Adobe Acrobat Pro Preflight tool Values

[jmiteff]

Hello:

Can someone explain the values that appear beside the TrimBox entry under Page Information? When you run a check to verify compliance with PDF/X-1a, an Overview item appears that drops a tree with various sub-items, including one called Pages. Under Pages, Page Information appears with entries and values for the MediaBox, CoprBox, TrimBox, BleedBox, etc.

I have a document that is supposed to have an 8x10 TrimBox and an 8.125x8.25 BleedBox. Those entries say exactly this:

TrimBox (Inch): 8.0x10.0 (0.0/.125/8.0/10.125)

BleedBox (Inch): 8.125x10.25 (0.0/0.0/8.125/10.25)

Why is the second value in parentheses of the TrimBox have a .125? Why does the fourth have a 10.125? 

On screen, the Trimbox measures and is positioned correctly as 8x10 on the pages. I am wondering why it is showing those .125 and 10.125 values. All my PDF files us the same bleed values, so it seems consistent in all of them, but I am running into a problem with a particular print job and they are pointing fingers at me. 

Any thoughts?

[Test Screen Name]

The first is the size (2 figures). The second is the coordinates (4 figures). Your trimbox is not centred in the bleedbox, which is legal but unusual.

[jmiteff]

Fascinating...

This may be causing some of the problems I might be facing. How can I
correct this? The file appears normally with the proper trim and borders on
the Acrobat screen, even when measuring. The Set Page Boxes also do not
show anything anomalous, so I never noticed until I scrutinized the Page
Information and saw that curious seeming inconsistency. I used InDesign to
generate the file and entered 8x10 for the document size. The PDF is
intended for Amazon KDP. All of the files I have generated to date,
including the last 9 books, all show the same coordinate shift but have
printed normally. The last one just will not and is consistently off at the
top by about .125... Although the last proof was off at the sides as well.

The bleed is supposed to be .125 on the outside, top and bottom of the
page. How would it know the center alternating from odd-even (recto verso)
pages? Is it the format smart enough to know that (just asking)?

What should the values be for the TrimBox to be centered? Is there a way to
correct this? This way I can try it and see if my files behave on KDP. I
don't know of a way to change this on output from InDesign or after the
fact in Acrobat.

Any thoughts?

[jmiteff]

Hi Test Screen Name:

I think the coordinates are correct, at least for a Recto page. If you take
an 8"x10" TrimBox and start at the left-most side at 0", drop it down from
the top .125", it's rightmost border will be at 8" and its bottom border
will be at 10.125". Acrobat obviously knows if the pages are alternating
and dynamically adjusts the TrimBox accordingly. This isn't usually a
problem with conventional documents, but is a problem with books that often
have borders between that do not match from the gutter to the outside. I
have never encountered this problem when putting a book together since all
the pages are numbered and generally fixed in terms of layout.

Thanks for clearing that up.

I still have my problem though, with Amazon KDP. The files I am uploading
refuse to completely appear border to border in their Previewer (a small
white line remains on the right side) and they are saying things like the
files are technically correct but averaging them out is causing problems.

This is an actual excerpt:












*> They say that the dimensions of your interior file are 8.125" x 10.25",>
however, your trim box is set to 8" x 10." Although this is technically>
correct, as the trim box determines the dimensions of the page after it
has> been printed and trimmed, when the file is processed for use in POD,
the> page boxes are averaged out which could result in the content shift
seen in> the printed products. This is the most likely cause as the white
space is> consistent throughout the images provided by the publisher.>> In
order to prevent this issue from recurring, we recommend that you> create a
new PDF ensuring all page boxes are sized at the full 8.125" x> 10.25". If
you are printing to PDF, you should not use the automatic> setting, but
instead set this for the trim size as well.*

I actually did what they suggested and the problem remained the same. All
of these files check out in Acrobat. The files I created with the bleed
built into the page size report all Boxes as 8.125x10.25 and all
coordinates at (0.0/0.0/8.125/10.25) as you would expect. They do have you
add a cover file that has different dimensions and I loaded as well. Thes
files check out fine in Acrobat, but they have yet to get one right yet. I
have nine other books that currently print fine and they were output with
the earlier method from InDesign. I don't know what the problem is.

Everything appears correct in these files yet they insist that a small
white line at the side and a small white line that sometimes appears at the
bottom of their preview are causing a white border at the top of the page,
when it is apparent the entire page is shifted downward at least a tenth of
an inch and the ink doesn't even extend as much as it should at the top
border including the bleed, and after (4) proofs the 5th has a line along
the rightmost edge, too.

What can I do?

[Test Screen Name]

Acrobat doesn't know about your intentions; the app which makes the PDF sets the trim box and media boxes, and Acrobat just preserves them. Yes, that (bleed on 3 sides) explains why it's off centre. An idea, if you are getting a white line between pages in a spread - try making a uniform bleed (i.e. 0.125 on all sides). You shouldn't have to worry about it overrunning, the imposition engine should crop them off. Well, worth a try.

[jmiteff]

The white line only appears after Amazon KDP processes the file, which
includes mating it with the cover, in their Previewer. I am still not
convinced that it isn't a visual display artifact, since white lines appear
in the expanded view, but disappear when you zoom in. I keep asking people
if they ever see white lines in the zoomed in view on the Previewer for
books that print fine. I have. All my other books show the same white line
along the right side edge, yet print fine, and those were files generated
months ago. Since the step for publishing requires Amazon to process the
files, I don't think adding the bleed on the inside will work. They
specifically require the files to be no more than 8.125x10.25 and even ask
that to be the actual page size when you submit, essentially the bleed
being bulit in, instead of adding the bleed on output.

Very frustrating.

[Test Screen Name]

If you go to the InDesign forum and search for KDP you will find many tales of frustration.

[jmiteff]

Sad ;<

[Suzanne33321553p1po]

I am ghaving almost the same issue. (White line appearong on some proofs and not others at te bottom of the pages, adn all content mved up. Unfortunately, I created my book usinf Pages on a Mac, so added the required bleed to my page size. I had exchange of no less that 21 emails adn two live chats, with them telling me to add bleed. On the final "help chat", the aassistant acknowledged my book size page set up was correct. Amazon then told me to convert to PdfX, as it was the layers ot being flattened that was causing the trim issue. (I didn't think the layers had anything to do with the trim think so, but did it anyaway, as I now know Pdfx is a better conversion. Prior to that, I found out from another print firm that my Trim box was not showing. I am hoping that this will resolve my issue, but not sure. I have no idea what figures to enter i. nto the Trim and Bleed boxes, or even if this will fix the issue of teh white line, as it only appears at the bottom. Surely if there was an issue witht the trim, they would appear all round? Like you, I think my trim area is not centred (top / bottom) for some reason. At wits end! I must admit, Amazon have not been very helpful, adn seem to be giving conflicting info. Good luck with your project, and hopefully you'll eventually resolve it. Anyway, if anyon can tell me what I should enter in the 4 Trim boxes for a book (trim size 148x210mm)  and the bleed boxes, with Amazon bleed of 3.2mm on top / bottom and outer edge only (oddly, none required for the gutter) Thank you1