display.

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