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August 19, 2023
Question

'Requiring' Mac OS 13+ is not a good move

  • August 19, 2023
  • 13 replies
  • 26597 views

I'm using an early Macbook Pro 13" (A1502) on Monterey. Today I update to latest Photoshop Beta 25.0 and Lightroom Classic 15.2 release/Camera Raw 15/5 and get the message:

Mac OS X version 13.4.0 or later is recommended for maximum performance and correct operation of Adobe Photoshop 2024. An earlier version of Mac OS X was detected.

What kind of (lack of) support is this? I and others are being forced to cancel our subscriptions if Adobe cannot maintain support for perfectly fine and fast legacy machines. Please stop resorting to anti-consumer practices (radical obsolesence) for their financial benefit.

There are other systems out there, and the only thing keeping me (and others) loyal is our stubborness to confront the learning curve of a new environment.

This topic has been closed for replies.

13 replies

ProDesignTools
Community Expert
Community Expert
October 25, 2023

Technology is going to keep marching on – that's never going to change. And Adobe moves ahead the OS version requirements in order to take advantage of the latest available capabilities in their newest Creative Cloud releases.


But since the very beginning of Creative Cloud, Adobe has said they would not force customers to upgrade, and by implication, to have to buy new computers. To make good on this promise, subscribers need to be able to access prior releases for older systems (especially Macs) which cannot support the newest CC versions.

 

In recent years, Adobe has limited this access to only the current release and the one prior. This is called their "N-1" Policy. Now, today, this means that macOS Big Sur (version 11.0) or later is required, since it's the minimum for both CC 2024 and CC 2023. This rules out everybody who, for whatever reason, is running macOS 10.15 Catalina and earlier.

 

As others have commented above, some older Creative Cloud releases are still available for direct download, but the choice is limited and it is unclear if those links will be available indefinitely.

 

I think it's not enough to say that folks can keep their old systems and versions in a frozen, isolated bubble, without ever needing to reinstall their apps... "Things happen," components fail, products can need reinstalling. If paying customers do not have ready access to those prior CC releases for their otherwise-perfectly-adequate machines, they are out of luck.

 

And since Adobe generally does not make complete standalone installers available anymore for CC users (unless you ask), then people aren't aware they need to have in hand the installers that they can no longer get, until it's too late.

 

I think Adobe urgently needs to do something about this, lest they continue to lose paying customers who can no longer access a Creative Cloud version that will run on their systems. "N-1" should be expanded to a wider window of previous releases (as it used to be), while disavowing all official support on anything older than N-1 and simply asking that any subscribers who need support for those prior releases just come here to the Forums instead.

 

Adobe of course still has all those older installers, should they decide to make them available – so it's just a policy change, really. I sincerely hope they do something about this soon.

jane-e
Community Expert
Community Expert
October 14, 2023

 

[I] get the message: Mac OS X version 13.4.0 or later is recommended for maximum performance and correct operation of Adobe Photoshop 2024. An earlier version of Mac OS X was detected.

By @Jay Matthews

 

By my count, this is the fourth or fifth time Apple has made a change to their OS that forced me to buy a new computer. Windows 11 can still run many PS versions that macOS cannot. I've stuck with Mac — but knowing this, I don't blame Adobe. 

 

BTW, the last version of OSX was macOS 10.15 (Catalina). Then we had 11, 12, 13 and now macOS 14 (Sonoma).

 

Jane

 

gener7
Community Expert
Community Expert
October 13, 2023

There has been problems with the new Remove Tool not working correctly. The usual fix is to set the Remove Tool Image Processing setting from "Quicker" to "Stable". 

 

Yesterday, someone reported they fixed that problem upgrading to Ventura. That's why it's "recommended."

If you do not use certain features and they don't interfere with your workflow, you are good for now.

 

Consider "recommended" a "yellow light", because in some future version you will be locked out of the upgrade if it has what you want.

 

Known Participant
October 14, 2023

So when I said that this is a warning that a forced upgrade is 'just around the corner' I was absolutely correct, yes?

gener7
Community Expert
Community Expert
October 14, 2023

No, it's a warning that your OS/hardware cannot effectively run the latest Ps. You need to check your system requirements. If you can't afford to upgrade and you are getting your work done, you are not forced in any way. Your customers likely don't care what you use as long as you meet deadlines. Adobe is improving their professional grade software and they have to require systems that support it.


CC 2018 could run on this, but not CC 2024

https://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/system-requirements/earlier-versions.html

 

 

  • Multicore Intel processor with 64-bit support
  • macOS version 10.13 (High Sierra), macOS version 10.12 (Sierra), or Mac OS X version 10.11 (El Capitan)
  • 2 GB or more of RAM (8 GB recommended)
  • 4 GB or more of available hard-disk space for installation; additional free space required during installation (cannot install on a volume that uses a case-sensitive file system)
  • 1024 x 768 display (1280x800 recommended) with 16-bit color and 512 MB or more of dedicated VRAM; 2 GB is recommended*
  • OpenGL 2.0-capable system

 

Roman Villarreal
Participant
October 12, 2023

Totally agreed. Why should I have to get a new Mac Pro just to satisfy Creative Cloud? Adobe - make CC compatible with older systems. Many of your customers are running powerful older systems that can operate CC just fine.

Legend
October 12, 2023

That's not how modern computing works. Microsoft had a TERRIBLE time with people not wanting to upgrade from Windows XP, and that lesson has been very well learned. There have been huge changes on both platforms in the last few years (at the very least, Apple Silicon and Windows 11) which require work to maintain compatibility. Trying to support legacy systems which Apple no longer supports is crazy.

Having said that, the current version of Photoshop still runs fine on my 2015 15" Macbook Pro with Monterey, although much slower than my M1 desktop. Even a current, entry-level M2 Mac mini or Macbook Air is faster than pretty much any Intel Mac.

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/G16L7LL/A/refurbished-mac-mini-apple-m2-chip-with-8%E2%80%91core-cpu-and-10%E2%80%91core-gpu?fnode=66c12d5a40726af58db427a95f186ae63064c6248fc9722993a4320428528527cd81e80ed732265f4945c8acd0a342ab412bead9b8aacafb2c724f47612e885a17cd75496e19389b2721376497a5c03e

US$1019 with M2, 16GB RAM, 1GB SSD.

Participant
September 28, 2023

My computer is none of the latest ones out there and yet very powerful for my work, and it let's me update my operating system up to a certain one but not to the latest. I do not understand why Adobe has to make it difficult for users to have to meet certain system requirements and take away the apps that work with older operating systems. You are trying to force me into either a new operating system which I can't upgrade to and this forces me to consider investing in a new computer just so I can meet your requirements AND THIS IS NOT NICE. I do not appreciate this gesture from Adobe. I would like to suggest that Adobe allows flexibility in this since not all of us are looking to have the latest and greatest gadgets in technology all the time but simply to keep using what we own because it still working great. Please allow for apps to work on older operating systems AND BE CONSIDERATE OF YOUR COSTUMERS, remember that it is we the customer who keeps your business alive. Thanks.

mglush
Community Expert
Community Expert
September 29, 2023

Hi!

There are many who feel the same way yo do. I do want to ask--what OS are you running on your mac? There are a few older versions that you can download from www.prodesigntools.com such as 2018 and be able to run on older Macs. Let us know if that is helpful?

Michelle

Legend
September 28, 2023

I'm not exactly an Adobe cheerleader but hyperbole and misinformation aren't helpful.

- You DO NOT need to upgrade macOS to run PS 25.0. I have it on two Intel/Monterey Macs including my work 2019 MacBook Pro and its just fine. And yes I got the alert.

- Newer Intel Macs can run Ventura and Sonoma (released yesterday). Apple has an official list of supported computers on its Sonoma page (scroll to the bottom.) https://www.apple.com/macos/sonoma/

- I own a 2015 15" MBP that I love but yes, sadly, I'll have to upgrade in the next year. I found a refurb MacBook Air on Apple's online store for ~US$1200 that I'm eyeing. Upgrading hardware to stay in sync with software changes is just a part of modern computing. On Windows, a bunch of older but serviceable computers are not usable with Windows 11 so its not just Apple.

- I work as a professional photographer (make my living exclusively from photography) and I use Photoshop, Bridge, and Lightroom Classic every single day. I understand the importance of working tools. Yes, Adobe has problems with bugs. I was part of the pre-release program for Bridge and reported literally hundreds of issues to the developers. But still, I am able to use their software well enough to do my job. And every profession requires people to remain current with their toolset.

- There isn't some grand conspiracy going on. Newer computers and software have new capabilities. If you don't need those (and are fine with potential security problems) then keep using the older system. Nobody will make you upgrade anything.

Participant
September 28, 2023

The arguements for just not upgrading expose a major flaw in Adobes business model based on subscritions for upgrades.

The monthly fee is to pay for new feature upgrades and if you can no longer upgrade why should you pay for monthly features you no longer get, but rather keep using the same software you have. This breaks the subscription business model as you have to keep paying to even use the software you have which is no longer supported on your machine? In essence you are paying for something you no longer recieve?This is breaking the consumer promise in moving to a subscription model.
Adobe should be required to add features to the older software versions on an older OS versions that would not require the new OS capabilities?

Kevin Stohlmeyer
Community Expert
Community Expert
September 28, 2023

Your argument is flawed and has been debated since Creative Cloud was released in 2013.

You are paying a subscription fee for access to the software and add-ons like fonts, Express, etc - period. What "consumer promise" was ever given?

 

Access to the newer features is the responsibility of the user to maintain compatibility. Adobe has a responsibility to keep their software compatible with the current OS releases for Windows and Apple.

If your hardware/OS can handle the new features then by all means take advantage of it, but its not a required upgrade. If it can't update your OS or Adobe Creative Cloud, you can continue to use the version that is compatible, but you still need to pay for licensing.

 

Demanding Adobe add newer features to older versions is not possible. Older computers cannot handle the GPU loads alone required to run newer features makes that a moot point. It's like asking to add flex fuel or rechargeable electric battery capabilities to my 1990s car. Do you expect the fuel company to pay for that? No. It's up to the consumer to pay and upgrade the equipment to handle it.

Participant
September 23, 2023

I can still drag and drop from LRC to PS 2024.  But will I have full PS capabilities?

 

Participating Frequently
September 23, 2023

Wish I knew what LRC was.

Participant
September 23, 2023

Sorry - Lightroom Classic

loisr888
Participating Frequently
September 14, 2023

I'm right there with you! #angry & ready to DUMP ADOBE. I am not a billionaire, I am a freelance designer who cannot afford a new computer every time ADOBE makes a change. My iPad is already aging out & ADOBE hasn't even added new features there, and my laptop is now rendered useless. All for a monthly fee. I AM SO SICK OF THIS!

Known Participant
September 23, 2023

I'm in exactly the same position. My mac is very quick and adequate for my needs. I can't possibly afford a new one.  Adobe seem to be doing many deeply unpopular things lately. I'm just waiting for the grim message of death: "this software requires a later version etc" which I reckon is just around the corner.

Dave Creamer of IDEAS
Community Expert
Community Expert
September 23, 2023

So don't upgrade your software beyond what your OS can support   It's that simple. And it's not [fill in software company here] fault. 

David Creamer: Community Expert (ACI and ACE 1995-2023)
gener7
Community Expert
Community Expert
September 1, 2023

If it didn't prohibit the install, you are safe for now. MacOS 11 and 12 are still the minimum.

Participant
October 17, 2023

Now they're asking MacOs 12 or later for Premiere/AE. Even if you have a good old computer. Apple limit your updating and then Adobe hangs their updating to newer OSs.

Kevin Stohlmeyer
Community Expert
Community Expert
October 17, 2023

Hi @Daniel25520793gavh shouting into the void isn't going to change reality. There is a cost with our industry and software/hardware upkeep is one of them.

 

HOWEVER as @Lumigraphics pointed out - you do have a choice and you are in control. If you cannot (due to hardware, budget, philosophical, etc.) or wish not to upgrade your OS, you can remain on that OS until it fails and continue to use the current compatible software builds. No one is going to "outmode" the OS or software installed.

 

However, if you wish to utilize newer features in software then yes, you will need to upgrade your OS and if your Mac cannot handle the update, you would have to purchase a new Mac that is compatible.

 

This is the reality we live in but its not an "upgrade or die" situation - I have an older Mac that cannot accept Monterey 10.15 either but I can still run circles around most with that older setup than others can with a new Mac Studio and current builds. You use what you have when you need to and make the best of the situation.