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Participant
Mar 15, 2021 1:07 PM UTC
Question

Ae Rotobrush keeps propagating over and over again?

Hi everyone, I've run into the same problem with the Ae Roto Brush a few times now and it's more or less making it impossible to use the tool at all;

 

Whenever I finish rotobrushing a video clip and go back to the composition window, when I change anything in the composition that somehow triggers the Roto Brush to completely restart the propagating process, which can be very time consuming. Those changes don't even need to be something related to the rotobrush, even stuff like adding a text layer or just looking at a different part of the compisition can trigger this to happen. 

 

Has anyone had this same problem? 

50 replies

Participant
Dec 23, 2023 12:55 AM UTC

OMG I love Adobe products but If i could punch a component in the face its totally aimed at rotobrush. Once the orginal propogation is complete it needs to stop being a goof every time I move something.  So first, good job rotobrush on the original propogation. Second this brush is out of control. Once task is complete how do i stop this?

 

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Participant
Dec 1, 2023 2:27 PM UTC

So I think you need to freeze the rotoscope, there's a little freeze button in the viewport toolbar when rotoscoping so it needs to be pressed before leaving the rotoscoping and going back to your normal composition.
Here's a video tha shows how to do it: https://youtu.be/_DLd1UKqvp0?si=GWUcmV6NVieCoRRt&t=235

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Participant
Dec 1, 2023 2:47 PM UTC

Freezing the rotoscope was the step I was missing.

Thanks ya'll. 

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Known Participant
Jun 16, 2023 9:09 PM UTC

This is not accurate, and looks like a bot wrote it. What are you doing?

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Participant
Jun 16, 2023 8:18 PM UTC

My problem is the robobrush keep re-propagating during rendering. I have a clip with about 5000 frames.  I let it propagate in the project. Then when I export, about 10% in, it starts propagating again.  Even when there are <1000 frames to render, it keeps re-propagating 4500 frames, rendering a few frames, then re-propageting 4500 again. 

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Known Participant
Jun 16, 2023 8:24 PM UTC

Did you freeze the rotobrush before rendering?

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Participant
Dec 10, 2022 6:30 PM UTC

To put this in perspective,  rotobrush treats each  layer as a new task. With that being said if you have a rotobrushed layer that you douplicated 5 times, it will need to root it 5 times. The more you split the clip the more cycles it goes through. Also, it does not take trimming into account. As it treats it as a completely new layer.

 

reccomended solution:

solution 1)  chop up the footage first and rotobrush each clip as you go. If this disrupts your work flow do not do this.

solution 2) rotobrush what you need and pre render it and put it back as actual footage ( don't forget to enable transparency grid)


Mr Gerald has a great input but it's complex and the technical jargon is tedious to understand..

 

Remember, even if your just making tiny edits, if you chop up an already rotobrushed layer AE will propagate each one you chop

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Inspiring
Nov 2, 2022 1:11 AM UTC

I don't use rotobrush because the results keep changing as I keep working. Any footage that rotobrush will handle well can usually be roto'ed more effectively and consistently with keying + roto in Mocha.

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Known Participant
Nov 1, 2022 8:56 PM UTC

Yes, I have 100% had this problem starting recently. Rotobrush will randomly start propigating from the beginning of the clip all over again while in the middle of working through the clip in the rotobrush process.

Rotobrush has also become much slower with long clips starting around 18.1 and as far as I know, this has never been fixed.

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DKins
Known Participant
Nov 13, 2022 1:35 AM UTC

Just 48 hours ago I found myself in the same boat! A project I have been working on for weeks and Roto behaved itself properly. It was tedious and time-consuming but I could plod forward one frame at a time. Now suddenly doing anything, I MEAN ANYTHING* and Roto dumps all previously rendered frams and starts propogating from frame 1. I haven't updated to a newer version of AE or installed anything new. System has been stable for months. UFB.

 

Ex. 1 Moving the CTI in the layer panel to a previous frame already rendered. No edits mind you just moving to a previous frame (yes, render direction was forward.)

 

Ex. 2 Opening my Firefox tab to look up something then closed it. When AE had focus again the propogation started over. MADDENING!!!

 

I've been putting off looking into Boris Silhouette but I have been reading and hearing so many good things about it I think I have to at least check it out.

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Participant
Nov 26, 2022 3:37 AM UTC

same

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Participant
Aug 15, 2022 11:20 AM UTC

More than one year later and the same problem persists...

 

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Joost van der Hoeven
Community Expert
Community Expert
Aug 15, 2022 12:25 PM UTC

Can you explain what is going not how you expect it to work? Adding a screen grab will help us help you.

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Participant
Aug 31, 2022 3:14 PM UTC

Hi, jumping on this as I have the same problem. Select object with rotobrush, spacebar to let it play, stop when it goes wrong and maybe got back a frame or 2. Sometimes it's fine, but othertimes every frame change starts it propogating over hundreds of frames and nothing I do seems to stop it. Also sometimes when letting it play it will suddenly jump back say a dozen frames and start propogating again.

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Participant
Mar 18, 2022 11:44 PM UTC

I seriously don't beleive that anyone who ISN'T experiencing this issue A) understands the actual issue or B) understands how absolutely infuriating it is. I have watched DOZENS of videos on how to use the rotoscope brush and never have I seen anyone's video propagate constantly. My file just auto-saved which triggered another 999 frame propagation. The more you do, the longer you're going to wait EVERYtime you stop to fix a border error.

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Participant
Apr 20, 2023 12:48 AM UTC

This is true. I have been researching this issue for a few days now, and it seems like there are just a few people in this unlucky "club" while everyone else just spews random useless suggestions on how to fix some alternate issue they made up in their head.

This is what is happening: We double click the layer in our comp so it opens up the layer panel. We select the rotobrush and work on a frame. Some random green rectangle covering an arbitrary number of frames that isn't the entire comp appears and an arrow somewhere in the middle of it points either left or right (I guess it flips a coin or something). Then as soon as we try to click literally ANYTHING, After Effects calls timeout and forces us to wait while the Rotobrush "propagates frame [n] of [m]". 

When I say anything, I mean ANYTHING. If you try to fix a frame, Propagate. If you simply move the playhead to a different part (even something you have already brushed), Propagate. If you click Save, Propagate. If you click a different window, return to After Effects and accidentally click something to get back into the window, Propagate.

Like, all I want to do is brush the first frame, advance automatically, and then fix it when it makes a mistake, just like I would with a Track Mask or in Mocha. I don't want it to go back and re-do the first 50 frames (while stopping me from doing anything else) just because I spotted a mistake on frame 51. Just let me fix frame 51 and continue working. 

The question in this thread is "How do we stop AE from going back and re-propagating every previous frame when we click literally anything in the software?" 

The question is not "How do we edit videos just like you?" or "What we should change about ourselves to be better editors?"

If you have never encountered this issue, or have no experience with the issue, then you are welcome to post a comment in a DIFFERENT thread about something else.

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Participant
Apr 26, 2023 7:33 PM UTC

Before someone gets brutally murdered over this, here's how I do it. JUST READ IT.

Firstly, I've been in your situation too. It is infuriating, and frankly, this should be addressed seriously by Adobe. Just dropping name of big companies who use AE doesn't mean nobody never got the same issues too.

 

YES, AE WILL GETS YOU IN A UNRECOVERABLE AND INFINITE LOOP OF PROPAGATION. SO HERE'S THE WORKAROUND I USE.

 

Firstly, "Automatic Propagation" is stupid. In AE2023, there should be a way to stop and constrain the propagation in time, other than Freezing the complete job. Once you're happy with a portion, you should be able to just lock it, so AE don't come after you and just mess with it. Just this, not having being made to work this way is puzzling.  I know you can reduce the span or have multiple ones, but that doesn't change anything.

 

So, here the way I do it on real life situation with complex rotoscoping jobs. 

If you use this, I guaranty you it will not be another waste day in front of AE.

 

AE has numerous limitations(let's call them that way).

You won't be able to roto brush a 5 minutes video with a subject jumping and moving around with black hair over a black pixelated background, from start to finish, UNLESS, you split and prep your video before. Unfortunately.

 

For instance, suppose you don't have a MP4 with no alpha channel (such a YouTube video), and you can't color key the background without loosing too much details that you want to keep.

 

Learn about #pre-multiplied vs #straight alpha. Maybe you can get away by just adding an alpha channel. (Just to let you know it is possible or someone suggest this, but I never got this lucky myself.)

 

Otherwise, in the above situation, prep your file, (clean the file prior rotoscoping).

 

Here, I will create a pretty loose mask surrounding the subject so mask-tracking gets done fairly quickly. Then, I will end up with a video with an incompleted alpha channel with a matte surrounding the subject that I want to get rid of.

 

Since AE messes up or starts to struggle beyond the 20 seconds mark when rotoscoping, I, then split my video in 20 seconds numerated segments that I will reassemble once all done. Premiere here is the way to go for this, trust me, even if AE can do it too. 

20 seconds it the magic number for me.  I never got any issue rotoscoping with AE since, no matter the complexity of the scene. And I just have an average gaming desktop with an unsupported AMD GPU.

 

More specifically, this rotoscoping method (apparently called the Brute Force approach) is the only one that's gets the job done for me.

This means, it's frame by frame, using the Page UP/DN key only.

 

IMPORTANT - When the Layer windows loses focus and your computer idles after a predetermined amount of time set in the Preview Preferences, that's when AE starts messing with you. It will start rendering non-rendered frames and that's can be time consuming (and nerve-wracking) on a long video. You may even decide to quit and contemplate starting a new life right there, hence the 20 sec. segment.

 

Now, once you're done determining the background/foreground and refining your edges on the subject and you're happy with your roto brush setting, use the Pg UP/Pg DN keys to advance. - You MUST watch carefully the thin green progress bar just above the propagation ones with chevrons (that is there only to add confusion). This is the obscur Rendering Frame Bar that tells you if a frame is rendered or not. As you move, frame gets automatically rendered when going slowly (a 1-3 sec. pace between each Pg DN, depending on you computer power). Go one by one slowly, watch the RF bar, and the Layer windows. Any correction applied will affect already rendered frames and you will have to go back. That's OK. As long you go slowly, things are fine.

 

Using this Brute Force approach, you want to render every frame as you move forward in time. Again, this means every time you move one frame, wait that AE has done rendering the frame. If you've moved 10 frames forward in time and AE has suddenly "UNRENDERED" few frames after you made slight adjustment with the brushes, STOP and move backward using the Pg DN key. Most likely AE need your help to fix few contiguous frames here (or just one). But that's nothing and usually very quick to fix and you won't have to fix them all. When you move, they often fix themselves of if the frame was rendered, it will stand that way. As long you stop and fix and render them, you'll be back where you were in no time. 

 

Also, AE will display a span of approximately 8 sec. of rendered frames in the RF bar, then they will will be cached (NOT DELETED) and disappear from the RF bar. YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO BACK, they are just cached, just keep going. 

 

Once you have done you're 20 sec. segment this way, Freeze your roto brush job, and lock your layer.  The Cached frames will be added.

 

Now you can render your whole 20 sec. segment video, import it in Premiere, etc.

 

Sometimes the Yellow Decontamination warning is in our way because they stupidly decided to put at the lower edge of the layer window, other times a 75% zoom would be useful, or the timecode system would be as simple and user friendly as in Premiere, but that's another story. I’m not going to go through all AE "limitations" here.



The attached photo, is my setting I use involving long black hair over a black background that gives me the most success.

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Community Expert
May 16, 2021 6:34 AM UTC

Did you Freeze Rotobrush? Are you stacking a bunch of other layers in the same comp as the Rotobrush layer? If so, that's not a good idea. Your Rotrobrush layer should be the only layer in a comp. If you need to use the matte that is created you nest the comp in the main composition with the other layers. If your roto is complicated and longer than just a few seconds it is a really good idea to Pre-render the Rotobrush comp so you end up with a visually lossless source file with transparency. This is doubly important if you are using Dynamic Link and Premiere Pro.

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Participant
Jul 14, 2023 8:01 PM UTC

Why not make a video of what you have said and share link please

 

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Participant
Dec 1, 2023 2:28 PM UTC

Here's a video showing how to freeze your rotoscope: https://youtu.be/_DLd1UKqvp0?si=GWUcmV6NVieCoRRt&t=235

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