Applying ALL adjustments to a virtual copy giving different result (14.2)

[Digital Williams]

Not sure if this is a bug so initially looking for some help in case theres is something I'm missing. 

I have photos from last year shot RAW on my phone (Pixel 8 Pro) and I had edited them to my liking - in LrC 14.2 - but now, when copying all adjustments to other images I am noticing a totally different result. I made a virtual copy and  reset it, tried to reapply from the edited version and it's completely different.

I am using a profile (JW Kodachrome PROFILE) set to 42 but I'm not having this issue with other images shot and using profiles.

Now, I've tried manually editing the image to bring it back in line with my edit but I can never seem to get it quite right, close but not right.

Examples:

1st BAD COPY

2nd MY EDIT

3rd ORIGINAL RAW

Any help would be appreciated!

GARETH.

[JohanElzenga]

Do you see any red dots at the top of the right panel in the Develop module? If so, then some AI setting needs to be updated and that could cause the difference.

[Digital Williams]

No, I don't have any AI masking errors. It's driving me crazy!

[JohanElzenga]

Well, I can't reproduce it on my Mac. If I create a virtual copy, then that's identical to the version I created it from.

[Digital Williams]

Also, to be clear...creating the virtual copy is fine, everything looks identical. The issue is when applying the adjustments from the original to the VC, it changes completely....meaning something is going wrong.

[JohanElzenga]

I'm not sure I understand. If you create a virtual copy from the original, then you do not have to apply any adjustments. The virtual copy already has all those adjustments...

[Digital Williams]

Yeah, it does but if I reset that copy back to unedited, then copy the adjustments from the original....it looks wrong. I was using this method to check that all the changes were being copied because I was pretty sure that they weren't.

[JohanElzenga]

You probably do not reset it all to zero. If you hit the 'Reset' button, then that does not set all sliders and everything else to zero, but resets the copy to the camera default. If you then add all the settings again from the original, then you may get a difference. One example I can think of is if the white balance of the original is set to 'as shot', but the camera default is a default fixed value. You cannot copy 'as shot' over a fixed value, so the VC will still have that fixed value after doing this.

[Digital Williams]

No, everything is reset to default values. I've been through all the panels and reset to make sure. Then applying the settings in any way gives a completely different result.

I tried saving as a preset with all options checked, still the same unexpected result.

[JohanElzenga]

You said it yourself: creating the virtual copy from the original image does create an exact copy, as expected. If you then first reset all sliders, followed by setting them back to their original positions again, how on earth could you get a different result? There is no magic involved, just sliders. 

The only explanation other than you are missing something would be some kind of corruption, so I would try two things. First thing to try is to move the Lightroom preferences out of their default location, so Lightroom will rebuild this file. Then do your VC exercise again. If you still see the same thing, then move the old preferences file back and overwrite the new file with it, thus restoring the old preferences (https://www.lightroomqueen.com/how-do-i-reset-lightrooms-preferences/). Then try the second thing: create a new catalog, import the image you are using for this and try the same VC thing in this new catalog.

[Digital Williams]

I'll give it those a try, thanks. It's so strange as this behaviour doesn't happen with other files other devices.

[richardplondon]

It is certain that the virtual copy concerned, and the master copy concerned, are both referring to the exact same file? If so, it should be possible to exchange which one has master version status, and which one has VC status (set copy as master). This switch over should make no difference whatever.

Besides checking that the usual Basic Panel adjustments and underlying profile are the same, also that local corrections are not in place, it may also be worth checking for the same Process Version; also checking if anything's active in the less commonly used adjustment panels such as Grading and Tone Curve.

Can you explain what you meant by "42", for the profile you are having trouble with?

[Digital Williams]

Every single adjustment is copied from every panel in the original, with the same process version. 

42 just refers to the percentage the profile is applied.

I'm wondering if it's anything to do with the profile I am using. It's a Jamie Windsor Kodachrome profile that I was using as a base before editing myself. I'm kinda stuck as to the issue. Is it something to do with a change in the way the Google Pixel files are being handled? I have no idea.

[richardplondon]

Most advice you will see concerning ensuring camera profile is the same (as well as that all the adjustment sliders etc are the same) presumes that this is a Raw conversion profile specific to the camera involved.

AFAIK it is not a thing to use such a profile - a camera calibration one - at partial percentage.

But another kind of choice would be an "effect" profile which modifies RGB starting data towards a certain different look. That profile may often be LUT based. In such a case a variable strength will be logical, say right down to 0% strength - which would mean superimposing no such RGB modification at all - or conversely increasing that even past 100%.

That does presume a valid RGB input for the modification though. And if your starting point is sensor Raw, not converted RGB then some sort of (default profiled?) Raw conversion must have also happened along the way. And perhaps this aspect is what is varying behind the scenes? (because of... reasons).

If so that must give varying results - even when post-applied modifications are themselves identical.