Should I use Coldfusion?

re: Hey Craig, there are more members of Alcoholics Annonymous than there
are members of MENSA. I am thinking of dropping out of MENSA and joining AA.
I mean, that is where the numbers are...

Classic - another totally screwed up analogy. Not an analogy at all really
as it bears no relavance. MENSA is meant to be Coldfusion in this analogy,
right? MENSA is few numbered becuase it is "elite", hard to get membership.
CF is few numbered becuase its in a market where there are products at
better prices that are equal to more powerful. So, a case of telling
yourselves what you need to hear yet again.

CF is rarely used and poorly marketed - that fact is backed up by tons oand
tonds of evidence provided again and again and again. Yet still you guys
keep repeating "wheres the evidence?". It'd be funny if it werent so sad.






"tclaremont" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
news:f5buhl$mo3$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> Hey Craig, there are more members of Alcoholics Annonymous than there are
> members of MENSA. I am thinking of dropping out of MENSA and joining AA. I
> mean, that is where the numbers are...

re: Andley, what happened when you brought your questions and concerns
directly to
Adobe? What did they say?

That future versions wold be "better value for money"

re: > What happened when you approached Adobe and asked about discount
pricing in
> order to persuade one of your clients to use the product?

They said "No"

re: > What happened when you started or joined a user group in order to
develop
> feedback and solicit the support of Adobe?

They closed down the CFUG as it whittled away to 3 members .

re: > What happened when you downloaded and installed CF8

I looked at it and thought it was sname this happened now, and not when folk
would have been prepared to give it a go.

re: What happened when you joined the CFEclipse project and contributed
your own
development time to improve the product?

I didn't do this. And I dont think I should - the price Adobe charges I
should be given a complete platform for development.

re: Note: these questions are rhetorical. We already know the answers.

No, you didn't





"tclaremont" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
news:f5b8vg$qhn$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> Andley, what happened when you brought your questions and concerns
> directly to
> Adobe? What did they say?
>
> What happened when you developed a promotional ColdFusion website with
> tips
> and ideas to share with CF developers in an attempt to improve it's
> standing in
> your area?
>
> What happened when you approached Adobe and asked about discount pricing
> in
> order to persuade one of your clients to use the product?
>
> What happened when you started or joined a user group in order to develop
> feedback and solicit the support of Adobe?
>
> What happened when you wrote a well worded, correctly spelled, accurate,
> positive list of suggestions and sent it to Adobe?
>
> What happened when you downloaded and installed CF8 and provided feedback
> during the beta process?
>
> What happened when you joined the CFEclipse project and contributed your
> own
> development time to improve the product?
>
> What happened when you answered technical questions on the Adobe
> ColdFusion
> support forum?
>
> What happened when you answered technical questions on the CF-Talk mailing
> list?
>
> Note: these questions are rhetorical. We already know the answers.
>

re: And, for the record, you don't help people.

Yes, I do. I get "Thank You" and "I agree" quite often. You are wrong - but
can YOU accpet that?

re: Spending millions on
> development (and already at work on v9), thousands upon thousands of
> dollars to
> promote it

They barely promote it outside of the Adobe community. Why do you think its
considered obscure and constantly accused of being dead or outdated or
non-scalavle? Becuase its not well marketed. I rest my case. (for now)



"craigkaminsky" <info@imageaid.net> wrote in message
news:f5bbv8$pl$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> "Does not helping you equate to not helping no one? I think not - I get
> plenty of agreement and have assisted some people in making better
> choices. "
>
> You're such a hypocrite, it's ridiculous. One the one hand you try to
> dissuade
> people from getting involved in CF and on the other you complain how it
> would
> be great to have a more robust CF community. Make up your mind. Do you
> want to
> help or not? Clearly, you chose not.
>
> And, for the record, you don't help people. Negative b$tching and whining
> about something isn't helpful. If you want a better community (more
> developers), then quit bashing it and start promoting it. Or, better, yet,
> prove you can actually do something in this language and help people with
> their
> technical questions. Or are you completely incapable of coding in
> ColdFusion?
>
> As for your knowledge of Adobe, you don't know jack. Spending millions on
> development (and already at work on v9), thousands upon thousands of
> dollars to
> promote it (Ben Forta's US tour showcasing Scorpio was/is not free) with
> product tours, conferences and the like is pretty solid marketing for a
> server-side programming language.
>
> It may not be the biggest language (or even close) in the world but that's
> what makes the web great. There's plenty of room for everyone.
>
> tclaremont: GREAT link!
>

I think switching to AA is an excellent idea. MENSA just isn't marketing themselves properly and is a dying organization. I know you wouldn't want to waste your time there :)!

Hey Craig, there are more members of Alcoholics Annonymous than there are members of MENSA. I am thinking of dropping out of MENSA and joining AA. I mean, that is where the numbers are...

"Does not helping you equate to not helping no one? I think not - I get
plenty of agreement and have assisted some people in making better choices. "

You're such a hypocrite, it's ridiculous. One the one hand you try to dissuade people from getting involved in CF and on the other you complain how it would be great to have a more robust CF community. Make up your mind. Do you want to help or not? Clearly, you chose not.

And, for the record, you don't help people. Negative b$tching and whining about something isn't helpful. If you want a better community (more developers), then quit bashing it and start promoting it. Or, better, yet, prove you can actually do something in this language and help people with their technical questions. Or are you completely incapable of coding in ColdFusion?

As for your knowledge of Adobe, you don't know jack. Spending millions on development (and already at work on v9), thousands upon thousands of dollars to promote it (Ben Forta's US tour showcasing Scorpio was/is not free) with product tours, conferences and the like is pretty solid marketing for a server-side programming language.

It may not be the biggest language (or even close) in the world but that's what makes the web great. There's plenty of room for everyone.

tclaremont: GREAT link!

Hey Andley, any of this look familiar?

http://www.wired.com/culture/lifestyle/commentary/alttext/2007/06/alttext_0620

Andley, what happened when you brought your questions and concerns directly to Adobe? What did they say?

What happened when you developed a promotional ColdFusion website with tips and ideas to share with CF developers in an attempt to improve it's standing in your area?

What happened when you approached Adobe and asked about discount pricing in order to persuade one of your clients to use the product?

What happened when you started or joined a user group in order to develop feedback and solicit the support of Adobe?

What happened when you wrote a well worded, correctly spelled, accurate, positive list of suggestions and sent it to Adobe?

What happened when you downloaded and installed CF8 and provided feedback during the beta process?

What happened when you joined the CFEclipse project and contributed your own development time to improve the product?

What happened when you answered technical questions on the Adobe ColdFusion support forum?

What happened when you answered technical questions on the CF-Talk mailing list?

Note: these questions are rhetorical. We already know the answers.

re: Okay, you can read all the signs, know Adobe's intentions, and can see
the
future of CF. Why not follow your own advice, drop it, and move on. Most
importantly, stop wasting everyone's (including yours) time and energy.
You're
helping no one.

Does not helping you equate to not helping no one? I think not - I get
plenty of agreement and have assisted some people in making better choices.
More importantly - I've raised the issues of people who WANT to use
coldfusion but can't make a case for it in their country/City.

FYI: I don't really care what those of you who don't care about the issue
have to say. You have the choice to simply ignore as you do with any other
posts you have no interest in.

> Okay, you can read all the signs, know Adobe's intentions, and can see the
> future of CF.

I can read all the signs, yes, its not rocket science. I don't really know
Adobes intentions, and can only guess at the future of CF. I guessed 4 years
ago, and was correct then. So I can say with (some) confidence that , due to
signs being more pervasive, my guesses may be also be as accurate now. Its
the "now" that matters however.



"craigkaminsky" <info@imageaid.net> wrote in message
news:f5a326$cl6$1@forums.macromedia.com...
> 'You can "reason" all you want - but you will never accept the fact that
> CF
> is in decline in many many parts of the world and is no longer given the
> respect it once had.'
>
> Okay, you can read all the signs, know Adobe's intentions, and can see the
> future of CF. Why not follow your own advice, drop it, and move on. Most
> importantly, stop wasting everyone's (including yours) time and energy.
> You're
> helping no one.
>

'You can "reason" all you want - but you will never accept the fact that CF
is in decline in many many parts of the world and is no longer given the
respect it once had.'

Okay, you can read all the signs, know Adobe's intentions, and can see the future of CF. Why not follow your own advice, drop it, and move on. Most importantly, stop wasting everyone's (including yours) time and energy. You're helping no one.