Time to install other editing softwears

[himanshu25844546vn00]

i think adobe is over, Now its time to install other editing softwears like FCP,  Da Vinci Pro, Edius and even filmora is better then premier pro 2022

[R Neil Haugen]

Ancient thread, btw.

I've got a 24 core 3960x w 128GB of RAM, 2080Ti, Premiere 2022 screams on it. As it does on my 4 year old Acer laptop.

I also personally use Resolve daily, and teach/work with colorists around the world. Who are typically more Mac folks and of course based in Resolve. To get 'even half decent' performance in Resolve, they push for having MONSTER machines. 256GB of RAM, working media on huge RAID arrays with multiple high-speed connections. Massive GPUs or quite likely a pair of them.

Any of these complex video post apps can require mega hardware. They all work a bit differently with the the hardware, need different setups, and all can blorp on some users at any time. My Resolve based friends have their long lists of bugs/bad behaviors that haven't been fixed for years also.

Pick your poison. And the number of Premiere users on a daily basis is astounding. And growing.

Neil

[Robert25101586uf3m]

I've got a 32 core 3950x w 128GB of 3600RAM, RTX 3090, Premier 2022 runs worse than RDR2 on a 1989 IBM laptop. That is to say, like a dog which taking out back.

That is to say, gone are the days when hardware seemed to make a difference to performance. Premier has been buggy as hell since 22 dropped and I'm running out of patience at this point since it feels like every realease becomes that little bit more frustrating to use.

That being said, Resolve is even worse. So Premiere has that going for it.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hey Robert,

You can partially blame the camera manufacturers who continually are coming out with post HD formats that they think we need. 4K? Sure! 8K? Why not. While they were at it, they developed an even more satanic codec than H.264. A little some-some called HEVC. So, while one can have a rocket ship computer, it does not matter much, it can be defeated by hardcore formats. You battle plan should include. how to make your media play nice. Once you've transcoded to ProRes LT or similar (preferred for rigs like yours), or you work with proxies, you'll be back in the game. Try it. 

Cheers,
Kevin

[Robert25101586uf3m]

Hi Kevin,

Many thanks for the constructive response. I'll try to be equally so!

I agree with camera firms running rampant over the last few years, but unfortunatly none of my work is coming from that source since I'm a CG Artist. That means anything I'm plugging into Premier is at most going to be 4K ProRes 30, though more often than not 1440p. However, I can just as easily be shipping out 720 dailies and get the same epic lag so I'm not sure it is my source. I wouldn't dare bring HEVC or intermediete codecs near pro. 

I use AME whenever I get external intermediete material and to be honest this workflow has worked fine for me for years in both Pro and Resolve, so I'm just a bit miffed that Pro has become the proverbial snail in the race since the last year or so.

Any further suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Rob

[R Neil Haugen]

Like many others I 'monitor' such threads. User performance at this time is all over the place, so unpredictable it seems. So any potential diagnosis/solutions is of interest.

Neil

[Warren Heaton]

I transcode to ProRes and 2k, 4k, and 8k all playback really well from SSD and Flash storage in Premiere Pro, Final Cut Pro, Resolve, and even Media Composer.

[Media Editor]

I did not know that blorp had so many meanings.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Having trouble? What's going on? Need help? Let us know.

Kevin

[benwinter]

Switch to Resolve.

I know this is a Premiere forum but I don't care. I've been editing on Premiere for over a decade like you. I cancelled my CC subscription last month and switching to Resolve has been absolutely life-changing. The amount of bugs and issues we put up with in this software is reprehensible. It's time to dump Premiere.

[benwinter]

Fixing Premiere means rebuilding it from the ground up, and that will never, ever happen.

[R Neil Haugen]

Actually Ben ... they've been rebuilding all the code in the app over the last like three years now. Section by section. That's actually where some glitches that have come in have come in. A rebuilt section has a conflict with a different older bit of code but only on X machines with Y media or Z, Q, or D effects sort of thing.

In the end, these are only tools. Fancy hammers. Period.

I use both Premiere and Resolve daily. I find Resolve to be very frustrating and limiting. I don't like the way the UI is so freaking locked down. Plus I have an Elements panel, and BlackMagic makes their profit not via software but by hardware sales. Different model, that's fine.

But they don't see it in their interest to give other panels more than token operational capability. So my Elements panel in Premiere not only is mappable for any color use I want to use it for ... but now, it can work the audio Track mixer, resize/move/rotatate graphics or other screen items ... nearly anything in the app.

In Resolve, it only can be used on the Color page, and at any one time, more than half of the many controls are 'dark', not connected to anything or used at all.

I've good friends who LOVE LOVE LOVE working in Resolve. More power to them!

So ... use what works for you now. As a professional at this, all that matters is getting the work out, right? Who cares what app you use?

Neither company is going to lose money nor sleep if you decide to use the other app. But you might sleep better.

Neil

[benwinter]

Neil,

When I hit play in Resolve, the footage actually plays back. There really isn't much else that needs to be said.

If you're wondering what I'm talking about, MXF playback has been broken on select Apple machines since 2022 came out. Or how about the glitch that has existed for years where Replace footage... reverts to linking to old files when you open the project again, randomly. Adobe has known about both of these massive, catastrophic issues and done nothing.

UI nags in Resolve like the ones you describe may be annoying but you can simply learn a different way to work. Premiere's problems are catastrophic in nature and in many cases there are no workarounds. The software simply doesn't function.

I cannot begin to enumerate the amount of stress Adobe has introduced to my life over 10+ years via Premiere. And I've paid them thousands of dollars for the pleasure. To say I am seething is an understatement.

Actually Ben ... they've been rebuilding all the code in the app over the last like three years now. Section by section. That's actually where some glitches that have come in have come in. 

This is exactly what I'm talking about, don't you see this is my point? Rather than rebuild the entire program from scratch, Adobe's idea of a rebuild is to attempt a patchwork of section-by-section updates that don't integrate with one another and create an unstable, unreliable program? That's not a rebuild, that's just called updating.

[R Neil Haugen]

I'm rather aware of the MXF issue ... yea, that's a right pain. Partly caused by differing 'reads' on what the underlying standard means, and yes, I've been through lengthy detailed discussions with it from engineers.

But my comment back was ... fine, you 'read' the data differently, so what ... how about just making it work with the way other apps use it, even if you think that is "wrong" according to the data? Ah well.

I've been in business on my own wits a long time now. Ya gotta do what gets work out the door to the nice clients (who ain't always so nice, mind you. ... ) what pays your bills.

This leads to a very practical approach on my part. Simply stated, again ... use what works. Now. For your clients.

And from routine participation on the LGG and BM forums, I also know that as BM has moved Resolve into direct ... performance? ... alongside the Adobe operations, choosing to become another app that says a "we do everything for all media on all systems for all workflows".

And that Resolve is also having more buggy behaviors and odd things. Some of my colorist buds have bug lists for Resolve going back to 15, still unresolved. (Pun fortuitously added.)

If Resolve, Avid, or Premiere works for your client's needs ... use whatever works. I personally have met the heads and most supers for the Adobe DVAs ... digital video apps. Nice people too.

But I wouldn't keep using Premiere for a day after it stopped being the option I prefer. It's a tool. That's all.

And like Resolve, Avid, everything else ... made by humans with flaws and at times wondrous things. Again ... use what works without raising your blood pressure.

Neil

[benwinter]

I agree with your pragmatism Neil. Use what works. It's why I switched. I had to! I had no other choice. Sounds like you said what I would to the engineers. I'm sure they're nice people. Unfortunately whatever system Adobe have set up inside that company to develop Premiere simply isn't working. Over time I may develop my own issues with Resolve, but let's just get this out of the way: it just works in ways Premiere simply doesn't.

It may end up frustrating me, but I'll take frustration over torture. There are certain bugs and issues I'm willing to entertain when the software is being ambitious. But you don't put out software that slows to a crawl just because you have a waveform open or using a 5K monitor at full resolution. You can't put out "professional" software that displays completely erroneous timecode after applying speed changes  or replaces your footage with old files when you're not looking. These kinds of bugs existing for years are just absolutely stupid and there's no excuse for them. Adobe's response is always "file a bug report" and then in the next version you get the same issues with a brand new export window. Give me a break. Premiere is like NYC. Sure, it'll be truly great, just hang around until the construction is done.

Thanks for letting me vent. Adobe's forced subscription model is the extra knife in the side. If you make me pay for your services ad infinitum, my needs should be responded to promptly, and your software better work. And to be fair, Adobe's tech support has always had the patience of a saint. But I paid $50 a month for years for software that owes me thousands in lost productivity and sanity. The chip on my shoulder may take a while to fill in.

[R Neil Haugen]

Totally understood, Ben.

Premiere has a user-base of several million or so. The thing is so freaking huge in daily use, that a "small" segment of the user base is still a rather large concrete number. But even that's small in the overall scheme.

Adobe's structure isn't obvious to most "CC subscribers". It's a freaking huge company, and the apps we users work with are only a part, and not the largest part, of the total company. So the dev teams are way down 'there', below the folks way up above 'there'  ...

And the executives away up there, use Adobe's major tools ... which are in gathering/evaluating/branding around metrics of user involvement & experience ... to make all over-all decisions. These tools and applications are built for their own internal use, and for use by other mega-corps. This is perhaps the largest and most lucrative part of the Adobe corporate structure.

There's a massive amount of creating, storing, and parsing metrics on user experiences across each app's user base. Which gives I suppose a rather theoretical view of the 'user experience' compared to what thee & me might feel at any one point in time.

And while the upper staffers are quite proud of the way they are so responsive to the massive user data information ... well, I think that in some ways that's "true".

But I do think they miss a lot of down-in-the-gutter street experience in relying on their metrics.

The devs ... I've met a lot of them. Great people, all passionate users of the apps they work on for their own uses. And well, the engineers tend to be very ... um ... engineer-ish? But still, they are all users of the various products.

I just feel or see a bit of disconnect between the upper M&E staffers on one hand, and the devs & users on the other. And I wish the devs had more freedom to control their own budgets. But what do I know? I've never run a mega-corp before!

Neil

[lymanm20829640]

Adobe cant even fix "Save Workspaces", they're not going to fix this. Go to Davinci Resolve. No, run to Davinci Resolve. 

[Dietmeister]

I think it's time we all move back to Avid.

I hate working on Avid, but it seems to be the only editing application that takes itself and their users seriously.

What a pitty...

[Warren Heaton]

@Dietmeister 

I am sorry to hear that you are having trouble.

I just did a client-attended session with Premiere Pro 24.1, Photoshop 25.4, After Effects 24.1, and Illustrator 28.2 under macOS Ventura 13.6.3 and everything went as expected - even quickly opening the project in Premiere Pro (beta) 24.3 to run Encance on some dialog and the return to 24.1.

I even generated some title cards for the editor running Media Composer in the bay next door (which, as you may know, crashes frequently when using the built-in titler).

Which versions of the Adobe applications are you running under which OS?  Let's see if we can get it to be as stable as my setup.

[Creative Spades]

This is a quote that made me decide that Adobe is now bound to die and be forgotten from all professionals:

 Pinned reply by Fergus H

Adobe Employee , 

58m ago

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LATEST

Hi all, 

I would like to let people here know that we have paused work on adding N-RAW support to our video products. When we have an update to share on potential future support for N-RAW, we will update this thread. 

Regards,

Fergus

Right after Nikon has bought RED...becoming the biggest player in the professional industry of film making.

So...Just like Fergus announced,  I will also annouce: "I would like to let people here know that Creative Spades and all the companies subsidiaries, connected to Creative Spades, and relates in any way, shape or form to Creative Spades will now be leaving Adobe to move to DaVinci Resolve."

Congratulations to all the Adobe Team for such an incredibly disappointing job.

Sergio

[Kevin-Monahan]

Moved to the Video Lounge for further discussion.

Thanks,
Kevin

[Warren Heaton]

I'm not sure why Nikon's implementation of RAW has not been embraced by the video world (not just Adobe) while other RAW formats and proprietary formats from Apple, Sony, Panasonic, ARRI, Canon, Blackmagic Design, and RED are; however, Nikon purchasing the former from that list is sure a way to establish a foothold. 

@Creative Spades , Premiere Pro has broad format support with or without Nikon-RED.  Nevertheless, Premiere Pro's RED workflow is solid, allowing users to debayer on the fly and take full advantage of RED RAW's wavelet compression to edit without creating proxies on lower end systems with fast storage media.  As long as Nikon does not pull the RED camera line altogether, I am confident that Adobe video applications will continue to support them, however that camera line evolves. 

[Creative Spades]

The main point is to support Nikon users. The specs are above Canon and Sony, and the format has been in the market for years. All other software have implemented it long ago. There is no excuse for such an expensive software not to be up-to-date.

Adobe has been bleeding users left, right, and center...yet the focus is on poor AI integrations, while the pros are all moving away. 
I have insights from the EU and IT sections of Adobe and let's just say that their focus is set in the wrong place. This is just my opinion...as a user since 2008, and ACE for 10 years

[Warren Heaton]

Oddly, NRAW is not supported while so many other formats are.

Since we've been able to shoot full-frame, full-motion video with a DSLR, I have not worked on one project that used a Nikon.  Canon was the leader of the pack early on and a strong argument could be made for Sony being the go-to now.

I know it isn't very meaningful to someone whose top feature request is NRAW, but there are plenty of format enhancements in recent releases and other improvements.  It's not entirely about AI. 

[R Neil Haugen]

And of course, all the NLEs have 'holes' in format support. Such as Resolve not having any support whatsoever for ProRes RAW ... and from the attitude of staffers on their forum, it will be a very cold day down below before it is covered 'there'.