P: Modifying font and font size in the interface

Hello @cizkek_,

Thanks for the reply.

what is not new here are concerns regarding Adobe's continued reliance on an archaic, and now ageist, interface.

Sorry about that. I think we are cooking with gas now that Spectrum is here. You may want to roll back a version while we await an update from the product team. I hope it won't be too long for the community to wait.

As a board member of a large artists guild, I talk to a lot of younger artists and none of them use Adobe products. In fact, with all alternatives now available, it doesn't even appear to even occur to them to use Adobe. Adobe's user base is aging. I would humbly submit that Adobe's user interface problem is not simply a "bug" nor "feature request;" it threatens the longevity of Adobe itself. For the first time in my professional life I'm now seriously entertaining alternatives to Adobe products. Thank you for your time.

Thanks for the comment. I'm just a support person trying to help people with problems. I'm not really a decision-maker. If you are speaking with younger artists, that's great! I was an instructor at a pro trade school for around a decade before Adobe. I would encourage young people to be aware of all content creation tools used in the industry. We're veering way off-topic, though. If you like we can talk more about the future of youth and companies like Adobe in the Video Lounge forum. As for yourself and your career goals, I wish you luck. I hope you stick around, though. We need people like you here. Peace, my friend.

Thanks,
Kevin

Hello @SpivR,

I believe you are aiming some of these questions at me, a mod and member of the support team. I'm afraid it's out of my purview to make specific comments about the developer team. I'm only the messenger, so to speak. I hope I can help guide you.

this "ask" been going on for years and years.

Yes, I have been fielding requests for that feature for some time, as well. The issue started spiking in the era of 4K computer screens and larger 4K format video. When I started at Adobe here over a decade ago, HD was rocket science!

Several versions ago, an upgrade was made to increase the font size in the project panel UI to address what the team could do. I think the team did their best at the time.

I assume something like Spectrum was needed in order to fulfill the request since users found their 4K monitors to be oversized, making icons and UI elements smaller.

Please PUT THIS BACK until you are able on your dev timeline, to replace it with something better. That would be a reasonable compromise of listening to your customers as this is obviously a very big pain point.

Unfortunately, stuff doesn't get put back. I've never seen that, anyway. If this hack is mission-critical for you, you might want to roll back a version until the team can address this issue properly. Make sure you upvote the feature request.

how the heck can such a dramatic usability change be made without fully accomodating previous capability?

Adobe probably does not measure the usage of undeveloped features in engineering tools. They do see all the upvotes though, both here and back on User Voice. Those upvotes indicate to me that an underlying code change likely needed to happen to "give the people what they want!"

One seriously has to question the process for QA, customer input, and feedback given this issue has been listed as a "suggestion" for many years, yet is ignored with only vague "we hear you, but do nothing" responses?

I am relatively certain you can bank on the new Spectrum UI as a sign that Adobe is listening and is taking action on getting users like you the features they want. I apologize for asking for patience on this. Trust me, the product team knows this is a top issue.

Would it help the collective "you", if all of us customers were to telephone, fax, FedEx, or otherwise elevate our concerns by contacting the Office of the CEO / President?

No. That would be ineffective, time-consuming, and soul-draining. Simply upvote. If you already have done so, you can call, fax, email, FedEx, and contact all your friends' bosses and have them upvote, as well. Anyone can upvote, you know.

I only ask because with other companies, this has made a difference when the executive suite, which is often oblivious, becomes aware of the real-world issues and then miraculously liberates engineering talent, and more importantly budget, to accelerate addressing the issue.

I gave my opinion, so it's up to you. I would discourage you from doing so, though. Help is on the way, it's just going to take some time. You may want to roll back to the previous version until the team can take action. Now that Spectrum is here, we all can have hope that the UI will be customizable, even for those who want huge text in Comic Sans in flaming hot magenta or highlighter green. That should bring a smile to a good number of faces.

I hope my post sheds some light. Sorry again for the frustration.

Cheers, and happy editing!
Kevin

I'm trying to understand what your post was about, referencing me? Totally puzzled.

I've been requesting this change for years. Period.

I explained why perhaps it's taking so long, and somehow that offended you? 

It's very, very clear from the posts I've posted that I've been pushing for this for a long, long time. I don't get your post at all. Explanations aren't defending something, just ... explanation.

@R Neil Haugen @@

Please. If that is your opinion, I'm sorry but its the same as saying;

"We don't need wheel chair access, braille and handle bars near stairs. It's just not the priority, society has other things that are more alluring to accomplish right now. That's just the way things are.

If you have the time, please have a look at the following links. If you have any contacts at Adobe, please remind them. Thank you.

https://www.adobe.com/trust/accessibility.html

https://spectrum.adobe.com/page/inclusive-design/

"Accessibility at Adobe

We believe that when people feel respected and included, they can be more creative, innovative, and successful. Accessibility is essential to delivering on that mission. With more than one billion people with disabilities in the world, we are committed to removing barriers to enable transformative change."

"Inclusive design is part of Adobe’s mission. Designers, engineers, and product builders are invested in learning how to think more broadly, seeking out more voices, and working together to make better experiences."

"Whenever possible, provide options for people to adjust font size, color themes, and contrast, either manually, in-app, or through operating system preferences."

Cizkek ... as far as "this has been asked for, for many years" .... perhaps getting some perspective would be useful.

It is one of several hundred things users ask for all the time. So prioritization of what is the highest user-base interest will occur. Some other things get added by dint of decision that yea, this just needs to happen.

But the priorities thing is what we're dealing with for this and other things. It's not being ignored, it's just that other customer-interest things seem to have higher 'numbers' on their metrics.

I wish it were otherwise, but then, I want a lot of things that I know are way low for other users. Sigh.

For now, I have at least found an option in the *cencored* so that Premiere Pro does not scale up with my OS. Thankfully I will at least be able to use my other apps properly without them getting also down-scaled  to a tiny size with the display scaling option in Windows (I'm on a 16" laptop with a 1080p display and I am using 125% resizing which works pretty well for me.)

@cizkek_

"Please forgive me if my comments on the type size and ui related topics were rude, It's just that I wasn't aware that community experts were volunteers. Not being able to see the UI has put an additional layer of stress on my mind, and at the time I thought it was a good idea to get additional attention on the topic by doing that, I now believe it was unkind and was a mistake."

I applaud the Adobe volunteers! They are not what's wrong with Adobe. Unfortunately, the tacit message from Adobe to its volunteers and to all the concerned users here is--nothing. 

Dear mods, community experts and volunteers,

Please forgive me if my comments on the type size and ui related topics were rude, It's just that I wasn't aware that community experts were volunteers. Not being able to see the UI has put an additional layer of stress on my mind, and at the time I thought it was a good idea to get additional attention on the topic by doing that, I now believe it was unkind and was a mistake.

Back to the topic,

Magnifier tools can bu useful but each additional click and key combo extends the process of comfortably using the software. This is a bit more hard to use during drag and drop operations and when I need to look at more than 2-3 things at the screen. For example to check the relationship between them, such as keyframes, speed ramps and timecodes at the same time.

I would have been just happy if the native display scaling in OS preferences reflected well to the PP UI, but the context menus and other UI elements are designed in such a way that they become unusable when enlarged.

The simplest problem that comes to my mind when using native OS display scaling is that, right click menu in project browser and timeline flows outside the screen boundaries. In recent versions thankfully there are these tiny arrows to cycle between the options that are left outside the display area, but for example, in order to navigate to Reveal File in Explorer option I need to click so many times to that tiny arrow, it takes a long time and my fingers become hurt even though im using a vertical mice. On other software and in the os dropdown menus, when this happens, they cascade to the sides so there are two continuous columns of options which are easier to mavigate.

For other UI elements that become unsuable, such as the preview windows and buttons such as export or others, I'm not able to comment much at the moment.

I'm at the end of my limit, mentally and emotionally, because work has been tough as it is already. Having to use a software which is lacking in UI scalibility has become the final straw at the moment.

Believe me, I have jokingly considered manual labour jobs for a time to just get over this burn out and wait out the unusability of the PP at the moment. I wish I could use other NLEs but project constraints and previous dependencies have tied my hands.

If there is any way to reach higher management please let me know.

I'm ready to kneel and beg for this UI update.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and legacy code for font handling and scaling isn't as sexy as building the latest AI demo, but I think this "ask" been going on for years and years.

It looks bad when the only progress is backward - the removal of the workaround hack that many of us have painfully found and been using in our production setups.

(I'm not being specific on the hope that the editor gods don't once again delete all reference to this).

Please PUT THIS BACK until you are able on your dev timeline, to replace it with something better.   That would be a reasonable compromise of listening to your customers as this is obviously a very big pain point.

P.S. I see a follow-up response from Adobe that a new "Spectrum UI" is being used and that prevents an easy roll-back.

I know you aren't dev, but how the heck can such a dramatic usability change be made without fully accomodating previous capability?

One seriously has to question the process for QA, customer input, and feedback given this issue has been listed as a "suggestion" for many years, yet is ignored with only vague "we hear you, but do nothing" responses?

Would it help the collective "you", if all of us customers were to telephone, fax, FedEx, or otherwise elevate our concerns by contacting the Office of the CEO / President?

I only ask because with other companies, this has made a difference when the executive suite, which is often oblivious, becomes aware of the real-world issues and then miraculously liberates engineering talent, and more importantly budget, to accelerate addressing the issue.

IMHO, top-down always works faster than bottom-up?

As much as the new Content Extend AI might be cool, changing the UI font size and label colors is a basic function that went back to Avid 30 years ago.