OT: Who’s actually using PHP today?

[BenPleysier]

[osgood_]

I think that question has been asked for the last decade by those who like to use extra complicated workflows and will be asked for the next decade. I don't think they can grasp how easy php is to not only learn but to deploy. These l would say are mostly so called developers in their 20s, 30s who rely on a lot of frameworks and can't really code their way out of a paper bag on their own.

The facts speak for themselves, php still dominates all the rest of the back end languages being used today. Infact if you add up all the rest by percentage use it would still fall way short of php. Granted the graph line for php is slowly in decline but you would expect that to happen as more back end languages compete for the space.

If you want simplicity use php, if you want to pretend it's far more difficult than it actually is, use something else. As l said in a previous post next.js now let's you combine front and back end in the one file, a luxury php developers have had for years, so yes maybe someone out there developing javascript languages is finally taking note and copying some php workflow.

[BenPleysier]

l would say are mostly so called developers in their 20s, 30s who rely on a lot of frameworks and can't really code their way out of a paper bag on their own.

The facts speak for themselves, php still dominates all the rest of the back end languages being used today.

By @osgood_

The facts do speak for themselves. The most used server side language is PHP which is used for the most used framework called WordPress - most of which are outdated.

[osgood_]

I guess you could say the same about Bootstrap if you care to look at it like that.........how many websites created with bootstrap are using versions less than 4/5 which go to make up supposedly 'the world's most popular framework' but are using outdated workflows.

Even if you disregard the out dated versions of php, v7 and v8 would still trounce node at what is it now 2% market share?

[Nancy OShea]

Classic PHP Themes are still supported by WordPress.  But Block-Themes are moving WordPress towards greater client-side efficiencies.  It's a step in the right direction but will take time for users to fully embrace it. 

https://community.adobe.com/t5/dreamweaver-discussions/wordpress-classic-php-themes-vs-block-themes/...

[osgood_]

Classic PHP Themes are still supported by WordPress.  But Block-Themes are moving WordPress towards greater client-side efficiencies.  It's a step in the right direction but will take time for users to fully embrace it. 

https://community.adobe.com/t5/dreamweaver-discussions/wordpress-classic-php-themes-vs-block-themes/...

By @Nancy OShea

Its a step towards another drag and drop approach that's for sure. I dont know about in the right direction, maybe for clueless amatuers but not for the professional developer, I doubt it. Even without Wordpress php would still rank top as the most used server-side language because of it's ease of use and deployment. Anyone wanting to actually code dynamic websites and have ultimate finite control of the output would find it hard to find a simpler language to learn. Not that I have anything against other server-side approaches, its just they seem a lot more cumbersome to me when I've tested/investigated them and I cant see the point in making life harder to do something which can be done using a simpler approach. Let face it any developer under 35 has probably never used php so wouldnt know the difference, the new generation of developers have been thrown into a mire of unecessary complexity.

Its all a bit weird if you ask me. I've taken time to learn a lot of this stuff over the years, js frameworks such as, vue, alpine, partly react, node, python etc and I dont really know what they achieve to be perfectly honest. A lot of the js framworks just pack the html code to the point its unreadable and totally hard to manage. I think the mentality is 'I just want to get this done quickly' or are being forced into getting it done as quickly as posssible for financial reasons, without thinking what shite they create in terms of ease of management/readability. Oh well...I say good luck with that!!! 

I very well remember myself when I was a green horn thinking jQuery was the best thing since sliced bread because I didnt know any different. I'd only ever used jQuery at that point. I had never learned any vanilla javascript and didnt really know how jQuery worked apart from you whacked out a bit of generic syntax and something would start working a bit like you wanted but not exactly but it would have to do because you didnt have the knowledge or skill to do anything differently. Its not until you wean yourself off of frameworks/libraries or stop listening to the noise from poorly informed 'influencers' that you really make some progress. I have to thank Adobe partly because my journey as a coder really started when they failed to provide modern server behaviours. Had they done so I may well have still been using DW and never progressed beyond a very limited set of tools and libraries. Who knows I might even have been using Bootstrap, such as my introvert mind-set was at the time, lol

[Nancy OShea]

WP Developers like Block-Themes for their lighter & more flexible JSON config.  It's a better user experience too. Improved performance, fewer HTTP requests, faster loading, no more baked-in widgets.

Drag & drop is just icing on the cake to compete with other online site builders like Webflow. Average users who craved D&D could buy WP designer plugins such as Elementor.  With Block-themes, now they won't have to. 🙂

Nothing I've seen so far has lured me completely away from PHP coding.  It works for me.  That said, I never say never.  Something better could come along. I'll keep an open mind.

[osgood_]

Nothing I've seen so far has lured me completely away from PHP coding.  It works for me.  That said, I never say never.  Something better could come along. I'll keep an open mind.

By @Nancy OShea

Well, yes l keep an open mind and usually attempt to investigate new workflows that come along so l can compare them to the current workflow lm using. I'm not changing just because its considered trendy by the younger generation of coders or flavour of the month. I assess workflows based on how easy it is to use and learn and so far l haven't come across anything simpler than php.......l don't think there ever will be in the short term because we are in the era of over-engineering almost everything. I'm not hitting on node here but why would l want to spend half my time creating post and get routes, managing numerous extra files. It's like an empty bus which drives along, stopping consistently to pick up passengers (npm packages), then if you want to store something in a different folder to what the default folder is you have to write some code to tell it where you want your files stored, etc etc. I can't think of a more verbose workflow to be honest. Don't get me wrong here if node improved the overall ease of use and allowed more flexibility out of the box l may well have given it more serious consideration. The issue is its just a run time environment which needs many packages so it can do the simplest of tasks, it's like putting a jigsaw puzzle together even before you can consider actually getting down to the task in hand whereas php out of the box is more of a completed jigsaw puzzle which allows you to just get on with the task in hand.