Convert jpg to dng

[Guest]

I think older versions of the Adobe DNG Converter allowed you to convert jpg files to dng.

The current version will only convert raw files to dng.

I understand that some may not think this conversion is a good idea.

I just want to know how to do it.

Thanks.

[EricBier]

In Lightroom choose Export.  In the Export Dialog under File Settings, choose DNG.

[Guest]

Ok, that worked.

Any idea why this won't work under  'Copy as DNG' under 'Import' ?

or why it wont work when using the Adobe DNG Converter?

Thanks.

[JP Hess]

I'm not authoritative, and I'm not an expert. But my guess is that trying to do that is simply going against logic. By converting a JPEG to DNG you are not creating a raw image. And although you can export as DNG from Lightroom, if the originals are JPEG images you won't have raw files as a result.  As I understand it, the main reason for converting a raw file to DNG is to place the raw image data into an open and "common" file container. JPEG images do not contain raw image data.. And converting them to DNG doesn't really accomplish anything.

[Guest]

I fully understand that logic.

But it makes my workflow easier for the few jpgs I have.

I'm pretty sure that the 'DNG Converter' used to process jpgs to dng.

Now it just refuses to.

[jimtron]

wjl11 wrote:

I think older versions of the Adobe DNG Converter allowed you to convert jpg files to dng.

The current version will only convert raw files to dng.

I understand that some may not think this conversion is a good idea.

I just want to know how to do it.

Thanks.

Yes, you can still convert jpgs to dng. In grid view, select the jpgs and then go to Library: "convert photos to DNG." Make sure to uncheck "only convert raw files."

Any idea why this won't work under  'Copy as DNG' under 'Import' ?

I may be remembering wrong, but I think you used to be able to do that in earlier versions of LR. That's how I stumbled on this thread, I was trying to import some old photos I shot as JPGs and wanted to convert them to DNG on import and found I could no longer do that.

I'm not authoritative, and I'm not an expert. But my guess is that trying to do that is simply going against logic. By converting a JPEG to DNG you are not creating a raw image. And although you can export as DNG from Lightroom, if the originals are JPEG images you won't have raw files as a result.  As I understand it, the main reason for converting a raw file to DNG is to place the raw image data into an open and "common" file container. JPEG images do not contain raw image data.. And converting them to DNG doesn't really accomplish anything.

There are logical reaons for doing this. From LR expert John Nack's blog:

So, editing a JPEG in Lightroom or ACR, then making it into a DNG, allows you to create an envelope that packages up the original bits, the editing sauce, and a rendered preview that any application can see (i.e. DNG = before + after + settings).  And, unlike a regular JPEG that contains editing data, a DNG isn’t going to be mistaken for any old file.  It stands out as something with special editing properties.

Here Nack quotes Tom Hogarty:

the DNG format offers benefits as a non-destructive editing format in addition to its position as a raw standard. DNG is designed to efficiently store the XMP metadata block and image preview associated with a non-destructive edit. As non-destructive editing capabilities grow, the DNG format has the architecture required to grow with those capabilities regardless of the source format. For example, a JPEG image converted to DNG and non-destructively edited three different ways will be able to store three sets of editing instructions and three distinct previews for each edit.

[areohbee]

wjl11 wrote:

I understand that some may not think this conversion is a good idea.

I could argue that *not* doing it is a bad idea .

i.e. jpg implies cooked in most peoples minds. Wrapping original master jpegs in dng makes it clear that it's an original master, not cooked...

That said, only way to do it is in Lightroom as you've now done. I've been trying to lobby for (jpg wrapping) support in DNG converter, but so far to no avail...

Come on Adobe! - let us wrap our jpegs!! (via command-line and as import option).

Cheers,

Rob

[MichelBParis]

Rob Cole wrote:

.

That said, only way to do it is in Lightroom as you've now done. I've been trying to lobby for (jpg wrapping) support in DNG converter, but so far to no avail...

Come on Adobe! - let us wrap our jpegs!! (via command-line and as import option).

Rob

I would support that idea for another reason.

Besides using Lightroom, I also keep catalogs for other users in the Elements Organizer. I'm using the (excellent) ACR 7 version basic and detail tabs both for raws and jpegs. And the biggest problem to get a LR-like workflow with the Organizer is that it wont give you the ability to open jpegs in ACR (unless they have been already opened 'as' raws in the editor, one by one).

Having a batch conversion to DNG with the dngconverter just like for non supported raw formats would be a smart solution.

[areohbee]

Excellent point - I hadn't thought of that one .

[MichelBParis]

Rob Cole wrote:

Excellent point - I hadn't thought of that one .

Also, I am not sure Adobe are eager to give Elements the same power as LR

[TheDigitalDog]

So IF I understand the need to embed a JPEG into the DNG converter, it's because another Adobe app doesn’t allow JPEG's to be edited in ACR?

IF that's the case, Adobe should provide either the ability to edit the JPEG's in ACR like Photoshop or provide a means to convert to DNG. I think the former makes a bit more sense then the later.

The bit about having the JPEG in a DNG so there's a preview of the current rendering instructions (which can be embedded in the JPEG)? I think that's logical and I hear users wonder why when they edit a JPEG with parametric instructions they don't see the effects after just opening that JPEG elsewhere.

[jimtron]

Andrew Rodney wrote:

So IF I understand the need to embed a JPEG into the DNG converter, it's because another Adobe app doesn’t allow JPEG's to be edited in ACR?

No, not really--if you read the entire thread, there are several good reasons to do this.

IF that's the case, Adobe should provide either the ability to edit the JPEG's in ACR like Photoshop or provide a means to convert to DNG. I think the former makes a bit more sense then the later.

JPGs can be opened in ACR with Photoshop, and they can be converted to DNG with Lightroom.

[TheDigitalDog]

jimtron wrote:

No, not really--if you read the entire thread, there are several good reasons to do this.

JPGs can be opened in ACR with Photoshop, and they can be converted to DNG with Lightroom.

I read it twice, I'm not seeing it... You mean what John Nack wrote? Because you can store XMP instructions inside the JPEG (or TIFF). What neither provide however is the current rendering from those instructions seen if opened outside say ACR. You have to ask ACR or LR to render a new iteration to get that. I don't use Organizer but it *sounds* like it's the limitation here.

I'm aware JPEGs can be opened in ACR (in Photoshop), I thought one of the issues was: And the biggest problem to get a LR-like workflow with the Organizer is that it wont give you the ability to open jpegs in ACR.

[jimtron]

Andrew Rodney wrote:

jimtron wrote:

No, not really--if you read the entire thread, there are several good reasons to do this.

JPGs can be opened in ACR with Photoshop, and they can be converted to DNG with Lightroom.

I read it twice, I'm not seeing it... You mean what John Nack wrote? Because you can store XMP instructions inside the JPEG (or TIFF). What neither provide however is the current rendering from

those instructions seen if opened outside say ACR. You have to ask ACR or LR to render a new iteration to get that. I don't use Organizer but it *sounds* like it's the limitation here.

In this thread, John Nack, Tom Hogarty, and Rob Cole have arguments in favor of converting JPGs to DNG.

[MichelBParis]

Andrew Rodney wrote:

So IF I understand the need to embed a JPEG into the DNG converter, it's because another Adobe app doesn’t allow JPEG's to be edited in ACR?

IF that's the case, Adobe should provide either the ability to edit the JPEG's in ACR like Photoshop or provide a means to convert to DNG. I think the former makes a bit more sense then the later.

Absolutely,  I am tired of asking that feature in the organizer... which had a solution from John R Ellis up to version 8 of PSE with his 'EditInAcr'. I don't think my observation will have any weight to make Adobe create an 'Open in ACR' option from the Organizer, but if the other reasons in this discussion convince Adobe to convert jpegs to DNG via the dngconverter, I would have a reasonable solution.

For those who use the Organizer instead of LR and take advantage of the power of ACR for jpegs as well as raws, the conversion to DNG would have other advantages :

- enabling opening several DNG-ex-jpegs at the same time in ACR for common edits (sort of 'syncing')

- browsing the Organizer, you can't see which jpegs have been edited in ACR. That is hidden in the metadata section. You don't see if a jpeg is an unedited one, or a an original with the parametric edits saved in the header. Not easy to use a search for selection for further tagging.

- using the new 'lossy' compression of ACR 7 may be useful.

Edit:

Reading your previous post, I think it's good to mention for those not acquainted with the Organizer, that you can open jpegs in ACR in the editor, one by one. After that, if you choose to open the file from the Organizer, it will open automatically in ACR. But you can't tell from the browsing space if it has been edited in ACR.

[TheDigitalDog]

MichelBParis wrote:

Reading your previous post, I think it's good to mention for those not acquainted with the Organizer, that you can open jpegs in ACR in the editor, one by one. After that, if you choose to open the file from the Organizer, it will open automatically in ACR. But you can't tell from the browsing space if it has been edited in ACR.

Well it seems that copy of ACR is 'crippled' as one can open multiple image in ACR from Photoshop.

So you can't open multiple JPEG's but you can open multiple DNG's in ACR/Organizer? Odd.

[MichelBParis]

Andrew Rodney wrote:

MichelBParis wrote:

Reading your previous post, I think it's good to mention for those not acquainted with the Organizer, that you can open jpegs in ACR in the editor, one by one. After that, if you choose to open the file from the Organizer, it will open automatically in ACR. But you can't tell from the browsing space if it has been edited in ACR.

Well it seems that copy of ACR is 'crippled' as one can open multiple image in ACR from Photoshop.

So you can't open multiple JPEG's but you can open multiple DNG's in ACR/Organizer? Odd.

You can open several 'raws' or 'DNGs' at the same time in ACR, both from the organizer or the editor. With jpegs, it's only one at a time, only in the editor.

What has been deliberately 'crippled' in Elements is that ACR gets only the basic, detail and camera calibration tabs. You can't use local corrections and you have to open in the editor if you want to save in another format. You can choose to save edits in xmp or in database. Since you have all the tools to compensate for those lacking features in the editor, that seems rather logical for an entry level software.

Using the organizer plus ACR with raw files offers an efficient workflow. It's a pity jpegs have been 'forgotten' since that software is targetted at amateurs who often deal with both raws and jpegs.

[areohbee]

A related feature request on the Adobe feedback forum:

http://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/dng_include_check_codes_for_jpeg_image_data_li...

[BDimasi]

As somebody who likes to have an organised image library, I like the idea that all my images are of the same file type. So, converting my JPG files to DNG makes sense from my perspective, and I get the same consistent container format for metadata and tagging purposes. It is easy to distinguish lossy vs lossless DNGs in Lightroom and other metadata applications. As an aside, I prefer to embed my raw files inside the lossless DNG as an extra insurance policy.

Agree that Adobe DNG converter used to convert JPG, but now it is exclusively raw files only. At least Lightroom allows for JPG files to be converted to DNG post import, which I'm glad for. Hopefully this capability continues into the future, although most of my files are raw nowdays.

[DdeGannes]

I far as I can recall the Adobe DNG Converter is working as designed, you select a ”Folder” and if they are raw files in the folder you will have the option to convert them to dng format.