Color Spaces CIE and Adobe RGB

[Hudechrome]

Looking at monitor specs, usually, the color space of the monitor is given in terms of a target color space, like 96% Adobe RGB. Some give several, but along comes Dell, u2412, and they supply one: 82% CIE.

I know what CIE is, but making a guesstimate from the Dell spec requires more than what I presently know about such matters.

So, what are the expectations? Is that a meaningful spec for comparison sake? IOW, how much does Adobe RGB enclose CIE 1976?

TIA

Lawrence

[Hudechrome]

I went back to here:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/916368?start=0&tstart=0

and ran some of those checks with the various presentations. Also, embarrassingly, I did know about the site but failed to go back when I looked for any test results for the 2412.

sic transit Gloria!

I also generated  a step tablet in PS, as well as doing several calibration reruns. I did a calibration in "Standard"ode and one in "Custom" where I had access to RGB controls.

TFT Central did the same and claimed that the Custom was more troublesome and didn't yield any significant improvement. I beg to differ!

Also, they made available the results of the Standard and Custom as an ICC profile for users and I defy anyone to tell me there is no significant difference. Between my two calibrations and TFT's, I have 4 flavors from which to choose. Wow! I'm impressed (NOT!)

At any rate I settled on using my custom version as it shows the most neutral gray. It also showed the smaller dE both average and max deviation, 0.34 and 1.2 respectively, the only one exceeding 1.0. It also was close to the factory default than the others.

What a way to run a railroad!

The other fussbudget item is X-Rite. I doesn't like calibrating LCD. It manages to skip over steps along the way, and if I hadn't the experience and expectations step to step with my crt, I would probably be returning the Dell at this time. The differences from the data pov between my Custom and Average should be barely visible, but in fact, it is visually significant. Normal conclusions would hold the monitor at fault.

Off to contact X-Rite.

Lawrence

[D Fosse]

Hudechrome wrote:

The other fussbudget item is X-Rite. I doesn't like calibrating LCD. It manages to skip over steps along the way, and if I hadn't the experience and expectations step to step with my crt, I would probably be returning the Dell at this time. The differences from the data pov between my Custom and Average should be barely visible, but in fact, it is visually significant. Normal conclusions would hold the monitor at fault.

Off to contact X-Rite

Could it be that the problem is not LCD, but LED?

I've known for some time that older colorimeters had trouble with wide gamut, but lately I've heard that many of them also have difficulties with LED backlight, even in standard gamut. I don't recall what sensor you're using, but AFAIK the Spyder3 was the first that was specifically made for wide gamut (and presumably LED).

A black to white gradient should give you some clues. If it looks good, with no sudden transitions or color shifts, you can probably trust the profile.

[Hudechrome]

The final proof will be the print match. One thing that will likely show up is

the oversaturated yellows due to sRGB. The tendency is to overcompensate

yellow on screen, only to have it print to strongly. I've seen this on the crt

as well.

TFT Central also uses i1 colorimeter and the same x-rite software. The b&w

gradient is excellent.

[Bogdan Hlevca]

This answer is not correct. Please read my answer, especially the  linked article from a professioal.

[jane-e]

---

@Bogdan Hlevca 

Chris Cox is a professional. He was a senior computer scientist on the Adobe Photoshop team from 1996 to 2016, including when he answered this post in 2011.

http://www.photoshophalloffame.com/chris-cox

http://www.chriscox.org/Resume.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwuQoAW33UU

~ Jane

[Bogdan Hlevca]

Jane, I don't disagree with you or Chris. Chris is right in technical terms, but monitor companies use CIE1976 as a way to compare colour spaces. They do that even if it may be technically incorrect.

Still that reply, even if is possibly correct, did not answer the question the OP was interested in: how does a specification labelled with CIE1976 compare to other color spaces such as AdobeRGB?

 A complete answer would have stated what he already said, but also provide some light about what the monitor manufacturers may use, possibly incorrectly, to advertise the capablilities of their products.

I am a scientist myself and I often make the same mistake of providing answers that are techincally correct, but do not help the persons who asked the questions.

~ Bogdan

[D Fosse]

Monitor manufacturers' specifications are all over the map and this is pretty far down on a long list of misleading and inaccurate marketing claims. It's pretty irrelevant to real-world performance.

Since this ten-year old thread has been dug up and resuscitated, I should point out that I myself  fell victim to this misleading marketing. Shortly after this, I bought a Dell U2410, and was shocked at the piece of utter garbage I received. It was totally useless and the very next day I returned it and demanded my money back.

And here's the kicker: the paper specs were identical to the Eizo CG 246, then the top 24" Eizo model! How could that be? So I started on a bit of research, and soon discovered that the paper specs were mostly empty fluff. The things that matter aren't even in the specs. That's how they get away with it. They cut corners where they can.

Not long after I bought a real Eizo CG246 and it's still in daily use.

[Bogdan Hlevca]

I totally agree with you and that's why I insisted that more information about what counts and what to compare would have helped more the orifinal poster. A technically correct answer did not help in the real world. 

 As you said, buying a monitor is a gamble these days.  Even past preformances do not gauarantee future performancess. Just look at the Asus ProArt series.

What is your opinon on ViewSonic monitors? I am afraid to buy an Asus after reading recent reviews.

[D Fosse]

I honestly believe that only two brands can be relied upon to deliver consistent quality: Eizo and NEC. You're safe with those two. Even their budget models will be better than the others' top models.

The NEC EA series, for instance, is very good. Eizo has a budget Color Edge range, the CS series, which is excellent, without really breaking the bank. Yes, they will be slightly more expensive than an Asus or a BenQ, but not that much, and more importantly - they will be worth it.

[Bogdan Hlevca]

The selected "correct" answer is wrong.  Please read the article at this link: monitor color gamuts 

For your conveneince I paste here the relevant part:

sRGB, AdobeRGB, NTSC, and CIE 1976
To quantify how many colors a device can handle, it uses one of the standardized color gamuts that define a particular range of colors. The most common of the RGB-based color gamuts is sRGB. This is the typical color gamut used for computer displays, TVs, cameras, video recorders, and related consumer electronics. It's one of the oldest and narrowest of the color gamuts used for computer and consumer electronics.

AdobeRGB was developed by Adobe as a color gamut to provide a wider range of colors than sRGB. The purpose was to give professionals a greater level of color when they work on graphics and photos before converting for print. The wider AdobeRGB gamut gives a better translation of colors to print than sRGB.

NTSC is the color space developed for the range of colors that can be represented to the human eye. It's also the only representative of the perceived colors that humans can see and isn't the widest color gamut possible. Many may think this has to do with the television standard that it's named after, but it's not. Most real-world devices to date can't reach this level of color in a display.

The last of the color gamuts that may be referenced in LCD monitor color ability is the CIE 1976. The CIE color spaces were one of the first ways to define mathematically specific colors. The 1976 version of this is a specific color space that charts the performance of other color spaces. It's generally fairly narrow and, as a result, is one that many companies use, as it tends to have a higher percentage number than the others.

To quantify the various color gamuts in terms of the relative range of color from narrowest to widest would be CIE 1976 < sRGB < AdobeRGB < NTSC. In general, displays are compared to the NTSC color standard unless stated otherwise.