Writing Metatdata Changes into XMP on exit takes forever with new version

[andrewm99048561]

My Lightroom Classic just updated to the latest version (13.0).  When I exit, rather than the option of delaying writing XMP, it now says I should wait until it completes. 

The first time, I let it complete in case the delay was due to the update.  I didn't time it, but it took several minutes.  I went back in, and made minor edits to two images and then exited.  It's been over 5 minutes, and it's only up to 14%. 

Why has the message changed to say you should wait?  Why is it taking so long?

[andrewm99048561]

>This has not been changed.
I didn't see that message at all with 13.0

>Still, how any of you images need to be saved?
I let the saving complete, so there should have been none.  I then restarted LR 13, edited one file, and exited.  It took more than 20 minutes (I didn't watch it until the end) to complete the second time.

I've rolled back to 12.5, because I actually need to edit some images, so can't do any testing.  However, 12.5 exits fine with no delay.

[C.Cella]

@andrewm99048561 

20 minutes to save XMP for a single file is unheard of.

Even my biggest XMPs (98Mb) takes 24 seconds to be saved on my external HDD.

The only case I can think of when a XMP takes abnormally long time (i.e never finishes) is when you enter a save loop caused by a metadata/conflict...a bug that has exited in lrC since time immemorial so reverting to LrC 12.5 solves nothing.

[jrsforums]

I had long delays for metadata while exiting 13.  Pause, then unpausing 'Saving XMP' showed countdown from high 4000 images being saved.

I used your advice on using smart collection.  Metadata 'conflicts' showed 5066 images (are these the endless save loop). I overwrote catalog XMP to files.  Took quite a while.  

now, no images when clicking pause, no conflicts, no (current) delays when closing LRc.

btw....I never had a problem or noticed delays with automatically writing XMP to files, but....

[C.Cella]

@jrsforums The endless "save loop"happens when LrC believes that photo(s) have/has "metadata not up to date" while tis not the case, and keeps writing the XMP(s) over and over again ad infinitum.

It's a bug and the only way to fix it is to perform "Read Metadata"...at that point LrC finally realises metadata is indeed "Up to date".

[DdeGannes]

@andrewm99048561 , I am a Lightroom user since Feb 2007 when Lightroom version one was released and I participated as a beta user prior to its release from July 2006. I am sympathetic to your present predicament with respect to delays you exprence with the writing metadata to XMP.

From inception I adopted the default prefrences of Lightroom which includes the storage of metadata and edits in the Lightroom Catalog file.

This means that I have not selected the option to Automatically write Metadata to XMP.

Nor do I utililize the manual option to write Metadata to the file except when I wish to share that info with a friend or family.

I acknowledge that many users utilize those options in their workflow.

Just a few thoughts,

Lightroom writes metadata and edits to the Catalog file in real time.

Writing to XMP is a secondary function and may get delayed if you are doing lots of work editing including, syncing/ copy / paste etc, so at the end of your editing session there is a lots of data to be written to the files.

Exiting Lightroom immediately will provide warnings.

I can remember I did a copy of a copyright to several thousand images and it took quite a while before Lightroom shut down.

[DdeGannes]

My thought would be to deselect "Automatically write Metadata to XMP" and utilize the manual menu option Metadata > Save Matadata to File, when you have completed your work session.

[C.Cella]

@DdeGannes I find wasteful to save manually when LrC already knows what files need to be saved and does it for us automatically without having to select them.

Suppose you work for 5 hours on hundreds of images, assign metadata, edit them, etc...

IF you don't want the XMP to be written too many times (you might be concerned about performance and storage lifespan) you can simply pause XMP at the beginning and play/resume at the end of the work session.

2 clicks and LrC does it all for you.

That was the envisioned workflow with visible buttons.

It is clear to me that the current design makes it harder for the user to discover and use buttons.

The fact that we must right click Status activity AND enable the text adds to the complexity.

That text is very useful, it is actually the ONLY reliable indication of files that needs to be saved because metadata smart collections are bugged.

.

[DdeGannes]

@C.Cella , As I indicated in an earlier post Lightroom priority function is to write metadata and edits to the Lightroom Catalog file, on the other hand "Automatically write metadata to XMP is not a priority function and while you are busy working with Lightroom that function is not taking place and will only take place during idle time. If you abruptly stop editing and decide to exit Lightroom there may have a large backlog to data to be written and could hamper your backup.

At some stage it will have to complete that operation.

Its up to you how you manage that process.

The reason I suggested using the manual menu option "Metadata > Write Metadata to File" is that it appears to be a bug in the "Automatically write Metadata to XMP" process at this time.

[jrsforums]

It was listed above that the XMP gets automatically written in the following instance#

1. Active image changes (Multiple images edited in batch counts for this)
2. App Quit
3. App goes into background or
4. Switch Module

this should significantly reduce any backlog...but reduce interactive writing while editing an image.

[C.Cella]

@DdeGannes the purpose of the Play/Pause button is to allow users to save in one click, without the need to select the images themselves.

One click and LrC does it for us.

It is the most efficient way to save into sidecar should a user not want to keep it active all the times.

Best of both worlds.

We can save when we want without the hassle of selecting OR we can keep LrC save constantly.

BUT the buttons are not easy to find.

That's the problem.

That was not the original idea.

.

[jrsforums]

I think the problem was/is less placement, then awareness that there was a 'switch'.  Adobe, in LRc 13 release, mentioned the change to asynchronous XMP updating, but did not, as far as I am aware, mention it could be paused and where.  As far as placement, I find the "button" no more hidden than something in a dropdown menu....you have to know to look for it and where.  Possibly, a mention in the preferences dialog where the selection of automatically writing to XMP could help.

[stephens700684]

I have exactly the same issue on the auto upgrade to LR 13.

Today just turned on LR, it has been idle in the background as I had office work to do, did no work in LR and have that message that is taking forever to write the metadata changes to XMP, even though I haven't done anything to any of the images.

Must be a bug??

[mike.scheerer]

It is now 5 months since the last update on this thread and I am currently running Version 13.2 of Ligthroom Classic and I have been suffering with the extremely slow XMP qriting speed for some time now.

Mine always appears to reach 29% and then does not progress any further and I have to cancel it. I have left it all night and in the morning it is still sat at 29% and I have now taken to just cancelling it.

I have not tried resetting my preferences or doing a full re-install of Lightroom CC and would be interested to know if this solutions has actually helped anyone with resolving this issue?

I am considering binning off using Lightroom Classic in favour of Bridge and Camera Raw, but I do like the cataloguing features of Lightroom Classic and find the manual navigation of folders using Bridge to be a little tedious, but at the end of the day it is a consistent Post Processing workflow that is the most important factor to me.

[DdeGannes]

@mike.scheerer , I would try resetting your Lightroom Classic preferences.

This is just a "hunch", if you do not wish to resset your preferences. Have a look at the screenshot below. If you have unwittingly selected the box "Do not show again" this could be a reason for your problem and LrC may be stuck waiting for a response before proceeding. To fix go to Lightroom preferences General Tab and select Reset all warning Dialogs.

[mike.scheerer]

Hi Denis,

Many thanks, resetting the warning dialogs may have helped, as the XMP writing. completed in a real swift time.

I will see how things go, because I have seen this before only for it to re-occur, but thanks for the tip and I will keep you updated.

[RegularPerson]

Mine was also hanging at 29%. How weird is that.  Where is this button that is hidden/not hidden.?

would appreciate some help finding. Thank you.

[C.Cella]

@RegularPerson it is in the Status and Activity panel.

[RBrogen]

I have this problem also ... Why the hell was it changed from just auto writing the changes to the XMP in the background to now having to wait after you are done and ready to finish.  What the hell happens if the system crashes?  This is a huge annoyance and I have yet to see a real answer as to why this is  the case.

[DdeGannes]

@RBrogen , you stated " just auto writing the changes to the XMP in the background to now having to wait after you are done and ready to finish."

LrC reads an writes all your changes to the Catalog file immediately this is a priority and default function, auto writing changes to XMP is an option and secondary function and happens in the background during idle time.
If you have a long and busy editing session there may be lots of info left to complete writing to XMP, so if you decide to immediately close LrC you will see the warning. The warning indicates you can wait for it to complete or you can choose to proceed and the process will complete when you next boot LrC.

I you wish to test how long it takes to write to XMP do the following when you have a large batch of images to edit, turn off the option "Automatically write metadata to XMP" and after you have completed select the full batch of images and use the option "Save metadata to Files".

It is a function that takes time.

[C.Cella]

LrC auto saves into XMP instanlty in Library.

In Develop module the auto saves no longer happens instanlty after every history step is recorded but happens when: 

1. User changes Active photo.

2. User syncs settings with other photos.

3. Chaning module and going form Develop to any other module also triggers the instant Auto Save.

LrC (or rather Camera Raw) writes/saves into XMP at around 5Mb/s.

Even if you have an SSD that's as fast as it can go.

.

Unfortunately 

[DdeGannes]

@C.Cella , I am not aware of your experience here and am unable to test since I do not use the "Automatically save Metadata to XMP " or consider it necessary to manually use the menu option to save Metatadata to the file in my workflow.
 However can do so if I wish to share that info with friends and family with raw image files.

As far as I am aware writing to the Catalog is mandatory and a priority function and writing to XMP / to the file is a secondary .function.

[C.Cella]

@DdeGannes 

Auto writing means you can do all your editing and metadata and then

LrC will do the saving for you.

E.g.

I changed keywords for about 2800 images.

I didn't have to keep the photo selected, or remember to save.

After having done all I had to do I just started the auto save.

P.S.

Using the SDK I created my own Auto Save.

[DdeGannes]

@C.Cella  Ok so you are using a Plug-in that you created. That is fine however Lightroom Classic is writing all you work to the Catalog file you do not have to save anything. 

[C.Cella]

I write into XMP for a few reasons.

1. I can edit externally in ACR or LrD (or even in Phothsop without opening LrC)

Particularly ACR has one of the most vital tools for color correction and that is not available in LrC.

2. By saving in the XMP I keep a "double copy "of the edits (one in catalog, one in files)

If I remove a photo from the catalog or something bad happens to my catalog I can get all edits back without having to use a catalog backup that usally is hours behind. 

3.Keywords are saved into XMP which means they are available in other non Adobe apps.

This is the best for archive.

4. Before I started coding I was reading the XMP to reverse engineer edits and find bugs.

XMP was my only way to figure out many, many things and problems.

@johnrellis came to my rescue years later and gave me his super vital Show Catalog Metadata Plug-in so I don't need to reverse engineer by reading the XMP anymore...almost.

So overall yes I don't need to save into XMP but it helps.

I have lost a catalog, backup was 12 hours behind and having the edits in the XMP saved me.