FrameMaker has correct fonts, PDFs produced with Acrobat 9 don't.

Report · Mar 02, 2009

We're producing PDFs out of FrameMaker 9 into Acrobat 9, using the Frutiger Next font family. With the exception of a single character format, fonts are coming out correctly embedded in the PDFs.

However, in this one case (Frutiger Next Pro Medium), Acrobat appears to be (for no reason we can tell) substituting Frutiger Next Pro Heavy for medium, which makes the resulting PDF look like crap.

When we print from Frame, it looks correct. This only happens when we save as PDF. The fonts are installed on the machine, Frame uses and shows them correctly.

This only happened after we upgraded to Frame 9 and Acrobat 9, and we're at our wit's end trying to figure out what the hell is going on.

Report · Apr 30, 2009

Arnis Gubins wrote:
Bernd,
As of the time of this posting, the PDFs still haven't been released from the queue, so I can't see what's in them.

Hmmm, the first one is there (and has been at the time of posting), but the second one still says "queued", almost a day later. Is that normal? I'll try it again, but the first one is more important anyway. It displays all the non-working fonts. The second one (RGB) is OK.

Bernd

Edit: Also this one says "queued". Not sure what's happening there...

Report · Apr 30, 2009

Hi,

I have also this problem with the cmyk option. TimesNewRomanPS does not show in output pdf, but when the "convert to RGB" chec box is on, the font is embedded. This was a problem under both 9.0 and 9.0.1.

Now, with the 9.0.2 patch installed, the same fonts does not only not embedd within the pdf fila, but it also disappears from mye framemake document.?? is this possible? When I close and not save, and re-open my document, the font shows up again. Is this a new bug?

Report · Apr 30, 2009

hcwilter wrote:
Now, with the 9.0.2 patch installed, the same fonts does not only not embedd within the pdf fila, but it also disappears from mye framemake document.?? is this possible? When I close and not save, and re-open my document, the font shows up again. Is this a new bug?

Hmmmm... didn't hear about the release of the 9.0.2 patch yet, I'm still on 9.0.1. But the problem of the font "disappearing" from the FM document seems to be the same as I described above. It happens with 9.0.1 on one of my two computers. After saving to PDF and rebuilding the screen (which is a dog-and-pony show if you're doing this with a book ;-)) the text is displayed in TNR.

So for me it doesn't look like a new thing, but it's bad news that the bug obviously has not been fixed. Causes big troubles here...

Bernd

Report · Apr 30, 2009

hcwilter wrote:
Now, with the 9.0.2 patch installed, ...

Confirmed, they didn't fix it. A new test with the same document as before (9.0.1) makes two fonts more useless. Before, the HelveticaNeue LT W1G 57 CN worked, now it doesn't. Again, I created a PDF which I'm trying to upload. I hope it won't be "queued" forever as the previous PDFs...

Bernd

Report · Apr 30, 2009

Trying to think of font-related workarounds, could somebody try making an EPS with text in the problem font, and putting that on one of the pages in your document, to see what might happen -- this used to be a workaround for some tricky things in years gone by.

Also, has anybody watched for what might be happening with FM's font cache? In the pre-MS Hotfix 952909

PS Hotfix KB 952909

deleting the font cache would fix missing text issues in PDFs created by FM (and by several other apps, btw, including Word and so on).

Here's some pre-Hotfix info from Adobe's Dov Isaacs on how FM uses the font cache; assuming the location and details are still the same in FM 9

http://objectmix.com/adobe-framemaker/219088-font-cache-comment-dov-isaacs.html

Report · May 01, 2009

AxialInfo wrote:
Trying to think of font-related workarounds, could somebody try making an EPS with text in the problem font, and putting that on one of the pages in your document, to see what might happen -- this used to be a workaround for some tricky things in years gone by.
Also, has anybody watched for what might be happening with FM's font cache? In the pre-MS Hotfix 952909
PS Hotfix KB 952909
deleting the font cache would fix missing text issues in PDFs created by FM (and by several other apps, btw, including Word and so on).
Here's some pre-Hotfix info from Adobe's Dov Isaacs on how FM uses the font cache; assuming the location and details are still the same in FM 9
http://objectmix.com/adobe-framemaker/219088-font-cache-comment-dov-isaacs.html

Sheila,

I am the one who originally detected the FNTCACHE.DAT being part of the PDF problem (somehow my user account didn't make it through the forum changes, that's why my user name changed):

http://forums.adobe.com/message/1234988#1234988

and who did all the research work on the workaround procedure:

http://forums.adobe.com/message/1235052#1235052

...so this was one of the first things I tried

No, this time it doesn't do anything, but of course, this computer has the MS hotfix installed.

Now I did the test you recommended above, and placed an EPS file containing all the fonts in the same test document. Result: all regular FM text shows the same problems as before (half of the fonts turn to Times New Roman), while the EPS is written correctly, all of the fonts used there show up as they should.

Bernd

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Sean, the SaveAs method should work fine, but it hasn't for a number of years and releases... including in 9.

Print the book or file to the Adobe PDF logical printer and see if that changes the result. This would be the same workflow as you're using to create a PS file and then manually distill it, but it's only one step, so I expect it to solve your problem.

Art

Report · Mar 04, 2009

I don't know what you mean. How do I use the CMYK options? How do I use the old RGB option?

Thanks,

Sean

Report · Mar 04, 2009

What the ... heck?!

When I use File > Save as PDF, there's a check box called "Convert CMYK Colors to RGB."

If I leave this deselected, Distiller takes 4 seconds after printing is done and my ArialMTStd-Black.otf font is missing from my PDF. This is a 2MB PDF.

If I select this, Distiller takes 3.5 minutes after printing is done and my ArialMTStd-Black.otf is present, as it should be, in my PDF. This is a 6MB PDF.

Both those were done using the same joboptions.

Can you tell me what the check box does, why the extra time, why the extra file size, and why it controls whether my font displays, or not?

Cheers,

Sean

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Sean,

That's ["Convert CMYK Colors to RGB."] the toggle between the old RGB
version and the new CMYK. When it is checked, it behaves as prior
versions when doing the SaveAsPDF.

When it is left unchecked, it maintains CMYK definitions on output and
fools the GDI into leaving them alone. However, it's got a number of
bugs. It messes up imported PDFs (presents the rasterized preview in
RGB no less), it drops crop/registration marks, it seems to mess with
fonts, it generates all Acrobat data (which is really useful for print
production, not!), etc.

Printing to the AdobePDF printer that is hooked to the PDF port
creates your PDF more or less directly, using some sleight of hand,
i.e. it still creates a temporary postscript file and pipes it through
Distiller, but cleans up after itself much better than the SaveAsPDF
route.

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Sean,

Over in the other thread, you mention that you've already found a solution by generating a PS file and distilling it. The same process occurs when you Print to the PDF logical printer, but it's only one step.

Easiest thing to do is to use the Print path until Adobe fixes the SaveAs... which I wouldn't hold my breath for.

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Thanks Art.

How do I print to PDF directly without first going to PS? I am curious about that check box, however.

Sean

Report · Mar 04, 2009

With your file open, pull down the File menu and select Print.

In the FM Print dialog box, select the Adobe PDF logical printer (the name may vary, depending on your system).

Make sure that Print to File is NOT activated.

Make sure that Generate Acrobat data is activated.

If you have to make any adjustments either to PDF properties or to select a job option in the printer properties, do it now.

Then click Print. The system will prompt you for a file name....
And a PDF should churn out.

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Sean,

To print to PDF directly, select Adobe PDF as the printer AND do NOT select Save to file in the Print dialog. The PS is created but immediately distilled and deleted, resulting in a PDF.

Van

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Fair enough; that gives me a PDF with my font correctly included. What did this print process do with the "Convert CMYK Colors to RGB" setting though? Select it? Deselect it? From the file size and time taken, I'd guess it's the same as selecting that checkbox. See, this is what happens when you install and start testing right away on real projects and you have the previous version to test against. <g> Cheers, Sean

Report · Mar 04, 2009

I have to say that this has been an entertainingly odd bug for us. The problems I originally reported respond well both to Frame -> PS -> PDF and selecting "convert CMYK Colors to RGB", so we're going the Save As PDF + convert CMYK option for now. At least until something else goes sideways.

Report · Mar 04, 2009

Well, it is interesting that: 1) Deselecting "Convert CMYK Colors to RGB" causes my font not to be output to PDF. 2) Selecting "Convert CMYK Colors to RGB" causes the PDF to be three times larger and take five times as long to generate. I'd be interested in getting my font with the small PDF size and the fast PDF creation. <g> At least I have a workaround. Cheers, Sean

Report · Apr 18, 2009

Ashton and Sean,

If either of you are using SP3, you might take a look at this thread,

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/418848?tstart=0

as I believe the font issues you mentioned may be associated with a change to the way Windows handles fonts. The posting concerned Arial, but your description sounds like it is very similar.

Sheila