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Question

Grain / noise on CR3 photos from Canon R5

Forum|Forum|5 years ago
March 1, 2021
6 replies
12351 views

Hello, I notice high levels of grain/noise in photos with low ISO settings (100-125). Compared to Other editors/viewers its quite bad, resulting in soft photos. (Not optimal sharp). I found multiple boards with the same problem, Is there a fix for this problem?

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Jeff2763286226t6

Participant

I have been using the 5D Mark IV and I'm in the process of switching to mirrorless. The R3 does not have this issue, but the R5 does. I'm using the latest version of Lightroom Classic as of 11-15-2023. I have had to turn the sharpness down to 75 and the radius down to 0.5. I have also added 5 of luminance noise reduction and 20 of color noise reduction. I only have to use these settings with the R5. This looks like an old post so has anyone found a solution to the problem other than what I have has to do? Thanks.

J

Jao vdL

Community Expert

RTo any of the folks seeing bad noise with R5 files, can you share a few files and perhaps post screenshots of what you're seeing? Also please make sure to post the exact version number of Lightroom or Lightroom Classic that you are using. I do not own this camera but downloaded a bunch of low and high ISO images from this camera from dpreview and see nothing like what you describe. Just exactly what you expect from a modern high megapixel camera. About as good as comparable cameras from the same generation. Typically none of these images would need any messing with the detail sliders. Certainly nothing that looks like what is being described here so I am really curious.

Ian Lyons

Community Expert

See my response in https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic/canon-r5-noise-amp-grain-with-lightroom-vs-dpp-wow/td-p/11949525

With an example from my own R5 (400 ISO image shown in above linked post). I find that with default settings, Lightroom Classic (LrC) displays the level of noise that I expect for a high megapixel camera whereas DPP 4 appears noise free, albeit not as sharp looking as LrC. However, if I set DPP 4 noise to '0', the difference between LrC and DPP 4 in terms of noise and sharpness is marginal. Furthermore, reducing the shapening 'Detail' slider in LrC from default setting of 25 to 10 effectively closes the gap.

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Jao vdL

Community Expert

Hey Ian, this looks exactly like what I would expect. DPP is just being (to my taste) overly aggressive in its noise reduction. Your DPP=0 image holds far better detail than the default noise reduction one which looks washed over. The noise is also exactly like what you expect from a ISO400 shot on a high megapixel modern camera. Either way even if you prefer the look of the default dpp image, it would be trivial to mimic this with a simple preset in Lightroom. This also only matters for gigantic prints where the noise retaining image actually might look better if nothing else was done to it.

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Klickflip

Known Participant

Hi, I posted recently about this , with tests comparing LR and DPP
now tested with `capture one pro 21 , it's night and day .
much more noiseless and sharper files.
I said it before, LR is applying some extra noise grain over (all) files compared to Capture one pro .

I want to use light room as it would be one less software to pay for ...

but C1 is miles ahead , for R5 anyway .
To be fair , I have used c1 as man in processor for years , and Lightroom classic and mobile for some personal , family , holiday photos . As I can import and edit them on my iPad. Which is the only real benefit over C1 .
but the file structure and catalogue still does my head in compared to c1 sessions .

pkus the new highlights /' shadows / whites ' blacks control on C1 is sublime for naturally eeking the most out of raws , without images looking like to heavy HDR.

W

wanderingcrow

Known Participant

@Klickflip just out of curiousity, did you use the new LR or LR Classic? And is LR updated?

I did C1 for a short time after getting my R5, but just did the month-to-month subscription and let it go when the new LR seemed to fix my problems. If C1 is still giving better files though...

M

martyn_legge

Participant

I have been using the r5 for just a week now. I also use a 5dmk 4 and a 1dx mk 2. I always shoot raw. Even at low iso the noise in r5 images is poor in Lightroom cc when compared with the other cameras. Using exactly the same lenses. I was about to send the r5 back thinking it was faulty but I tried using canons own raw processor. Digital photo professional. The difference is astonishing. Sharper, much better colour and no detectable noise at sensible iso levels. I have not got to the bottom

of this yet but right now lightroom which has been the mainstay of my workflow for years is not doing a good job. Dpp is horrible to use but out of the box it's giving much better results. I live in hope that Adobe will fix this soon. If not I'll be looking for alternatives.

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Jao vdL

Community Expert

I don't have an R5 so hard to test but it is certainly possible that the default noise reduction for the R5 is not set as well as other cameras in Lightroom. If you think that is the case you can easily and trivially set a default that applies more noise reduction by default on your raw files. You can also bring it up at https://feedback.photoshop.com where actual engineers hang out. Here we are just other users and can't do much to fix issues just help you work with Lightroom.

That said, I downloaded a few R5 raw files at different ISOs from https://www.dpreview.com/sample-galleries/7757595702/canon-eos-r5-sample-gallery/0449051777 and they look perfectly normal to me. Exactly what you expect for a modern high megapixel camera and no different from any of my modern cameras. Virtually no noise (but not nothing as that is impossible physically) at ISO 100 and a tiny bit at higher ISOs (expected from basic physics) that is easily gotten rid of by spending a few seconds optimizing the noise reduction and sharpening settings. Also I see no difference between the raw rendering in Lightroom vs the in-camera jpeg (at the same link) except a bit of difference in color rendering which is expected as they use different camera profiles (adobe apparently still hasn't provided camera-matching profiles for the R5!). To me it looks like the default noise reduction settings are pretty much correct and consistent with other cameras.

Also downloaded a ISO3200 image (the one with the comet over the mountains) and you see more noise in the raw in Lightroom than in the jpeg but the jpeg is way oversmoothed with very ugly noise. The Lightroom version is far better in honest rendering of the noise and a few moves of the noise reduction and sharpening sliders (especially masking slider is important with high ISO images) get you way better results than the in-camera jpeg (identical to the DPP rendering by default)

J

Jao vdL

Community Expert

This is completely normal. Lightroom by standard applies very little noise reduction and sharpening. The in camera jpeg engine in most cameras very aggressively applies noise reduction and sharpening. Many file viewers simply show you the in camera jpeg which will have this noise reduction applied. What you are seeing in Lightroom is closer to the actual raw data and you generally will need to optimize the noise reduction and sharpening a bit. You can also change the defaults to be a bit more aggressive in noise reduction and sharpening, or alternatively change the default for the camera to use in camera settings (Preferences->Import->Raw defaults). For many cameras (don't know about the R5 but for my Z7 it does) this will pick up the noise reduction and sharpening settings from the camera instead of using the very soft Lightroom defaults.

Ian Lyons

Community Expert

Jao,

The Canon EOS R5 and R6 setttings for noise, sharpen, etc are not used by Adobe Camera Raw or the various versions Lightroom

J

Jao vdL

Community Expert

Thanks. Good to know. On my Z7 the settings are used - actually to my annoyance as they are far too aggressive with way too high sharpening radius that actually degrades detail in my images so I stopped using camera settings there.

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wanderingcrow

Known Participant

I noticed the same thing. I've been a Lightroom user since Aperture folded, the new Lightroom has a clean interface, the iPadOS companion app is great, and I love the cloud sync feature, but if I'm forced to choose between my camera and Lightroom...

There are $15 camera profiles you can buy (since Adobe won't/can't provide them). These help but don't fix the problem. I'm likely to switch to Capture One.

It will suck, but Lightroom (for me) was the last tool keeping me on Creative Cloud. Affinity has come out with really solid answers for InDesign, Illustrator, and Photoshop. Lightroom and the cloud sync was the only thing keeping me from moving.

Please post back if you or anyone else finds the answer, it's been really frustrating.

W

wanderingcrow

Known Participant

I contacted tech support. According to the tech, this is a known issue and the R5 is not supported at the moment. I pointed him to Adobe release information that said the R5 was supported, and he insisted that it is NOT supported.

<sigh>

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