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John T Smith
Community Expert
Community Expert
January 24, 2024
Question

Update: I flew !!! [Trip to Las Vegas 2nd Thoughts Boeing Problems]

  • January 24, 2024
  • 25 replies
  • 3615 views

Update: I flew !!!
https://www.direct2usales.com/VEGAS.HTM

 

My upcoming trip to Las Vegas is on Alaska Airlines... I am watching the investigation into the problem(s) with Boeing planes closely... and I am very concerned that 'several' planes have been found to have problems... I have trip insurance that I have never used before, and I'm thinking that I may find out this time just how easy/hard it is to make a claim... my trip is in late March, so I will decide early in the month if I want to cancel... or not

 

https://apnews.com/article/boeing-investigation-ntsb-safety-airplanes-d9e28fe1a11dafe4f639268504bdb85f

 

https://apnews.com/article/united-airlines-ceo-boeing-manufacturing-problems-4090ea6176ef59e382dd18e9522596bc

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    25 replies

    John T Smith
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 26, 2024

    Well a big OOPS... this claims Boeing is at fault... and says FAA is now watching the builds


    https://airwaysmag.com/boeing-renton-mis-installed-plug/

    Chuck Uebele
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 26, 2024

    Well, there you go. 

    John T Smith
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 26, 2024

    I'm sure that the Boeing CEO is not on the production line with a wrench testing door bolts, but it sure seems that whoever is (should be was!) in charge of quality control was not doing a good job of ensuring that the work was being done correctly... as I said before, bean counters in charge of Boeing is a bad idea

    Chuck Uebele
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 25, 2024

    I was talking to a friend, who is a pilot. He thinks that these doors were put in to accommodate more seating, but thinks that whoever installed the seat did so through this door, and the door was not secured properly. 

    John T Smith
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 25, 2024

    The facts:
    A 'door plug' blew off a plane out of Portland, the pilot landed the plane safely... nobody was sitting in the seat next to the open doorway, so there were only minor injuries due to being thrown around when the big hole in the side of the plane caused turbulence

     

    This specific plane had (3?) cabin pressure warnings in the days/weeks before this flight... each time the plane was inspected no physical problems were found... so, the same way a dash light in a car can come on due to a defective sensor, the plane was cleared to fly (I presume with a new sensor, but I did not find any real details about what was done) and this clearance was given without taking the inside panel off the door plug to check the bolts... this was, after all, a very new plane

     

    A door plug is a non-opening door that is bolted in a door opening instead of a regular door, when X number of passenger seats are on a plane instead of a higher Y number of seats, which would require a second emergency door be installed

     

    Door plugs are built and installed by a contractor working for Boeing... the exact inspection steps were not in any article I read but since the outside is formed to match the curve of the plane I will 'presume' that inspection is done by removing the inner panel to get to the pins and 4 bolts that are supposed to make a permanent mount (like the panel in a car door that covers the door lock and window mechanism)

     

    The Alaska CEO is very angry with Boeing due to 'many' bolts being found loose... so now Alaska (and United and maybe the FAA) will have their own inspectors watching Boeing build planes... I did not click the link to go to the other article, but lawyers are involved to sue... I will guess both Alaska and Boeing... with my opinion being that Boeing is responsible, not Alaska

     

    The door was found in someone's backyard, but the bolts are missing and may never be found

     

    The speculation:
    The NTSB never discusses an investigation until a report is issued... people who do not work for the NTSB have speculated to the press that an investigation 'may' be able to determine if the bolts were in place but loose and they vibrated out... or if one or more bolts were never installed

     

    Either way, MY speculation is the contractor that builds and installs the doors is at fault... the plane that lost the door was only a few months old and Alaska had no reason to take a 'door plug' apart to be sure the bolts were properly tightened... so 3 things did not happen... (1) the contractor did not build and/or install the door properly and (2) Boeing did not do a proper quality inspection and (3) the FAA also did not do a proper quality inspection

     

    As I've said... I'm watching the news to decide if I fly to Vegas... or not

    Leslie Moak Murray
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 25, 2024

    As to the 737, the problems are not new.  I had to fly to New York in 1997  and when I found out the plane was a 737,  I changed airlines. I was supposed to fly with my publisher's wife but I did not care. I wasn't getting on that aircraft. And they still never fixed that thing.

    John T Smith
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 26, 2024

    I flew to Reno Sep 2022 and Vegas Apr 2023... both times Alaska in a 737 (at that time not the Max model) and there were no problems... I'm still reading and thinking

    John T Smith
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 25, 2024

    Still reading... and thinking/hoping the problems will be fixed and the FAA gives approval to fly before my trip

     

    One of the articles I read said that Boeing started declining when it merged with another plane builder and the 'bean counters' replaced the engineers who had been running Boeing ever since it started, and 'quick' profits became more important than 100% quality

     

    The 'door plugs' are permanent panels where an emergency door 'could' go... Alaska has 64 other Max 9s
    The plugs are installed in the Max 9 fuselages by subcontractor Spirit AeroSystems

     

    Alaska CEO said inspection found loose bolts in 'many' 737 Max 9 planes
    https://www.axios.com/2024/01/23/boeing-united-alaska-airlines-737-max-9

     

    Alaska to send inspectors to watch Boeing planes being built... FAA 'may' do the same
    https://www.travelandleisure.com/alaska-united-airline-ceos-boeing-8548524

    Chuck Uebele
    Community Expert
    Community Expert
    January 25, 2024

    Frankly, while what happened it frightening, Since it's not been caught and under public scrutiny, I seriously doubt that it will happen again.