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Known Participant
April 16, 2025
Question

How does Premiere's automatic reverse-telecine work?

  • April 16, 2025
  • 2 replies
  • 584 views

I can't seem to find any official technical explanation as to how Premiere determines what the interlaced pulldown cadence of a 29.97 clip is when you edit it into a 23.98 sequence. Does it work by scanning the first few frames of the clip, guessing the cadence (like how After Effects does it in its Interpret Footage panel), and just blindly using that cadence to remove the pulldown on the rest of the clip?

 

I'm having an issue prepping episodes of a TV show that were delivered to us as interlaced 29.97 DNxHD .mxf files (with interlaced pulldown), and for some reason, some of the episode masters appear to have broken pulldown cadences, usually when a new "act" occurs in the show. I'm not sure what workflow they're using to generate these full 29.97i (59.94i) episode masters, but it causes problems when we try to edit clips from these masters into a 23.98 Premiere timeline, because parts of the master will play back with massive frame-skipping in the 23.98 sequence because Premiere is applying the wrong cadence for the automatic pulldown removal. And yet another part of the same episode file will play back perfectly with removed pulldown.

 

This wouldn't be a huge problem if Premiere allowed you to force specific pulldown cadences on a clip (similar to the various "WS" pulldown options in After Effects). That way, I could import a second instance of the same clip, and apply a different cadence to it in order to compensate for the broken pulldown cadence in the actual file. But sadly it appears that  there's no way in Premiere to do this.

 

The interesting thing is that on one specific episode, Premiere's pulldown removal worked perfectly on a scene towards the back end of the clip, but the removal on the entire front end of the episode looked totally janky. My only guess is that because the head of the episode file had a 2-second fade-up from black, Premiere didnt have enough image data on those frames to be able to properly guess the interlaced pulldown cadence?

 

Right now my workaround for all of this has been to duplicate the episode clip in the Project, create a single-angle Multicam clip for each instance, then edit the in/out points of each act inside of it's own Multicam sequence. Then when you edit the Multicam clip into a 23.98 sequence, Premiere will (apparantly) detect the pulldown cadence for just that section of the clip, and removes it accordingly. 

 

The one flaw in this workaround is that if you Flatten the Multicam clips in the 23.98 sequence, the "bad" reverse-telecine of the original clip will re-appear. 

 

Now that Adobe is full-bore into AI, it would be nice for there to be an option to intelligently scan a source file for broken pulldown cadence, and dynamically removes that pulldown on a shot by shot basis. Or at the very least, add the same "Interpret Footage" options that After Effects has (DaVinci Resolve also has a similar option), where you can explictly force a pulldown removal cadence on a clip instance, rather than relying solely on Premiere to do the guessing for you, because clearly it guesses wrong sometimes.

 

 

2 replies

R Neil Haugen
Legend
May 16, 2025

From  having had to deal with this for a few things over the years, I've some little experience but don't consider myself to have any actual expertise at it.

 

I think you're right ... Premiere can sort clips out ok, mostly, for auto-magically doing pull-down removal/de-interlacing. I've mostly been able to get by with this.

 

But a few times, it didn't, and the advice was immediately and consistently ... use Ae for any clip that isn't sorted by Premiere. It's pretty quick and easy to sort in Ae, and I was told to just have it sort the issue and export a replacement clip so the problem is GONE.

 

That may be the practical working process at this time for you.

 

@Warren Heaton10841144 @Richard M Knight @Jarle Leirpoll 

Everyone's mileage always varies ...
Known Participant
May 16, 2025

Normally I would do this, but in this case, we're working with hour-long broadcast masters of episodic TV shows that we're cutting network promos/sizzles from, so it's a significant monkey-wrench in our normal workflow to have to create new intermediate files of huge chunks of reversed-telecine'd material. If Adobe could just give the editor more control to override the pulldown removal cadence options, that would be ideal, especially since this option has existed in AE since the 1990's!

R Neil Haugen
Legend
May 16, 2025

Hey Mel!

 

And yea, totally agreed, I've asked a number of times at NAB why they don't have the same pull-down in Pr as Ae ... basically, I think it may be that the underlying coding of the two apps is completely different, you can't just copy/paste something from one to the other.

 

And this is a complex thing to do, it's already available in Ae ... ergo ... hasn't been done in Pr. Kinda understandable if still frustrating. I've had someone in the past say they worked in a network shop that had a render farm for one Ae machine just to do this, as for them, it was a constant issue.

Everyone's mileage always varies ...
Kevin-Monahan
Community Manager
Community Manager
April 16, 2025

Hey there, Mel.
Thanks for the excellent question. Let me track down an answer for you. Please allow me a little time as I have to hear back from the product team and they are all digging out from NAB, likely. I hope that's OK.

 

Thanks,
Kevin

 

Kevin Monahan - Sr. Community & Engagement Strategist – Pro Video and Audio
Known Participant
May 16, 2025

Hi Kevin, just following up with this? Any more info on this?

 

The more I think about it, the more I believe that the simplest solution to this problem would be to have the same "Fields and Pulldown" option panel that After Effects has had since the very beginning (Davinci Resolve also has a similar option). 

While automatic pulldown removal in Premiere is a nice—albeit totally undocumented—feature, it becomes a pain when it's assumptions of what the actual pulldown cadence is turns out to be wrong. There needs to be a way to manually override the cadence on every instance of the clip.