How can I afford to use Photoshop when it costs $600/year?

[vince_heying]

I am a hobby photographer.  I have used Photoshop 4, 5, and 6.  Using Photoshop has generally cost me about $100/year or $200/2 years.

I, as is true of many hobby photographers, have enjoyed using PS to edit my images. I use only PS from the Creative Suite.  I use functions  that only PS provides, such as, layer masks.   It seems I must stick with Photoshop 13 (CS5) and hope that there will be addons to keep it current.  Any other suggestions?

[Noel Carboni]

I don't think so.  I believe it has to check every month unless you've pre-paid for the long subscription.

-Noel

[vince_heying]

That seems to imply that if I am unable to connect to the Internet at the time my software checks that software will be disabled. There have been a number of times in my travels that I have been unable to connect to the Internet.

So far I have not seen anything about a year long subscription, just month to month.

[Noel Carboni]

You have to be able to connect to the internet at least once a month if you sign up for the monthly plan.  If you sign a contract for a 1 year subscription you have to connect to the internet at least once every 99 days.

You really should read the FAQ:

http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdotcom/2013/05/answering-your-questions-about-photoshop-cc.html

-Noel

[vince_heying]

Thank for the link to the FAQ. This answers some questions.

It seems that if I buy a new camera such as the expected Canon 70D I am chained to ACR 8 or later for support. If I terminate CC I lose support for my 70D. I see I will need to become very friendly with Canon and their Digital Photo Professional. That will output to Photoshop now. At least I can get a permanent license today to Lightroom 5. That should provide support for a Canon 70D.

I noticed that the FAQ single-app membership does not include ACR. The FAQ says PS CC includes Bridge CC, 20GB cloud storage, ... But no mention of ACR.

I find nothing about Photoshop on two PCs. Currently I have PS on my desktop and laptop. I guess if I am preparing to travel I will need to deactivate PS on my desktop and then activate it on my laptop. And vice versa when I return.

Finally, I found nothing about reactivating a subscription. I guess you had better never cancel your subscription. You know cancel at year end, wait 90 days and reactivate, and save a few bucks.

It seems to make a lot of sense now that many photographers have transitioned to Lightroom. Get ACR with Lightroom and do your special editing in PS CS6.

Just some random thoughts. "Murphy was a genius!"

[charles badland]

I find nothing about Photoshop on two PCs.  Currently I have PS on my desktop and laptop.  I guess if I am preparing to travel I will need to deactivate PS on my desktop and then activate it on my laptop.  And vice versa when I return.

I'm pretty sure Adobe stays with the "installed on two computers" EULA in the CC license. The difference is, unlike the old perpetual license,  the computers can be different platforms (Mac or PC) . Which is one thing I like about the cloud move.

[Michael D Sullivan]

1.  ACR is part of Photoshop (and, with limited functionality, Elements).  Always has been; it's not available as a separate program.  Julianne Kost's blog has talked about some of the new functionality that will be available to PSCC users through ACR, so ACR is not an issue.

2.  Jeff Tranbury has said you will still be able to activate on two computers, but this includes both Mac and Windows computers.  Also, the activation process will be improved and more flexible.  If you already have two computers activated, you can deactivate previous activations, including ones where the computer is dead or unavailable.

[PhotoRoy1]

Noel,

I thought the idea behind the cloud was to keep the progam on the cloud so there would be no problems with the different OS etc. One would have to access the cloud to use the program. Is this true or is there a download available on the cloud membership?

Roy

[PhotoRoy1]

Remember that Adobe changed the buying aggreement. If you bought an upgraded version and wanted to return it you had to give up all your previous versions of Photoshop too.  I wouldn't upgrade to the cloud because then you may be stuck with no Photshop at all if you quit.

[Noel Carboni]

PhotoRoy1, I'm pretty sure that's not the case.  My expectation (and remember, I'm not with Adobe) is that if you were to terminate a Creative Cloud subscription some day in the future, you'd still have all the perpetual licenses for Photoshop you have purchased to fall back on - which means you'd be able to run Photoshop CS6 still.

Indeed, I'm pretty sure you'll be able to continue to run Photoshop CS6 even after installing Photoshop CC, so you will have never lost the ability to run it.

-Noel

[charles badland]

What I think is significantly missing is an exit strategy - where Adobe might provide you the ability to run (e.g., as a "perpetual license") an older version upon exiting the subscription model.

Noel, I know you have proposed a couple exit strategies involving perpetual licensees for older versions of PS-CC. I doubt Adobe would go for that, because even an older PS-CC would compete with their current PS-CC.

Tell me what you think of this:

Photoshop Restricted®. Every two years Adobe offers a perpetual version of the current Photoshop CC (Bridge and ACR).  This would be free for Cloud Members who have subscribed for those 2 years. For non-cloud users it could be bought for a nominal price, say $150 - $200. This Photoshop Restricted® would be a full version of Photoshop CC. Have all the features. All the bells and whistles. Open and edit the most recently made PSD files. 

BUT you would not be able to save a layered document. 

You could save as a flattened TIFF, JPG, a non-editable PDF.  Just not a PSD or layered TIFF.

This addresses many problems. It would not compete with Photoshop CC as it produces no usable (for a professional) document. It rewards and attracts loyal Cloud members and makes them secure in the fact that no mater what, their previous layered work will be available to them in a MEANINGFUL (ie editable) form.    It shows respect for the Photoshop user with decades of work that Adobe IS concerned that they have full access to layered files in the future. You just would not be able to create any new layered files.

[Noel Carboni]

I see your point, but in my gut I don't like the idea somehow.

Right now, today, Adobe feels the people who need it will prefer Creative Cloud, and they're continuing to sell Photoshop CS6 13.0 for everyone else.  Thus, for those who don't buy into the subscription, they have Photoshop CS6 to fall back on.

Photoshop CS6 13.0 is competing with Creative Cloud subscriptions NOW, yet half a million people have already signed up.

My (and Curt's) exit strategy proposals simply extend this into the future, so that the "perpetually licensed" Photoshop doesn't fall too far out of date, and become incapable of opening the files recently created.

It could be that Adobe plans to keep patching Photoshop CS6 so that it can read files saved with the future (newer) CC versions, and thus it Photoshop CS6 could serve forever more as the fallback "exit strategy".

-Noel

[vince_heying]

That is more or less the strategy I have decided to pursue. I will use Lightroom to stay current with ACR and use Photoshop CS6 for further editing. That is, until Lightroom becomes CC.

If I want to refine some photos using CC features, I will buy a couple of months. That is again, until the only output of CC is suffixed SCRW; and is viewable/usable only with CC.

At my age I am concerned only about a near term future. I believe that in a few short years I will give up photography. So I can kinds coast out.

[Semaphoric]

Seven months ago. I bought the upgrade to CS6, with the idea that I would use it for at least two years, and then consider any options available at that time. After much thought and consideration, that is still my plan.

From what I see from Adobe's product pages, the most salient new features in the Cloud versions of products I use are:

Nice sharpening in Photoshop, but a third-party plug-in might be just as good.

A real gimmicky type thing in Illustrator I'd never use.

A new "Dark" interface, like in PS and Illy, for InDesign (that's the most important new feature? ).

I doubt I'll be getting a new camera in the foreseeable future, so my current ACR is fine. And I've got to save up some money for a new video card with Open-GL drivers that work in Win8. And dollar for dollar, I think I'd get more done with a new (or used) 30" monitor, than I would with the likely incremental improvements ahead in the cloud.

[Trevor.Dennis]

Someone mentioned the Master Collection, and people who only use two or three apps.  I suspect the reason they don't use more is cost.  Lest ways that's how my relationship with Adobe has developed.  I only used Photoshop for many years, and then added Premiere Pro CS5, and InDesign CS5.  There are several apps in the full CC that I'd love to have installed, and now I will be able to afford to do so.  AFAICT it also marks an end to Adobe's price gouging.  I can get a full CC subscription for almost exactly the same cost as people in America.  That makes it a very attractive deal for me.

[Greg_Bohn]

> AFAICT it also marks an end to Adobe's price gouging.

  If you continue to use the software in the long term, I believe you might very well be experiencing another type of 'price gouging' where you pay more than you would if you had been able to buy the software outright.

  But, As Homer Simpson once said (in a 'The Simpsons" episode)

"But that's a problem for future Homer.  Man, I don't envy that guy".

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQvvmT3ab80)

[Trevor.Dennis]

Greg, things would have to change an awful for that to happen.  I paid very nearly NZ$1800 for Photoshop CS5.  That's US$1500 at today's rates.   I'd bought the Student Teacher version before that, but thought it would be a saving overall to pay the full price, and get on the upgrade discount path.  Well that didn't work out!   The upgrade from CS5 Extended to CS6 Extended still cost me NZ$800 (US$660) approaching double the price for the Student /Teacher version, and 50% more than the price for Adobe's American customers.   If I'd carried on upgrading to each new version of Photoshop, it would have cost me an average NZ$400/year.  Now I can get the full CC package for just US$240 for the first year, and $600/ year after that.  Why wouldn't I be happy with that?

[Greg_Bohn]

> Why wouldn't I be happy with that?

   Since you were getting jammed before with an additional 'gouge fee', the removal of that  part would clearly be better for you (I have no idea what the overseas pricing looks like, so I'll take your word).

   But, in a way that's like saying if someone is hitting your hand with a hammer, and then they stop, 'it feels so good' .

   For you, and your situation, and your buying pattern, you might be very happy with the new cloud only model.

  In the long run if your buying pattern gives you a net benefit on cost, if you don't care that that you have nothing when you end paying (maybe your rich enough to never have to stop paying, but I'm not), and you aren't concerned that Adobe will slack off on innovation, or that Adobe will jack up the price after they get enough lock-in, or about giving up your control, then this can be a net win for you.

  That being said, I still think that many people will be negatively affected and should be concerned about the short and long-term implications because of their situations.

  For many, I think this will be a large net loss in the long-term.

[Greg_Bohn]

>  Now I can get the full CC package for just US$240 for the first year,  and $600/ year after that.

>  Why wouldn't I be happy with that?

   Were you by any chance getting your software from Australia?

  I see that the Australian government called Adobe to task for having higher prices in Australia... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21406745,  http://www.afr.com/p/technology/adobe_cuts_australian_prices_after_BgBXyFaCrXRGNIrS1M2fNN , http://www.theverge.com/2013/2/12/3979690/adobe-reduces-price-of-creative-cloud-in-australia-ahead-o... .

  If so, that would appear to make a good chunk of your cost comparison benefit to have come from Adobe buckling to the Australian inquiry rather than the change from permanent license to Creative cloud.

[Trevor.Dennis]

Yes Greg, I have always been forcefully redirected to Adobe's Australian online store, where I have been charged up to 50% more for Adobe apps as folk in America.  I have followed Ed Husic for several years, and exchanged several emails with him.  That situation is the reason I spat the dummy and stopped posting to the Adobe forums.  Is the Australian and NZ CC pricing Adobe responding to the Oz enquiries?  I don't know, but I kind of doubt it.  They wouldn't even acknowledge the official enquiry a year ago.

I understand that European pricing for CC subscriptions, is higher than American, but the Oz and NZ dollars are flying high right now, so that might have something to do with it. It’s all roundabouts and swings to me, because, although I live in New Zealand, most of my income comes from the UK, so I take a serious hit on the exchange rate.

[Greg_Bohn]

> Is the Australian and NZ CC pricing Adobe responding to the Oz enquiries?  I don't know, but I kind of doubt it.

   According to the referenced articles, they seem to say that Adobe cut their prices for Australia back in February, 2013 and that it was in response to the inquiry summons.

   At any rate, the timing would then be before the recent announcement of the dropping of the perpetual license and any associated changes with it...

[Trevor.Dennis]

I should have added that the last few Photoshop updates have included features that have saved me many hours of processing time, plus I can now make a way nicer job of that processing.  I can remember a lot of folk here being very excited about ACR7 for instance.   A story I love is about a buddy who won a Gold Medal in the PSNZ National Exhibition with a fungi shot.  He explained how it was cold, and he was wearing mohair gloves, that left a tiny hair across the fungi's gills.  (These are very tiny fungi - about 15mm high) and it took him hours to remove the hair using the Clone tool.  The Healing brush had just come out, and I enjoyed demonstrating the same repair with a single stroke!  Time is money - as they say.  I'd hate to be without some of the new features introduced since CS2 or CS3.

[Greg_Bohn]

It seems to me that it's backwards to be looking for ways to sufficiently cripple Photoshop so that it might satisfy Adobe.

  In my view, Adobe implemented a very Customer-unfriendly unilateral change in order to squeeze it's existing/future user base harder. So, I think it's appropriate to be unhappy with shabby treatment.

  (Yes, I know that some people may benefit in the short term from the changes, but in my mind the subscription only model is a bit like a Tobacco company hawking reduced-price cigarettes. For some, it may seem like a good deal for now, but it's probably going to be bad for you in the long run, the price is going to go up, you have nothing left when you stop, and once you start it's going to be hard to quit . )

   I'd rather live with what I have (and look for alternatives) than try to cajole them into making a crippled version.

[Greg_Bohn]

> Based on this policy I believe we will find Adobe will have a policy to  penalize customers

>who do not maintain a continuous subscription.

  They're most likely betting that you won't want to risk the period where you don't have any access at all. That's probably penalty enough for most.

[Blacktip75]

I share your pain as a hobby photographer, I finally bit the bullet and switched from Gimp to Photoshop CS6 less then a year ago. As I am in the US often I bought a US version, now they want to rip me off with a $400 a year subscription for PS alone (EU Prices are a near criminal rip off, 600 a year is probably AU prices right? Edit, I just noticed AU is no longer being robbed, only EU is over 50% more expensive now). Guess no upgrades on Photoshop, I still use Lightroom as my workflow start so I don't have problems for some time.

Most fun will be my developers at work, I am not signing off on cloud software due to medical regulation, so no more PS upgrades for the design team... that will not be popular for certain. Finance will love it though, we will save tens of thousands in license costs by going Gimp

[charles badland]

The problem is not the Cloud. The problem, as I see it, is the pricing. Adobe will greatly benefit from moving to a continuously upgraded Cloud service (I assume more difficult to pirate). And I believe Adobe users could benefit  as well from this continuous cloud setup.

BUT, the price of Cloud access is much more than one would pay for a perpetual license, even if the user upgraded every 18 months. For example, the CS6 Web and Design Suite is $1900. And upgrades run about $375 every 18 months. So in 10 years as professional user, who keeps up to date with each version, would spend about $3800. Compare that to a 10-year Cloud license of $6000.

I don’t know who placed the price-point, but in my opinion this Cloud pricing model  hurts the “mid-range" user the most. Someone who uses maybe 3 or 4 Adobe apps. Which I believe is the majority of Adobe's clientele.  Bad call by Adobe Marketing IMO.