Indesign: Solution Leading issues in Print Copy

[K.C. Taylor]

Problem:

     I was trying to match Linespacing via word or google docs of 1.15 to InDesign. I have googled the conversion between linespacing and Leading and contacted Adobe assistance. It seems the exact number should be 12.65 agreeably. However, if I print the copy on google on white paper and then from Indesign on transparencey  and overlay the two the leading is way off.  There are no over sized texts. The text was copied and pasted perfectly and the font, style, font size, and paragraph indicators are all the same and I ensured the leading would be 12.65 throughout.

Target is to get exact print match 

Bookman oldstyle Regular 

11pt font 12.65 Leading

Baseline grid is off 

Snap to grid is off

All text is the same (selcet all to check)

The text is in a text box

Text box object paremeters is aligned to top

Auto sizing is off

Solution:

It was determined that by all indications the assumed number 12.65 provided on many platforms was inorrect. After reviewing an article by "- Dov Isaacs, former Adobe Principal Scientist (April 30, 1990 - May 30, 2021)"-  the math behind what was given was in fact inccorect. He stipulated that a single line spacing of text at 11pt font would be 13.2 so lets say for simple maths that 13.2 = 100% line spacing therefore 1.15 is 100%+15% line spacing (because in parameters 1=100% and any point value is a precentage of that one ie: 0.5 = 50%) making the actually number to represent 1.15 in spacing should in fact be 15.18 pt leading and NOT 12.65. Finding that my settings may not have been wrong I tested it again by printing a copy on transparency to over lay the text and found it nearly perfect. Near I say, because the lowercase height ratio of Bookman oldstyle may be off a little affecting the calculations, as indicated by his artcile, 'the font archetecture also plays a small variable' in determining these things. So, for Bookman Oldstyle for sure 15.18 is exactly 1.15 for 11pt font. Regular. I added  his article below so you can use this to make yoru own calculations and add it to your notes to help others down the road.

I added this as a post to help others find and use the information. No need to respond.

Kudos to the Community.

[Peter Spier]

I would have to disagree with your assertion that single line spacing in Word for 11 pt. type is not 13.2 pts.

Standard auto leading in both Word and InDesign is 120%. if you want 1.15 times the single line spacing then the correct amount would be 15.18 pts, but what you are actually saying is you want tighter spacing, 1.15 x the font size  would in this case be the 12.65 points you are suggesting.

The problem here is poor definition of what you are specifying.

[K.C. Taylor]

I did not say that 11pt single line spacing wasn't 13.2 ( which is the original 120 auto leading) I utilized that- IF (and only if)  it is 13.2 (as defined by the attatched document). and the value is 1 (as in One whole line space) then 1.15 would be 15.18 Because the math indicates (1 (13.2)* a value of it's self and addition .15 (1.15) is then calculated to 15.18) The print copy proves this to be true. Therefore the number provided by google's Ai algorithum 12.65 (for the 1.15 conversion) may be incorrect if its calculating bookman oldstyle at 11pt font reg)

the values I used are taken from the document attatched. There may be differences for each font so when using this information take that into consideration.

[Peter Spier]

Again, the problem here is a confusion between LEADING and LINESPACING, and how linespacing is defined in the algorithms.

[K.C. Taylor · Accepted solution]

Yes I am glad you agree. 

[Peter Spier]

I have to say I don't quite understand what "problem" you are trying to solve here.

It would be a mistake to presume that Google Docs defines it's linespacing in the same way that InDesign specifies leading. As pointed out in the post you cite, you are comparing a word processor to a professional layout application -- apples and oranges.

[K.C. Taylor · Accepted solution]

Im not I am merly stateing that when anyone googles "what does line spacing 1.15 equate to as leading in InDesing... you get 12.65" when in fact acording to research and technical readouts by the adobe comunity it is 15.18 

The statement was that MY PROBLEM was I made an assumption based on Ai and corrected it and then posted the findings of that correction merely to show others not to trust google off hand. I had worked on this with an Adobe technical assistant and we came to the solution together. He is correcting the information in HIS handbook while I merly took initiative to provide my findings and my base for the solution to my original assumptions. 

[Robert at ID-Tasker]

@K.C. Taylor

You shouldn't be trusting ANYTHING that is "signed" by "ai" - even if it's generated by Google... 

Always check actual websites. 

[rob day]

Hi @K.C. Taylor , Have you checked if your formula works with fonts that have very different x-heights? In case it isn’t clear, Leading is the measurement from baseline to baseline—the font meterics that might affect white space don’t matter.

These two examples have the same 10pt Size and 14pt Leading, but there appears to be more space between the lines because the x-heights are so different:

[Dave Creamer of IDEAS]

Why not use "Exactly" for line spacing rather than a percentage?

[K.C. Taylor · Accepted solution]

That does seem logical and I have, admitedly, very little knowledge on word (passed 2018or 365 era processes) and was recieving the document that posted the question in google docs. I am glad you brought that up so that others could also use that information. I was unfortunately the Indesign editor and was told to keep the document exactly as posted so I had no control over the original document but had to match it in Indesign so that it would print the same.  

Thank you for that Insight