The case for integrated, native physics in the Flash Runtime

Report · May 29, 2014

Hello everyone,

As hopefully many of you know, a community based feature request page was created a few months back (Feature request for Flash and Air - uplist) and we've had a number of great ideas added and voted on. In an attempt to better understand the individual requests, we thought we'd start threads on particular subjects to allow us to ask questions and get community feedback. These posts should not be taken as a commitment to a particular feature (or lack of commitment to any other feature.) I can't stress this enough. I don't want anyone to think that we're ignoring other requests or to assume that because we're asking about something, they can expect to see this done in a future release. We simply want to better understand the request so that we can reduce the number of assumptions on our part.

To start, let's we've got a few questions regarding the request for "Integrated (native) physics" which currently has 142 votes.

When talking about physics, are you interested in a 2D or 3D physics engine?
Can you list native engines that demonstrate the features you want the Flash runtime to implement natively?
For instance, if you're interested in Box2D functionality, have you tried http://www.box2dflash.org?
Is there a huge performance gap between the native and ActionScript implementations of Box2D?
Are you looking for solutions for desktop or mobile?

Thanks,

Chris

Report · Jun 13, 2014

> Adobe said they focus on games and video, which means issues related to other types of apps are not interesting to Adobe. I know it was years ago but I do not remember them ever retracting this statement.

Chris recently stated in behalf of Adobe that " 'Gaming and Premium Video' is too restrictive for the platform and that this marketing needs to be revised". Anyway, improving the performance and the language equally makes a better gaming development platform.

EDIT: Also, on recent posts, they mention both apps and games, saying games cover over 70% of the whole AIR store apps.

Report · Jun 13, 2014

Yes, Adobe claims that Flash / Air platform is literally geared for gaming and video. But all developers agree that Adobe Air is much better for the development of enterprise tools that its counterpart solution PhoneGap. Of course the integrated physics would be a great addition, but there are more important things to adjust, such as application performance in general. After all, how many video solutions using Adobe AIR on mobile devices?

Just to complement, if by chance, integrated physics is not implemented at the expense of improving the run time, the staff of Development also should focus on this feature. If you can not do this work for financial reasons or even technologies, implementing physics to those who need this functionality to your applications, so that the community see that Adobe cares about her.

Report · Jul 10, 2014

Hi,

Just for note, check out LiquidFun which is built by Google as an extended Box2D with particle physics:

https://google.github.io/liquidfun/

My CrossBridge built fork:

vpmedia/liquidfun · GitHub

Testbed SWF:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1375050/TestBed.swf

SWC:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1375050/LiquidFun.swc

--

Anyway i would vote to NVidia PhysX if something gets integrated rather than some simplier stuff like Box2D or LF.

Report · Jul 22, 2014

Nice.. but CrossBridge much slower than as3 on mobile devices.

Report · Jul 22, 2014

Sure, but still CrossBridge is good choice as a fallback for Web deployment or for devices not supported by the ANE.

Report · Aug 08, 2014

HI,

Would love to have something very close to Napephys with both 2D & 3D capabilities, for both desktop and mobile.

Thanks

Report · Sep 24, 2014

Chris, Thank you guys for still taking care of the Flash community by constantly improving the technology.

But I think the most fundamental issue here is, what's in it for Adobe? To my knowledge, most Flash game developers do not use or even need Flash Professional. Everything is there for free to make a game without paying Adobe a cent while enjoying the latest runtime on the latest devices.

How long can this model work? and how long will you still be adding new exciting features and support to keep Flash alive?

This really puzzles me, to me, sometimes it feels like Adobe is just taking care of the community before the whole thing fades out. And another-time, like this time, it feels like Flash is having a promising future. And this just makes me look for other technologies and back again for many times. The Flash API is great for interactivity and its network capabilities are second to none, even with P2P and video audio streaming, not to mention Stage3D getting better and better, plus countless great 3rd party APIs, consistent output to all the devices the runtime runs on, Flash really is still a real contender for making complex interactive contents. HTML5 is still no where near it (responsiveness, yes, level of interactive complexity, no), and it will only progress very slowly with standards fighting over standards.

Adobe please figure out a way to make money out of Flash, and seriously, people, Flash just needs money to stay alive.

When Adobe asked for money for premium features, all of the Flash "supporters” cursed it, and somehow I think that's when we actually ended Flash's future.

Give it another try to make money from the runtime, or maybe form a new code centered game IDE, if no one supports the idea just like before, so be it, just kill Flash. You don't really need to support it like you do now. It's the community who betrayed Flash, not you. Let's all embrace the free-but-slow-progressing-and-disgusting-to-code-for HTML5.

That's all for now, I am off to enjoy make some stuff with the latest feature for free.

p.s. When I say Flash here, it means Actionscript and the runtime, not the Flash Adobe is currently pushing, I think you all know.

Report · Oct 31, 2014

When talking about physics, are you interested in a 2D or 3D physics engine?

3D

Can you list native engines that demonstrate the features you want the Flash runtime to implement natively?

PhysX,Bullet

For instance, if you're interested in Box2D functionality, have you tried http://www.box2dflash.org?

I have tried Away3D-Physics.

Is there a huge performance gap between the native and ActionScript implementations of Box2D?

Huge performance gap Indeed.

Are you looking for solutions for desktop or mobile?

Yes.

I think everybody will be really shocked if Adobe Flash Player/Air runtime contain 3D Physics Engine.More shocked than Stage3D. Stage3D

is really what we expected Flash should contain.However,3D Physics Engine will be a big big surprise! When I developped some Information System using Flash,I

Only need Flex.For Information System,Stage3D was more than enough.However when I developped some 3D game,Stage3D is not enough,I have to write my own collision detect and some movement code.I can not rely on Away3d-Physcis and Ane-Bullet.They have been there for over 1 year without any update.The Game world

is running.I am considering using Unreal Engine 4 for better 3D game.But,I really hope Adobe Flash will carry 3D Physics Engine.You can now just give a roadmap,or just a lab project,that will shock everybody!I give you promise that if Adobe do that,I will totally give up Unreal Engine.