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The disk copy was changed since you last opened it.

Participant ,
Jan 18, 2012

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..... Do you want to save it anyway?

I'm starting to get this message again a lot. It went away for awhile, and is now back.

It started with CS5.

I think Adobe blames it on other software but cannot pinpoint it?

Can anyone fill me in?

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The disk copy was changed since you last opened it.

Participant ,
Jan 18, 2012

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..... Do you want to save it anyway?

I'm starting to get this message again a lot. It went away for awhile, and is now back.

It started with CS5.

I think Adobe blames it on other software but cannot pinpoint it?

Can anyone fill me in?

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Jan 18, 2012

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See the previous discussions. Yes, it is caused by something outside of Photoshop.

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Participant ,
Jan 18, 2012

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Thanks Chris. Can you reveal/distilll on this new simplified thread what I need to due to eliminate it?

(I went through the morass of threads and could not decipher it)

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Mentor ,
Jan 18, 2012

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You can't eliminate it.  You just live with it.

____________

Wo Tai Lao Le

我太老了

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Mentor ,
Jan 18, 2012

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As for the cause, it can be any of a variety of things:  the Finder itself, a font manager (e,g. Suitcase), Dropbox, etc.

____________

Wo Tai Lao Le

我太老了

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Jan 18, 2012

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Unless you can find which other app it is, you can't do much.

And there are indications that (at least on MacOS) the problem may be with the OS, Finder, or TimeMachine.

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Participant ,
Jan 19, 2012

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Thanks T and Chris.

Appreciate the honesty.

But Chris, even if it's the fault of something else, it started with CS5, and it only comes up with this app, no?

If that is true, there must be something with the devolepment with CS5 that is not happy with certain things on the OS.

I'm suppose you guys are working on it. Maybe it'll just diappear one day.

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Jan 19, 2012

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Photoshop does a lot of error checking when opening and saving files -- more than most other applications. So Photoshop catches more errors, and reports them to the user.

Yes, we keep working on issues like this, and rarely find them to be actual bugs in our code - but find lots of third party bugs.

Unfortunately, many of these are system specific and won't reproduce elsewhere.

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Participant ,
Jan 19, 2012

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Thanks Chris, I see. I don't want to rehash anything, but I think most laymen like me would be befuddled that PS is checking something that touches another app or utility and then bringing up an error.

I'm ok with it -- T's philsoply is zen like and well just wait for it to pass one day.

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Jan 19, 2012

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Imagine if you're working in Painter and Photoshop -- you don't want Photoshop to save over what you just saved in Painter, you'd probably like to know it was changed instead of losing that work.

And Photoshop can see if the file changed and ask if you want to open the updated file.

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Participant ,
Jan 19, 2012

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Sort of hard to get my head around that Chris. I know if would be tiring to expand on that. I get the premise a bit. but maybe you can make this a prefernce in the future -- like with maximize capability..?

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Jan 19, 2012

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We can't easily make error checking a preference.

("would you like you knife with a handle, or do you like bleeding a lot?")

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New Here ,
Apr 06, 2012

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kevin4545 wrote:

Thanks Chris. Can you reveal/distilll on this new simplified thread what I need to due to eliminate it?

(I went through the morass of threads and could not decipher it)

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Community Beginner ,
Apr 27, 2012

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Here's how I eliminated the issue on a Mac using Lion. Make sure the window that contains the file is not open on the desktop. As long as I do that, I don't get the message. Whenever I forget to close it, I do get the message. Hope this helps you.

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LEGEND ,
Apr 27, 2012

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Nice of you to follow up with helpful info, gozgirl02, but could you please be just a little more specific?

Is that a Finder window that contains the file on the desktop, or maybe Bridge?  Details make all the difference.

-Noel

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Community Beginner ,
Apr 27, 2012

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Sure. It is open in the Finder window. I don't use Bridge.I also noticed it doesn't seem to make a difference whether I have the window in icon view or as a list - causes the problem either way.

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New Here ,
May 08, 2012

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i can't believe it, but I think this worked for me too. Pretty stupid that the mac OSX is doing weird stuff like that in relation to my photoshop files. that annoying 'do you want to save cause it already has been or something' pop up was driving me mad. thanks for the help gozgirl02.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2012

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You seem to be concentrating on the effect of the error checking...  The implication above is that something the system is doing is (unexpectedly) touching the file.  Wouldn't it be best to understand what that is all about and correct it, anticipate it, or configure around it?

Is this happening on all Mac systems?

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 20, 2012

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Neil, that's for me? don't understand. The error comes on only with one app. PHotoshop. It comes up after you save a file. That's it. It's a total nuisance. I click command S to save. and then the message comes up.

It's not even an error message. It's saying something in the file has changed -- of course, I'm working on the file. I decide it's time to do a save. And it's asking if I want to save, something has changed.

One of the all time nuisances of a major software.  I'm going to live with it as T says.  If you know more what this is about let me know. I'd love to get rid of it.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2012

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It was kind of addressed to Chris...  All I'm saying is that there's an implication here that something is systemically touching (or possibly altering) files while you are editing them, and that's most certainly not something that should be tolerated or ignored.

Either it's the normal way a Mac system works (which I don't know but I doubt) or something you specifically have running on your system is causing it, which you should understand and possibly change.  If the former (normal operation), then Adobe needs to change the way Photoshop works, because the error message is bogus.

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 20, 2012

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Noel, you don't get this message?

In previous versions I never saw this. Now it comes up. I love to know how to remove it. 

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2012

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I get it just fine.

In computers nothing is magic.  Even in Macs.

Something is triggering logic in Photoshop that checks to see if any changes have been made to a file since you opened it.  You would not normally expect that to happen.  Another poster above has indicated it happens a lot and should just be ignored.  I say get to the bottom of why it's happening because it just might be important.

It might be that OSX is now doing something it didn't when your version of Photoshop was designed or it might be that something you've installed is doing it.  Any reason not to try to find out just what it is?

-Noel

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2012

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To further what I just said, if it DOES turn out to be something you've installed or configured on your system that's unexpectedly touching the file, then whose job do you think it is to diagnose and correct the problem?

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 20, 2012

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Noel writes:

"Any reason not to try to find out just what it is?"

I'm all ears Noel!

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Participant ,
Jan 20, 2012

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BTW, I am very grateful to Adobe, PHotoshop, and Chris Cox --great software.  Not moaning here.....

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 20, 2012

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kevin4545 wrote:

...In previous versions I never saw this. Now it comes up. I love to know how to remove it. 

Others have seen this in many different versions of Photoshop. Search the forum for many discussions about this.  When you say that you cannot decipher it, neither can anyone else. It is a transient quirk. It all comes down to something unique to your system. Something might have changed around the time you added CS5 but that does not mean CS5 caused it.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2012

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Unfortunately I'm no Mac expert - I'm all about Windows.  But surely someone here should be able to direct you to ways to find out what is touching your file unexpectedly, beyond just vague references to parts of OSX or just telling you to ignore it.  I was just encouraging you not to give up on just those answers.

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 20, 2012

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Marian,

let me ask. Are people noticing this more with CS5? I've never seen it before that edition.

Now of the 100 appications I have, this only comes up with Photoshop CS5.

Beyond that I have no idea how to kill, if you or anyone else on the forum does let know.

If T says, and he knows a lot, that you have to live with it -- I'm not expecting then too much help here.

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Participant ,
Jan 22, 2012

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Ok, it happend again, right after doing a few things to the file in PHotoshop, clearly it's a photoshop thing 100%. Though I respect Noel and Chris so I posted to a few Mac forums and they all concur, they are also aware of the problem, lot of Photoshop users there,  and that nothing substantial changes to the file on the Mac OS and the issue is 100% with CS5.

One of my favorite posters, Mac genius -- , summed it up (with his permission) :

OS X may indeed touch the file (for example, it may read the file's name and add the file to the Spotlight index), but that doesn't actually change the file.

I am skeptical of Adobe's claims, since earlier versions of Photoshop don't have this problem. There are actually several different dates and times stored with a file on OS X: the date and time the file was created, the date and time the file was modified on disk, and the date and time the file was last accessed. I think, based on what I've observed, that in the past, Photoshop looked at the date and time the file was modified, which is what it should do; it appears that CS5 looks at the date and time the file was accessed, which is the wrong thing to do (as the file may be accessed by, for example, indexing it or placing it in another program--but that does not actually modify it).

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LEGEND ,
Jan 22, 2012

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I wonder how he determined it's looking at the "last accessed" date.  That would indeed be wrong operation.  Chris, that should be easy to determine.

For what it's worth, on Windows the very same concepts apply (though the implementation is of course different), and I have never seen it myself nor heard anyone else claim this problem has happened to them on Windows.  I'm not all-knowing, but it seems to me to be Mac-specific.

By the way, I think in context the word "touch" has more specific meaning than Mac Genius has led you to believe.  "Touching" a file in the Unix world usually means changing its modification date, not the last accessed date.

-Noel

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Jan 22, 2012

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Nope, we're looking at the file modification date, not "last accessed".

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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From the Mac guy:

"When I have observed this problem happening, I've looked at the modification date of the file Photoshop wrongly believes was changed, and it's the same as it was...so something weird is going on there. Whatever the problem, Photoshop CS2 behaves correctly, which makes the "It's OS X!" claim sound very fishy indeed."

-----

Noel, it seems this issue is just for the Mac group then if you say it's not with Windows. Photoshop has a really weird bug in CS5 with Mac users. Hopefully they will fix it.  I wish you were on a Mac Noel!

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Noel Carboni wrote:

...I have never seen it myself nor heard anyone else claim this problem has happened to them on Windows...

Here is Windows doing the same thing...

change.png

Windows has the same file check and error message. What Windows does not have is a wonky OS or background process that is modifying the file as much as OS X might. (Do not insert platform flame war here. I'm just pointing out something I observe as a user of both platforms.) There's good reason to believe OS X can be improved in regard to how the OS handles image files.

For the related discussion to this topic, check here. Google is your [gossipy] friend. 

There is troubleshooting logic that is being ignored here. If this was truly a bug for all users of PSCS5 on Mac, all users of PSCS5 Mac would be seeing this. If this was unique to CS5, we would not have seen similar posts from before the advent of CS5. The fact that it is spotty indicates that certain users have their system configured in unique ways. You need to figure out what is unique about your system. This was mentioned by this topic's first responders.

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Marian,

I open a file in photoshop, I work on it for 2 minutes, then this nusance sign comes up. It's the fault of the OS?

It only comes up in PS, not Word, Excel, or 100 other apps, only Photoshop etc.

But listen I'm all ears.

I have not heard one suggestion on what to do.

If you think I should post more on Mac forums, I don't mind trying that...

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 24, 2012

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You've had suggestions about the possible causes and it was assumed that you would consider disabling those possible causes.

From where are you opening the file? Is the file on your desktop where the OS always generates icon previews? Save your files elsewhere. Are you opening it from an open Finder window with a large icon preview? Don't generate previews with Finder. Uncheck show preview column in Finder's display. Are you running TimeMachine? Try life without it. Are you running anti-virus? Disable it. Are you using Spotlight? Turn it off.

You have never stated what you have running on your system or what troubleshooting steps you have taken. I don't even see a mention of which kitty you are using. Meet us half-way.

From the very first post you have been told that it is any number of things. You need to experiment to see which thing it is.

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Marion, I running 100 things. I Don't run antivirus, macs don't need them.

Images are on exeternal hard drive. I don't think previews are the issue as they have not been in issue on last 7 versions of photoshop.

Honestly, I did start using time machine for the first time a few months ago.

But really, if CS5 has an issue with Time Machine, the engineers should fix that, Time Machine is pretty important...no?

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 24, 2012

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kevin4545 wrote:

...I Don't run antivirus, macs don't need them...

This ends my ability to further converse with you. You're just not aware of your machine and have an attitude that does not seem to want to learn.

If you are running Snow Leopard or Lion (we still have no idea which), you are most certainly runnin...

The usefulness of Time Machine varies. There are practical reasons for a power user (such as a Photoshop user) to disable it or limit its function.

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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I'm all ears Marian.

I'm not a Mac genius, but I am more aware of my machine than probably 99% of mac users in the general population.

I love to learn, and would love to hear what you have to say.

I don't think you have one iota of knowledge how to solve this issue and hence you are throwing out generalzations that are totally irrelevant to this thread.

I don't think Noel or Chris or anyone has any idea about this isse.

I think T is one of the smartest PS guys on the board and he has given up too. He advice it just live with it. So that's what I'm going to do!

But please don't put the blame on the Mac OS, or users who come on the forum asking for help.

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 24, 2012

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I don't think T is running CS5. If he did, I would suspect that he would know how to get around this problem of yours.  He seems more familiar with his system.

I'm throwing out generalizations to someone who is so ambiguous that he cannot even describe which kitty he is using. How is someone (such as the Adobe engineer who gave you some attention here) supposed to understand the problem that needs to be fixed if you cannot fully describe the problem?

I run Photoshop on Mac. I don't have this problem. So you are correct that I have no iota on how to solve your problem. Only you can solve this. ...not an Adobe engineer.

I put no blame on anyone asking for help here. I blame people that fail to fully describe their problem and expect a detailed solution.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Kevin, have you yourself actually verified that the file modification date is not changed (i.e., is set to a time before you started editing the file) when this message comes up?

-Noel

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 24, 2012

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kevin4545 wrote:

...But please don't put the blame on the Mac OS...

We are fully entitled to blame Mac OS with silliness like this:

http://forums.adobe.com/message/3638147#3638147

OS X and Finder have some weird crap going on. Mac OS can certainly be improved. You don't have to be embarrased that you bought into a wonky system.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Heh.  Windows is wonky too, just differently so. 

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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Honesly, you guys are lot smarter than me, so I going to declear and move on.  Perhpas you are correct. so my apologies. I think you will agree, this would be quite hard to eliminate or solve on a forum chat.

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Participant ,
Jan 24, 2012

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final PS, received a nice PM from T, turned my head around, did not know or think about spotlight and time machine etc, but, devils advocate, I gave the gist of that info to my Mac friend (I just a dolt by comparison, so don't get mad at me), but this was his interesting reply

..."

.......... But what he is not paying attention to is that even though Time Machine, Spotlight, and other apps may touch a file (by adding it to the Spotlight index or by adding it to a list of files to be backed up), they don't modify it. The modification date remains unchanged; in fact, it would HAVE to, or else it would be worthless!

  At the end of the day, Photoshop is reporting that a file has been modified when the file has *not* been modified. That is incorrect on Photoshop's part no matter what excuse is given.

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 24, 2012

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I am also getting this error with Photoshop 5.5 and OS Lion. Yesterday the Finder crashed and when I rebooted and opened Photoshop, every Photoshop file I had worked on that afternoon was corrupt - nothing else was affected. Desktop preview icons looked fine but when I opened them they were just odd colors and all layers were gone. The jpgs I had saved from psd were also corrupt. Don't know if this has anything to do with the error message. Adobe blames Apple and Apple blames Adobe.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 25, 2012

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Kevin, what is your os version? You could give the beginning of help>system info. (do not but the serial)

Could you give a list of the running applications? (this might be the critical part, somehow your system has something that triggers that issue, most other posters don't.)

Did you try to run only Photoshop? Off the network?

If other posters reported the same issue on other forums, invite them to post in this very thread (it is the only one with an Adobe Engineer in there), and have them list their system info, and programs. Until a pattern, or common denominator is found, there would be no way to fix the problem.

Does it occur if files are stored on an internal disk?

Did you try to replace the cable that connects the external disk? (checking the physical layer is step one in basic troubleshooting)

Thanks for helping us help you.

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Participant ,
Jan 25, 2012

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thanks PE, I'm on 12.0, images are on external hard drives.  Running apps are office and 10 others. If Chris or another engineer wants to PM for into, thats' cool, I'll answer detailed questions, but really, the issue is not even predicatble, it's intermittant.

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 25, 2012

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Is "12.0" a Lion, or a Snow Leopard, or a Precise Pangolin, or a dumb Raccoon?

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Participant ,
Jan 25, 2012

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JO, no reason to be so snarky/ cocky. I never understand the bad behavior of the vertans here which is so unusal for a forum.  This happens elsewhere, but it seems (the abrasiveness) to be on another level on Adobe Photoshop forums. I don't get it.   Says 12.00 under CS5. I'm sorry!  I'm on Snow Leopard. 

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 25, 2012

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There's nothing snarky or cocky about asking you to answer the most basic troubleshooting questions.  You still have not answered some good questions from Noel. Nobody here is a mind reader and nobody here is able to see your computer. You've really got to work on communicating. That is why I suggested that you review this discussion. <-- That's a link. Click it. Read it. Learn.

You complained that you went through the "morass of threads [on this topic] and could not decipher it". We've gone through 48 posts until you decided to get around to explaining some very basic system info. By stringing us all along with no details, you've contributed to your own morass.  You've made it very hard for anyone else to decipher your troubles.

As the most basic troubleshooting step, you should be sure that your Photoshop software (and system 10.6.8) is up to date.  How would you know if Adobe has fixed your problem if you don't even have the latest update to Photoshop?

You are a veteran here too. You should know better about supplying useful information so that others can help you.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 25, 2012

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kevin4545 wrote:

I don't get it.

Hey Kevin, the reason people may be getting a bit miffed is that you have come here looking for help, but you have provided virtually no info that could be useful for someone to help you, and you are clearly unwilling to provide any more, nor to answer specific questions.

I think by now we've pretty much determined there's no [ ] Stop Photoshop From Popping Up That Darned Message checkbox for you to configure.


You're actually rather lucky Chris Cox has taken notice of you and your issue at all.  He doesn't get paid to do so.  A bunch of other folks who also don't get paid to come on here and try to help you (and who know what they're doing) have asked you nicely for more information, and now you say you'll only provide it via PM to an engineer.  Think about that...  Your attitude hasn't been all that good here either, wouldn't you say?

But hey, keep it up.  Maybe someone will turn up that checkbox for you.  I'm starting to wonder whether the ultimate answer for you may be in getting a better computer.  One that actually just works.

Being the nice guy that I am, I really AM going to try to help you once more:  If your Photoshop reads 12.00 (which we found out after 48 posts), and it doesn't work right, perhaps you should consider installing the latest update to Photoshop, which is 12.0.4.  Adobe makes it so easy that even the most casual user should be able to update it.  Please let us know how that goes.

Good luck.

-Noel

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Participant ,
Jan 25, 2012

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I'm talking now about tone. There is often a really negative/ angry tone. No need for that.

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Participant ,
Jan 25, 2012

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What funny Noel, is that you are the nicest guy in the world on the PHoto Pro forum, but on this forum, you come out of the gate also with a very confrontational tone too. 

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 25, 2012

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I don't think you understand the tone of this discussion any better than you understand your computer. You would not be hearing negativity and anger. You would be hearing laughter.  This topic is a joke.

Have you updated Photoshop yet or are you wasting everyone's time here?


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New Here ,
Jan 25, 2012

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Marian - It's obvious you could use a vacation.

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 25, 2012

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Can we please all focus on Kevin's legitimate issue here? There are many of us receiving the same error. I thought this forum was about sharing information, not sniping at each other.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 25, 2012

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Most of us have been trying to focus on the actual problem.  Kevin, my tone has been level throughout this thread; I'm sorry if you misinterpreted it.  I probably misinterpreted yours, though honestly I don't know any other way to interpret your refusing to even acknowledge questions posed directly to you.  I think I'll just duck out.  Best of luck.

-Noel

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Valorous Hero ,
Jan 25, 2012

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The only person not focussing on Kevin's issue is Kevin. Perhaps you need to review this entire thread to realize the nonsense.  Kevin is unwilling to keep his Photoshop up-to-date or to explain what troubleshooting steps he has taken. If he pulled this crap with paid Adobe tech support, I'm sure they would hang up on him.

If you have this same problem, be smarter and more proactive than Kevin. Review the ideas in this discussion and the other lengthy discussions on it. Try all the suggestions until you find success. 

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/805868?start=0&tstart=0

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 08, 2012

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I had the same problem then took advice of one of the posters and quit extensis suitcase processes in the activity viewer and that solved it.  (I downloaded a trial version of Suitcase Fusion a few days ago)

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 08, 2012

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I'm a little confused. Did your problem start after you loaded Suitcase Fusion, or are you attributing Suitcase Fusion with solving the problem?

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Feb 08, 2012

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Removing Suitcase Fusion solved the problem.

The problem was caused by Suitcase Fusion modifying the files.

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LEGEND ,
Feb 08, 2012

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In the case cited, with Suitcase Fusion modifying the files, were the modifications visibly apparent in Finder (i.e., by seeing an updated date on the files)?

-Noel

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 09, 2012

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suitcase fusion caused the problem

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 09, 2012

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I have checked the file in the finder window and it doesn't change until I save.  The message about the file being changed comes up if I don't save for five or six minutes. If I quit the FM core process it stops the annoying 'document changed outside...' message and brings up the warning below. I will probably clear extensis off my system- I am an illustrator that uses fonts occasionally so I won't miss it that much.

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Feb 09, 2012

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Yeah, Suitcase has/had a "design" where they modify the saved file a moment after Photoshop saves the file.

We have been actively discouraging this behavior.

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 10, 2012

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You mean someone out there thinks that having the intrusive message pop up is a reasonable user experience?   I am a nervous saver...i.e I save my files every few minutes, so do not want any messages - in fact I try to get rid of intrusive warnings whenever they pop up. (like the  hot pins under the skin irritating 'less than 50% of pixels have been selected...' )

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Feb 10, 2012

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So you don't want to be warned when you attempt to save over work you did in another application, and lose all that work without warning?

All of those warnings are there for a good reason.

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LEGEND ,
Feb 10, 2012

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Why not just give them a way to avoid seeing the warning in the future ([  ] Don't ask again), Chris?  Not everyone needs them. 

As an example (and I'm not saying I ever see this warning myself), if I'm working on my own imagery on my own computer, I am the only person who should be able to change it, and if anything in the system has changed it I want my save to overwrite it anyway.  I'm saving the file for a reason.  Let's not forget who's in charge.

-Noel

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