Skip to main content
D
Daniel308
Known Participant
May 2, 2019
Question

Reflow non-threaded figure numbers?

  • May 2, 2019
  • 8 replies
  • 5280 views

Greetings all, and thanks for your time.

I produce a textbook with 300+ pages and over 250 illustrations. Most of the contents are threaded but in some areas this was not possible. I need to insert a new figure into approximately page 50 and because of the way this spread is formatted, this new figure can not be threaded.

Of course when I insert my new figure in the document (physically it should be Figure 53) it of course becomes the last figure in the document Figure 255. I can't obviously begin copy / pasting every figure south of this to try to re-order my figures.  I have be researching this for hours now, and have only been able to find the copy / paste method of getting my numbering to be physically accurate vs chronologically accurate.

This seems to be something that would be a regular occurrence for people working on certain types of publications. I guess that often, the figures would re-start with each section making the copy / paste somewhat less arduous but still...I feel like I must be missing something.

Any help would be ••greatly•• appreciated!
This topic has been closed for replies.

8 replies

D
Daniel308Author
Known Participant
May 14, 2019

Again so many thanks to everyone who has provided some thoughts and insight. Sandee, you invested a great deal of time in addressing this and your efforts are truly appreciated.

My takeaway so far, is that there is no current way to perform this simple function. There have been some extremely convoluted work-arounds presented, not all of which I have even been able to understand or fully experiment with.

Adobe: Select or highlight any list instance / Edit List / "Ignore Sequential" [checkbox] / "insert before/after* —choose / Apply.

<<A big error message that states something along the lines of "what you are about to do could completely mess your list">>

And add a function to help quickly reset a "messed" list that states "Auto-reflow List" that performs this function based on location...?

Do I have any seconders?

FRIdNGE
FRIdNGE
May 15, 2019

Le son est inutile et le propos suffisamment explicite, comme d'habitude !

C'est mon dernier post sur ce forum !

D
Daniel308Author
Known Participant
May 29, 2019

What script is this that you're running? This looks like the magic I'm looking for! (Finger's crossed you can read my message).

Sandee Cohen
Sandee Cohen
Legend
May 13, 2019

In case anyone needs more information, here's a video that explains my answer to this question.

Numbering stories in InDesign - YouTube

    vinny38
    vinny38
    Legend
    May 13, 2019

    Hi Sandee.

    With all due respect, I don't think your video answers to the original question...

    I know my English is not as good as yours, but I really don't think that question was about how to set up a numbered list.

    I understand it was all about... stories!

    Maybe you could read again the whole thread and correct me if I misunderstood?

    Regards

    Vinny

    FRIdNGE
    FRIdNGE
    May 13, 2019

    Hi Vincent,

    No more comment from me on this topic I consider closed since Daniel's last message.

    I'll let you finish if you want.

    Best regards!

    [off the record!] Between us, even before the final episode that ends the stories of "Game of Thrones", we already know who will be the "King"! ...

    Barb Binder
    Community Expert
    Barb BinderCommunity Expert
    Community Expert
    May 4, 2019

    Hi Daniel:

    The community forums are a user-to-use forums (we are users like you), so Adobe won't necessarily see this:

    ***please InDesign Team, just give me an "Arrange / Insert Before" function and the ability to choose a target frame.••• And / or an "Auto-reflow List "X"

    Please be sure to post a feature request here: Adobe InDesign Feedback  and link back to this page so that the engineering team can get the full picture.

    ~Barb

    ~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training
    Sandee Cohen
    Sandee Cohen
    Legend
    May 5, 2019

    Barb,

    I agree those features would be good, but in case anyone doesn't think there is an answer, Cut/Paste in Place can reorder the numbers.

      D
      Daniel308Author
      Known Participant
      May 4, 2019

      Michel is there any way, you could detail your use of cross-references to overcome this issue? I'm just not sure how you are setting the reference up.

      FRIdNGE
      FRIdNGE
      May 4, 2019

      Sorry, I can’t! ... I’m cooking at the moment! But sure later!

      Sandee Cohen
      Sandee Cohen
      Legend
      May 3, 2019

      I haven't looked carefully at all the answers/screenshots, but I believe the answer is very simple.

      Click New List in the List menu of the Numbers dialog box.

      Define the list to reflow across stories. Apply that list to the numbering options.

      Now, any text that uses that list for numbering will keep the sequence.

      D
      Daniel308Author
      Known Participant
      May 3, 2019

      Hi Sandee.

      If I understand you correctly, are you suggesting to "re-apply" a second custom list list to the paragraph style being used for the figures?  I am already using a custom list...and then do this each time a new figure is inserted? Will this force InDesign to re-sort the list based on position?

      Sandee Cohen
      Sandee Cohen
      Legend
      May 4, 2019

      As long as you're using a paragraph style, there's no problem.

      Open the paragraph style dialog box, then move to Bullets and Numbers.

      In the List menu of Bullets and Numbers, chose New List. Then name the list and choose Continue Numbers Across Stories. This will allow you to put a frame with that paragraph style between two other frames that have that paragraph style for numbers without linking the text.

      Two notes: If you want to edit that numbered list, you need to go to the Type > Bullets and Numbering > Define Lists.

      If you want to change the numbering order of the frame that has the numbering style, you need to copy/paste or Opt/Alt-Drag to create a new frame with a new order. I haven't worked too much with re-ordering and there may be a better way than duplicating the frame.

      But it certainly does allow a free-standing frame to continue the numbering.

      vinny38
      vinny38
      Legend
      May 3, 2019

      Daniel308  wrote

      because of the way this spread is formatted, this new figure can not be threaded.

      If you can't thread figure's frame, you still should be able to anchor it.

      Just click and drag the blue port somewhere between figure 52 and figure 53.

      Not knowing your layout, you might be careful about possible reflowing issues. You can change anchored object options if needed.

      See example below:

      FRIdNGE
      FRIdNGE
      May 3, 2019

      Sorry Vinny but truly not convinced! …

      Here 3 threads with "blue" anchored and "red" not-anchored frames! …

      I could add a full-page figure 36 on the page 6 to be clearer! …

      That means anchor images is not alway possible where they would need to be anchored!

      BUT, what is possible is to anchor a text frame with the numbering and create a cross-reference for each unanchored figure caption!

      Like this, the game becomes really simple:

      Here, I've removed the "old" anchored figure 28 and update the cross-ref.:

      Now, same thing with the "old" not-anchored figure 25:

      As you see, the "new" figures 29 and 28 are not nice!

      It's totally normal because of the anchor of the figure 28 we found now "before" the anchor of the figure 29!

      … So just let's move it!

      Of course, to play, the user will need a workable text flow! but if he makes some layout efforts, he could win the game!

      BTW, he could need a simple tool like this one:  place the cursor in the text and play a script that will anchor at this place a new "num" text frame, create a not-anchored graphic frame asking the user what image he wants to be imported adding its caption with the corresponding cross-ref.! The only thing to do after that is to place the figure on the right page! … Manually! 

      To finish, of course, the user can make the source numbering of the not-anchored figures totally invisible [object style]!

      Best regards,

      Michel, fro FRIdNGE

      vinny38
      vinny38
      Legend
      May 3, 2019

      Hi Michel,

      As I said, "Not knowing your layout, you might be careful about possible reflowing issues"

      Questions without screenshots should not even be answered

      Now, if the question simply is: is there an alternative to threading in order to keep numbered paragraph continuous, I intend to answer "yes there is: anchoring."

      If the question is: how do you maintain perfect flowing using threading and/or anchoring, without off-limit anchored object, my answer would be: "Please provide detailed screenshots. Flowing isn't a piece of cake."

      However, I like your approach. It opens a wide range of possibilities.


      Regards

      Barb Binder
      Community Expert
      Barb BinderCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      May 2, 2019

      Hi Daniel:

      It's not ideal, but you can just override the two numbers by opening up the Bullets and Numbering directly (and not editing the style). When you add your new figure, edit the List Type: Numbers to Mode: Start at 53. Then edit the current 53 to start at 54. The rest will update accordingly.

      ~Barb

      ~Barb at Rocky Mountain Training
      D
      Daniel308Author
      Known Participant
      May 2, 2019

      Hi Barb.

      Thanks for the suggestion. You're right, definitely not ideal...this is a popular training text in a highly regulated industry with frequent updates. Forcing something like this is just begging for serious (and very difficult to spot) errors to be introduced in the future.

      I am really hoping that there is some other correct way to handle this given a) that we do in fact have the ability to have numbering span unthreaded blocks and stories, and b) I would guess this to be fairly common situation in layout.

      Given that copy / past reorders lists, I don't understand why there wouldn't / couldn't be an "order" button that says "PLACE BEFORE" and just let us select or enter a number from the list...AND give us a "Auto-Reflow" button (based on physical location) when we get into trouble with "Place Before" (which I'm sure some would) : )

      Eric Dumas
      Community Expert
      Eric DumasCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      May 2, 2019

      Hi,

      Can you confirm the version of InDesign and of the Operating System?

      How did you add the content in your document? Was it imported from MS Word, or Pasted in, did you use Articles...?

      D
      Daniel308Author
      Known Participant
      May 2, 2019

      Hi Eric.

      I‘m using ID cc (latest by subscription) on Mac OSX (latest).  All of the content was either authored in ID or pasted into the document and no, haven’t used Articles.

      Terms & ConditionsAccessibility statement
      Using the community Terms of use Privacy Cookie preferences Do not sell or share my personal information ad choicesAdChoices