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Known Participant
September 25, 2017
Question

Performance - From a Computer Science Point of View

  • September 25, 2017
  • 74 replies
  • 2259 views

Like others, I am having a frustrating time with Lightroom editing photos from a performance standpoint.

My workflow typically has me creating a new catalog for a particular photo shoot, importing the (RAW) photos and applying a custom preset on import and then editing the photos one by one in the Develop Module.

After editing a number of photos (say, 10-25) the performance of Lightroom degrades significantly and I have to exit Lightroom and re-start it to continue editing (and continue to do so until I have completed my editing).

I have done significant research into Lightroom performance issues and have tried all of the suggestions and all possible permutations thereof to no avail.  I have also profiled Lightroom with a number of Windows development tools to take a look at it's I/O, threads, memory, etc. and nothing specifically stands out.

I do understand that Lightroom stores it's editing changes (whether via a preset or manually) in a SQLite database and then applies these changes to a photo in 'real-time' to render what you see on the screen.  That leads me to believe that the program is having a difficult time querying the database and applying the changes in 'real-time'... it is almost like there is a 'leak' as one moves from one photo to the next.

Edit: I took a quick look at the Lightroom .lcat file which is actually a SQLite database.  In it, I found 102 tables.  Still looking at the relationships between these tables.

All of the suggestions to add faster disks, larger caches, build previews, etc. are all masking the real culprit which I believe is an internal data structure, database, etc. issue.  My 'evidence' for this is that exiting and re-invoking Lightroom will always provide me great performance until I reach 10-25 photos and then I have to 'rinse and repeat'.

What I would like to know from the Lightroom software development team is whether there is a way for uses to 'peek' inside the program to know what is actually going on from an operating system and computer science perspective (open files, memory allocation, threads, locks, etc.).  I would assume that the Lightroom software development team knows exactly what is going on as the program is likely instrumented.  Knowing what it is that is causing Lightroom to gradually degrade its performance will help users understand how our behavior might need to change when using Lightroom to improve our experience (like perhaps not/not applying presets to hundreds of photos at once rather, do so as you edit one photo at a time).

I do love Photoshop and Lightroom and recommend the products to everyone that ask me for advice but I also believe that Lightroom's performance issues are serious and need to be addressed.

Thank you for your consideration

This topic has been closed for replies.

74 replies

Inspiring
October 23, 2017
Simon, I thought you might like to see what we are up against.

First, in case you did not see my comments below, this you may find interesting.

So I had a small photo shoot this morning (200 Nikon D5 RAW images). I opened LR Classic CC and started importing from my 440Mb/Sec XQD memory Card at 10:57am. Lightroom has finished copying the photos to my hard drive (finished at 12:04 - one hour and 7 minutes) and is still building standard previews (it is now 12:20pm and it is almost done). As soon as LR finished, it ejected the XQD card. So, I removed it and reinserted it. While LR is still processing standard previews, I opened Capture One and started importing from the XQD card to a second folder on the same hard drive - essentially, the same procedure. Both are applying my basic start preset of adjustments and some metadata. Started the Capture One upload at 12:08 and it took 2 minutes and 20 seconds to copy the photos and another 1 minute and 7 seconds to finish building the previews. Capture One did this while LR was still creating standard previews.

WOW! 

Lightroom finished at 12:22 so the entire process took 2 hours and 25 minutes to copy the images and create standard previews. Thank the lord I didn't create 1:1 previews. Capture One did the same job, while LR was running in 3 minutes 27 seconds. 

In addition, during the import, Capture one is fully functional but a little slower. Lightroom Classic, one the other hand, is totally locked up during the import making it unusable until the import is completed.

Am I missing something here?????

Here is a video of the current LR Classic performance issue from the wedding I mentioned in posts a few days ago. Those photos took about 6 hours to import.

Perhaps this will help you see what I am facing and how this is seriously hurting my business. Please, please, help me as I can no longer work on my customer photos.

Inspiring
October 23, 2017
So I had a small photo shoot this morning (200 Nikon D5 RAW images). I opened LR Classic CC and started importing from my 440Mb/Sec XQD memory Card at 10:57am. Lightroom has finished copying the photos to my hard drive (finished at 12:04 - one hour and 7 minutes) and is still building standard previews (it is now 12:20pm and it is almost done). As soon as LR finished, it ejected the XQD card. So, I removed it and reinserted it. While LR is still processing standard previews, I opened Capture One and started importing from the XQD card to a second folder on the same hard drive - essentially, the same procedure. Both are applying my basic start preset of adjustments and some metadata. Started the Capture One upload at 12:08 and it took 2 minutes and 20 seconds to copy the photos and another 1 minute and 7 seconds to finish building the previews. Capture One did this while LR was still creating standard previews.

WOW! 

Lightroom finished at 12:22 so the entire process took 2 hours and 25 minutes to copy the images and create standard previews. Thank the lord I didn't create 1:1 previews. Capture One did the same job, while LR was running in 3 minutes 27 seconds. 

In addition, during the import, Capture one is fully functional but a little slower. Lightroom Classic, one the other hand, is totally locked up during the import making it unusable until the import is completed.

Am I missing something here?????

Simon, what exactly is going on here???
Participating Frequently
October 21, 2017
Joel, with you 100% on that, well said (with LR from Raw Shooter, and 37 yrs in s/w coding & design).
Inspiring
October 21, 2017
Simon,

We appreciate the efforts of the team, however, you have been telling me this for over one year. I cannot begin to tell you how much you have hurt my business.

When Adobe releases this last update, enhancement, new product group and design (I am not sure what to call this mess of products now) instead of addressing the issues we have been suffering with for so long, it becomes blatantly obvious where Adobe has its priorities.

Many of us in this group have Computer Science backgrounds and have offered to run debug code, supply you with presets, send you the catalogs, etc. and all we here from Adobe is "The team are working on and it just takes a little bit more design iterations..." 

How much longer can Adobe intentionally ignore this issue as many of us are trying and using software from your competitors. On my same computer, the competitors software is blazing fast, does not slow down, uses my GPU efficiently, etc. So, we all know the issue can be fixed but will Adobe ever stop adding new functionality long enough to fix what today remains essentially unusable.

I know, the team are working on it...
fingham1Author
Known Participant
October 21, 2017
I concur with the instrumentation observation but I do appreciate Adobe working diligently to find the error(s) and fix them.  I have used sysinternals tools (on Windows 10) to try to track down the issue and nothing jumps out to me (yet).  I am hoping that with Adobe Max over with, the team has a little more time to really dig into this issue.  I would be happy to send the team the photos and preset I use on import to see if they can replicate the issue however, the set is many GB in size.

Simon - if you all do have a debug flag or compilation with symbols, etc., I would be happy to run it with my photos and send your team any logs that might be generated.  I know chasing things like this down without being able to replicate {n} users's systems is frustrating.
Adobe Employee
October 21, 2017
The team are working on and it just takes a little bit more design iterations...
Inspiring
October 21, 2017
I'm new here and I just read the last several weeks of posts in this thread.

 It appears to me that neither memory,  I/O or processors (including  a single core) are maxed out.  We could get those symptoms with CPU cache thrashing or intra-core communication problems,  but that would not explain performance degradation over time.   It's not a memory leak problem,  because the degradation continues with plenty of free memory.   And there isn't an I/O bottleneck (SSDs don't make much of a difference).

I suspect the tactical problem is lock contention   and the root cause is inadequate instrumentation/tools to detect which locks are not being released.

That said, I may be completely off-base.  Do any of you have other ideas about the cause?
Inspiring
October 18, 2017

Okay, I admit it - I am totally confused. All of us begged Adobe to fix the speed issues with Lightroom and as I recall, they told us they were working on it. Well, I just upgraded to the new LR Classic and it is still so slow that it is not usable (see attached video).

I guess I am just not too bright!! 

Below the video, you will find my System Info from the new LR Classic.

 


Lightroom Classic version: 7.0 [ 1140024 ]
License: Creative Cloud
Operating system: Windows 10
Version: 10.0
Application architecture: x64
System architecture: x64
Logical processor count: 12
Processor speed: 3.3 GHz
Built-in memory: 65446.8 MB
Real memory available to Lightroom: 65446.8 MB
Real memory used by Lightroom: 4226.7 MB (6.4%)
Virtual memory used by Lightroom: 4913.1 MB
GDI objects count: 814
USER objects count: 2877
Process handles count: 2570
Memory cache size: 1806.7MB
Maximum thread count used by Camera Raw: 5
Camera Raw SIMD optimization: SSE2,AVX,AVX2
Camera Raw virtual memory: 2440MB / 32723MB (7%)
Camera Raw real memory: 2855MB / 65446MB (4%)
System DPI setting: 96 DPI
Desktop composition enabled: Yes
Displays: 1) 1920x1080, 2) 1920x1080
Input types: Multitouch: No, Integrated touch: No, Integrated pen: Yes, External touch: No, External pen: Yes, Keyboard: No

Graphics Processor Info: 
DirectX: NVIDIA GeForce GTX TITAN X



Application folder: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Lightroom Classic CC
Library Path: J:\Lightroom Catalogs\20170725 - Maine & Newport\20170725 - Maine & Newport-2.lrcat
Settings Folder: C:\Users\joelw\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\Lightroom

Installed Plugins: 
1) AdobeStock
2) Canon Tether Plugin
3) ColorChecker Passport
4) Facebook
5) Flickr
6) LR/Instagram
7) Nikon Tether Plugin
😎 ON1 Photo RAW 2017
9) ON1 Resize 2017

Config.lua flags: None

Adapter #1: Vendor : 10de
Device : 17c2
Subsystem : 29903842
Revision : a1
Video Memory : 12244
Adapter #2: Vendor : 1414
Device : 8c
Subsystem : 0
Revision : 0
Video Memory : 0
AudioDeviceIOBlockSize: 1024
AudioDeviceName: Speakers (Realtek High Definition Audio)
AudioDeviceNumberOfChannels: 2
AudioDeviceSampleRate: 48000
Build: 10.0x7
Direct2DEnabled: false
GL_ACCUM_ALPHA_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_BLUE_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_GREEN_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_RED_BITS: 16
GL_ALPHA_BITS: 0
GL_BLUE_BITS: 8
GL_DEPTH_BITS: 24
GL_GREEN_BITS: 8
GL_MAX_3D_TEXTURE_SIZE: 2048
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE: 16384
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_UNITS: 4
GL_MAX_VIEWPORT_DIMS: 16384,16384
GL_RED_BITS: 8
GL_RENDERER: GeForce GTX TITAN X/PCIe/SSE2
GL_SHADING_LANGUAGE_VERSION: 4.50 NVIDIA
GL_STENCIL_BITS: 8
GL_VENDOR: NVIDIA Corporation
GL_VERSION: 4.5.0 NVIDIA 384.76
GPUDeviceEnabled: false
OGLEnabled: true
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fingham1Author
Known Participant
September 29, 2017
Hi,  I took a look at the tables as well recently and what I took away from them was that the LR team has done a lot of work to normalize the tables.  It is interesting to take a look at how individual image adjustments are stored in the underlying database.  Since the database seems to keep each adjustment (or set of adjustments in a single 'visit' to an image) as a new row, it would be possible to step back {n} 'visits' and take a 'snapshot' on any one of those 'visits', even after the fact.  From an algorithmic standpoint, it is very clever.  That said, I do hope that when you 'visit' an image - even if you have visited it 100 times and made adjustments - that the last 'record' of your adjustments for that particular image is rapidly retrieved and applied and that all 100 do not need to be separately applied in order.  That likely is not possible if one makes brush-type of adjustments... those likely are applied one-by-one... but for all others that apply to the image as a whole, that should be what happens.
Participant
September 29, 2017

I worked 25 years designing systems and working with databases was the norm for me.  I haven't done it again in four years.

I decided to look at the .lcat file to get an idea of the content.  I found 102 tables but none related to any other!, this is contrary to what should be in a well designed relational database.  Even I found tables without primary key!

I imagine that when Lightroom was born they handled all the information in 102 individual files scattered, years later they decided to manage the information in a database but sadly they only converted the files into tables and did not design a true relational database.

Relational database managers are very powerfull, I used to handle 90000 pdf files (embedded as BLOB data in a table) in a plain laptop with less resources than my actual 27” Imac with 24 GB RAM, crawling just to update the keywords of 4000 pictures and creating several Smart Collections.

If someone finds a table with a foreing key column, tell me which one it is, I can't find it.  I never used SQLite before.