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Non-destructive merging of layers

Forum|Forum|6 years ago
December 5, 2019
5 replies
2822 views

I would like to use the spot healing tool on several layers, but I also want to preserve them separately so I can edit each layer later if need be. Is there a way that I can merge layers non destrcutively, ideally the way you can edit smart objects after, but still be able to use tools like the spot healing?

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Correct answer Conrad_C

There were good points brought up by both D_Fosse (nondestructive spot healing is already available in Lightroom Classic and Adobe Camera Raw), and PECourtejoie (it could take a lot of computing power).

Any type of nondestructive editing can require more processing power and memory because the application always has to be ready to re-render all affected objects into final pixels whenever you change something. Using Smart Objects definitely increases the load on the CPU and RAM. The nondestructive spot healing available in Lightroom Classic and Adobe Camera Raw works, but anyone who uses it a lot knows that it is by far the slowest tool in those programs. And the more spots you paint, the slower it gets. If Adobe figures out how to GPU-accelerate the nondestructive spot healing in LR and ACR, maybe that will be the time when nondestructive spot healing will be more practical to have in Photoshop itself. But not yet.

By the way, that leads to one workaround for this: Select the layers in Photoshop, convert them into a Smart Object, choose Filter > Camera Raw Filter, and use the Spot Removal tool in the Camera Raw Filter. It will work on the Smart Object, and you can still open the Smart Object to edit the individual layers.

Conrad_C

Correct answer

Community Expert

There were good points brought up by both D_Fosse (nondestructive spot healing is already available in Lightroom Classic and Adobe Camera Raw), and PECourtejoie (it could take a lot of computing power).

Any type of nondestructive editing can require more processing power and memory because the application always has to be ready to re-render all affected objects into final pixels whenever you change something. Using Smart Objects definitely increases the load on the CPU and RAM. The nondestructive spot healing available in Lightroom Classic and Adobe Camera Raw works, but anyone who uses it a lot knows that it is by far the slowest tool in those programs. And the more spots you paint, the slower it gets. If Adobe figures out how to GPU-accelerate the nondestructive spot healing in LR and ACR, maybe that will be the time when nondestructive spot healing will be more practical to have in Photoshop itself. But not yet.

By the way, that leads to one workaround for this: Select the layers in Photoshop, convert them into a Smart Object, choose Filter > Camera Raw Filter, and use the Spot Removal tool in the Camera Raw Filter. It will work on the Smart Object, and you can still open the Smart Object to edit the individual layers.

A

AdobeGuru782Author

Participating Frequently

Hi Conrad_C thank you for that great explanation, really insightful. I think ultimately having a non-destructive workflow similar to adjustment layers (where effects are paremetrically added to layers and can be disabled, stacked and removed as needed) for more tools will make Photoshop so much more powerful. And when required eg. for performance reasons, the "effect stack" can be flattened.

This type of workflow has already been around for a while in 3D software, 3DS Max is the perfect example. As an example of the spot healing brush, there are a number of 3D shaders used today that sample the pixels rendered around them even in realtime and blend an object into its surroundings. This means of course that when this object moves the shader needs to resample the surroundings. My thoughts were that a similar effect in a 2D space could work if it already exists in a much more performance hungry 3D environment, but I understand if the performance is not yet there.

D Fosse

Community Expert

Actually parametric spot healing is possible; it's done in Lightroom without affecting the original data.

But Photoshop smart objects need to be compatible between applications, so the whole structure is probably very different. It's an interesting feature request, however. No idea if it could be done.

Conrad_C

Community Expert

What I do is leave the layers alone, create a new layer on top, and enable the Sample All Layers option for the Spot Healing Brush tool.

By doing this, the healing spots are added on the new layer on top, without changing any of the individual separate layers below.

Visually, the result looks identical to if the layers had been merged before using the Spot Healing Brush tool.

The only problem with this is that if you do go back and edit one of the underlying layers, it might no longer match up with the healing spots (for example, if the brightness or color of an underlying layer has changed) so you might have to redo at least some of the healing spots.

A

AdobeGuru782Author

Participating Frequently

That does sound like a great solution for the healing brush, thank you for sharing. I am looking for a more generic solution to non destructive merging though since I used the healing brush tool as just an example, but in reality I am looking for a way that any pixel editing tool can be used. There doesn't seem to be a way to do this though. If only the Smart Object was "smart" enough to allow pixel changes to it, but when you edit it and access all of the layers inside they are preserved in their original state, now there's a revolutionary idea 🙂

PECourtejoie

Community Expert

Hello, I don't think it would be possible, even with lots of computation power.

Imagine you have a file with an object in the top right corner. You edit it in your supersmart object. Now you move the object to the low left, how should the edit follow suit? Especially if there are other edits elsewhere on that "flattened" image?

JJMack

Community Expert

Make the layers you want to merge visible and all others layers not visible. Then create a new stamp visible layer on top. You will have you merged layers and still have your original layers.

JJMack

A

AdobeGuru782Author

Participating Frequently

Hi JJMack, thank you for that, I haven't used stamp layers much before but how would this be different to duplicating all of my layers and then merging the duplicates so I have the originals still and a duplicate which is merged? Will the stamp update for example if I make changes to the original layers?

PECourtejoie

Community Expert

Hello, the new stamp visible layer is an operation, not a kind of layer... It is the stamp visible shortcut, CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+E that will create a flattened copy of the visible layers.

Indeed, if you change the contents, it will not be reflected on the layer.

lambiloon

Community Expert

Hi 1st thing is management of project when you create a new layer rename it and do your work and then next layer and so on save all your project as psd file then you can edit when you want....Regards

Ali Sajjad / Graphic Design Trainer / Freelancer / Adobe Certified Professional

A

AdobeGuru782Author

Participating Frequently

Yes already doing that, doesn't really answer my question

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