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Black Majic created avi files.

Community Beginner ,
Feb 26, 2024 Feb 26, 2024

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Files created with BlackMagic Deck Link Studio 4k and recorded in Premiere 23.6.2 work fine.  Updating to 23.6.4 / 24.2.1 / Beta 24.3 have a pending file issue where it takes forever for Premiere to find the file and import it into a project.  A project with many created BlackMagic files takes forever to open.   I made a real time video for you to see the issue.

 

https://vimeo.com/916718258/846a8c8191?share=copy

 

Drivers for the Black Magic Card have been updated to make sure it is not the issue.

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correct answers 2 Correct answers

Adobe Employee , May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

Hi Theo,

>Without codecs, import of standard AVI goes ok.

>With BM drivers and/or Xpression drivers, import is very slow and Premiere reacts very slow.


The fix seems to be "avoid using these specific third party codecs", which isn't something Adobe can control.

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Adobe Employee , Feb 27, 2024 Feb 27, 2024

I am unable to repro the issue using your clip on my Win10 system. What I suspect is going on here is that there is a 3rd party AVI decoder superceding our own and the issue is actually with that decoder. I see a bit of this when I have the Bandicam decoder installed as the clip will import as all black - when I remove it the importer defaults back to our own and everything is fine. To that end, could you post a screenshot of both the Properties panel for the clip AND, after pressing Control + S

...

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correct answers 2 Pinned Replies

Adobe Employee , Feb 26, 2024 Feb 26, 2024

Can you provide an example media file that loads quickly in 23.6.2, but takes a long time in 23.6.4+?

I've emailed you some private upload space...

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Adobe Employee , May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

> What happend that this does not work anymore?

As your testing has shown, the problem is with third party software components, so we cannot provide meaningful guidance. 

Also, it sounds like you're conflating 'codecs', installed at the system level, with Transmit plugins for PPro (from BlackMagic and NDI), which allow for external display. These are distinct.

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Adobe Employee ,
Feb 26, 2024 Feb 26, 2024

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Can you provide an example media file that loads quickly in 23.6.2, but takes a long time in 23.6.4+?

I've emailed you some private upload space...

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Participant ,
Feb 27, 2024 Feb 27, 2024

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I can confirm this problem!

We work a lot with HD MJPEG AVI files and indeed they import slow now
and do not play in the timeline.
Also Premiere gets in a unresponsive state!
with Premiere 24.2.1 released version!
 
It looks like it goes wrong while conforming.
After this is done, Premiere does not playback anymore.
 

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Participant ,
Feb 27, 2024 Feb 27, 2024

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I can confirm this problem!

We work a lot with HD MJPEG AVI files and indeed they import slow now
and do not play in the timeline.
Also Premiere gets in a unresponsive state!
with Premiere 24.2.1 released version!
 
It looks like it goes wrong while conforming.
After this is done, Premiere does not playback anymore.
steps to repro
import an BM avi file in Premiere
Try to playback in timeline
 
result
Premiere starts conforming but most of the time playback does not work anymore.
If you reopen Premiere and reopen the avi file which is conformed, playback seems ok.
 
Here is a link to a BM mjpeg HD1080i25 video clip.
 
It's about 4GB, that's done so you will need some time to conforming.
After conforming is done you can repro the problem if you clear your mediacache directory.
 
 
Also avi's field settings are not seen by Premiere, while media info reports the correct upper field interlaced settings.
(1080i25 record format)
This is not new and happens since cc2017....
 
Win 10 pro with latest Premiere

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Adobe Employee ,
Feb 27, 2024 Feb 27, 2024

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I am unable to repro the issue using your clip on my Win10 system. What I suspect is going on here is that there is a 3rd party AVI decoder superceding our own and the issue is actually with that decoder. I see a bit of this when I have the Bandicam decoder installed as the clip will import as all black - when I remove it the importer defaults back to our own and everything is fine. To that end, could you post a screenshot of both the Properties panel for the clip AND, after pressing Control + Shift + F11 then playing the clip, a screenshot of the information overlap in the playback monitor (this information can then be turned off with the same keyboard combination that enabled it). I am hopeful that between those 2 screenshots we will get a clearer picture of what is happening and how to address it. 

Updated to give the correct keyboard command. 

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Participant ,
Feb 28, 2024 Feb 28, 2024

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Hi Tom,

I forgot to mention, that you have to install the BM driver software.

Then you get also the codec.

You don't need a BM card to repro.

I will try with a re-install of the BM driver, last time it also fixed something with Premiere...

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Adobe Employee ,
Feb 28, 2024 Feb 28, 2024

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Please follow Tom's guidance.

 

My results are similar to Tom's; no misbehavior on multiple systems, even using these enormous old .avi files that've been provided (thanks!). 

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Participant ,
Feb 29, 2024 Feb 29, 2024

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Hi everyone,

I tested today again.

Now I re-installed the BM drivers and de-installed the BM raw pluggin to be sure.

I still could easy repro this problem however!

 

Be sure however that you cleared your mediacache folders when you test this, once the file is conformed

the problem seems to be gone.

 

I have a screen recording, in realtime what happens with cc2023 compared to cc2024.

Cc2024 gets unresponsive when you swtich to another app and back.

Also import time is much longer!

this is the link

https://tkooijmans.stackstorage.com/s/faagBMdsdDhCZEoU

 

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Adobe Employee ,
Feb 29, 2024 Feb 29, 2024

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> Now I re-installed the BM drivers and de-installed the BM raw pluggin to be sure.

Specifically, which drivers did you install? 

> Be sure however that you cleared your mediacache folders when you test this,

> once the file is conformed the problem seems to be gone.

Confirming: Once conform is complete, the problem goes away? 

 

 

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Participant ,
Feb 29, 2024 Feb 29, 2024

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Black Magic desktop 11.6, but I don't think it does matter.

I had the same problem with 10.11.2

I'm on win 10 pro 22H2

 

If conforming is done, as you can see in the video,  Premiere still gets in trouble when I select another app

and return to Premiere.

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Community Beginner ,
Mar 01, 2024 Mar 01, 2024

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The file has the same problem in a laptop runing PP without the blackmagic card.  It is running 24.2.1

Like I mentioned theres no problem in 23.6.2 but its there in 23.6.4

No issue in 24.1 - but its there in 24.2.1

It is there in the current beta.

I don't understand how Tom's answer is correct.  Are you saying Blackmagic has an /avi codec that is interfering with premiere?

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Adobe Employee ,
Mar 01, 2024 Mar 01, 2024

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I believe the person that marked my answer correct was doing so to promote my request for additional information. Both Bruce and I have been unable to reproduce the issue. I do not doubt there is an issue but what it is and why it doesn't happen for us is unclear. You having a laptop without the Blackmagic drivers suggests that they are not the key to the repro as we thought they may be - though they may still be A way to repro. I'm hopeful if you follow the steps in my previous post that we'll get some information that will allow us to further diagnose the problem. I do believe that there is a 3rd party component involved here. That's not to say that isn't something we might be able to fix - as you noted it works in 23.6.2 but not 23.6.4.. there were a very small number of changes between those releases so that is actually really helpful info. 

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Adobe Employee ,
Mar 01, 2024 Mar 01, 2024

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Ah, interesting.. so if I put the latest Blackmagic driver on my system I see the issue so anyone experiencing this issue with the BM software installed need not try my steps mentioned above. However, if you DO NOT have the Blackmagic software installed and are seeing this issue it would be really helpful for you to follow those steps so we can scope the size of the issue. 

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Community Beginner ,
Mar 04, 2024 Mar 04, 2024

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Yes, we have a laptop with PP on it with both 24.2.1 and 23.6.4. Both have the issue with the .avi file. This computer has no BM card.
Our graphics dept has gotten new computers and I had them test PP with 24.2.1. There was no issue bringing in the file. The desktop has no BM card.






[news4jax.com]<>

Michael Jones | Senior Editor / Producer

WJXT Channel 4
4 Broadcast Place | Jacksonville, FL 32207

O: 904.391-1689
E: mjones@wjxt.com

THE LOCAL STATION | NEWS4JAX.COM

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Adobe Employee ,
Mar 04, 2024 Mar 04, 2024

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Further info: The BMD drivers download package has, in the past, included PPro plugins that handle import and export of BMD-specific formats; Tom's questions are relevant, even if you you're not using BMD hardware on that system. 

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Community Beginner ,
Mar 04, 2024 Mar 04, 2024

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Tom I've attached the screenshot of the properties of the file. Not sure what "AND, after pressing Control + Alt + F11 then playing the clip, a screenshot of the information overlap in the playback monitor" is suppose to do. Control + Alt + F11 is not programmed to do anything.







[news4jax.com]<>

Michael Jones | Senior Editor / Producer

WJXT Channel 4
4 Broadcast Place | Jacksonville, FL 32207

O: 904.391-1689
E: mjones@wjxt.com

THE LOCAL STATION | NEWS4JAX.COM

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Adobe Employee ,
Mar 04, 2024 Mar 04, 2024

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Ah, I see what happened.. that should have said Control + SHIFT + F11. Sorry for the confusion. 

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Community Beginner ,
Mar 05, 2024 Mar 05, 2024

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Control + SHIFT + F11 worked.
I have attached the files here. If I need to send them elsewhere, let me know.







[news4jax.com]<>

Michael Jones | Senior Editor / Producer

WJXT Channel 4
4 Broadcast Place | Jacksonville, FL 32207

O: 904.391-1689
E: mjones@wjxt.com

THE LOCAL STATION | NEWS4JAX.COM

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Participant ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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I have an update with this problem.

If you have Black Magic drivers or Ross Xpression AVI drivers installed, Premiere gets in trouble if you import these AVI files.

 

I compared my system with and without these drivers/codecs.

Without codecs, import of standard AVI goes ok.

With BM drivers and/or Xpression drivers, import is very slow and Premiere reacts very slow.

 

I have a link with a BM avi file and a screen recording of the problem.

https://tkooijmans.stackstorage.com/s/SbNhQujTtewNiKcX

 

The Black Magic software,

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/support/family/capture-and-playback

 

CC2023.6 works fine with BM avi files and Ross Xpression avi files.

CC2024.1 and higher gets very slow with importing these AVI files, also playback is a huge problem.

There is much more harddisk or network load when you try to playback, it's like Premiere restarts to import everything again and again.

CC2024 does not handle external AVI codecs very well anymore.

 

Please fix this problem!

It's still a problem with latest Premiere beta.

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Adobe Employee ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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Hi Theo,

>Without codecs, import of standard AVI goes ok.

>With BM drivers and/or Xpression drivers, import is very slow and Premiere reacts very slow.


The fix seems to be "avoid using these specific third party codecs", which isn't something Adobe can control.

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Participant ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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Hi Bruce,

We have to get the BM drivers installed to get the SDI broadcast monitoring working while editing.

What happend that this does not work anymore?

Same goes for Newtek NDI codecs.

 

With Ross Xpression we create all AVI+alpha files with Premiere. It does not except other formats.

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Adobe Employee ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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> What happend that this does not work anymore?

As your testing has shown, the problem is with third party software components, so we cannot provide meaningful guidance. 

Also, it sounds like you're conflating 'codecs', installed at the system level, with Transmit plugins for PPro (from BlackMagic and NDI), which allow for external display. These are distinct.

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Participant ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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Bruce, don't forget that this worked fine with CC2023.6 !

What is changed that this does not work any more as expected?

 

Black Magic support is very important for broadcasters.

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Adobe Employee ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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>What is changed that this does not work any more as expected?

We cannot be sure, because you're asking about the performance of third party components.
Your testing confirmed that PPro performs well, without those third party components.

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Participant ,
May 06, 2024 May 06, 2024

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Hi Bruce,

Can you please check this?

Windows mediaplayer works fine with these codecs.

It looks like Premiere is not using the windows codecs in the right way.

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Participant ,
May 15, 2024 May 15, 2024

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Today I also noticed that out archive DV25 AVI files cause problems in CC2024.

Note, this happens with systems with Decklinkcard and or Ross Xpression (AVI) codecs installed.

Same setup works fine with CC2023.6 or lower version.

 

When one or more DV25 AVI files are imported from a network server, Premiere becomes very slow and unresponsive.

(HP workstation with Win10 pro OS)

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