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A
Afterglow
Known Participant
September 20, 2024
Question

Mac export color - ongoing issue

  • September 20, 2024
  • 1 reply
  • 598 views

I've done another sweep through online discussions about editing on a Mac with its idiosyncratic gamma setting and nothing much seems to have changed. 

 

So you're editing in Premiere, adding LUTs to footage, color correcting in Lumetri, everything looks great on the Mac Studio and the video monitor, then you export at a reasonably high bit rate and in the Mac space, the video looks washed out. Once uploaded to online (Vimeo, Youtube, Facebook, etc), it should look more like it did in Premiere but really it still looks low-contrast.

 

Some of this is from two major passes of compression. But isn't there some LUT or treatment that can be applied on exporting from Premiere that can at least minimise loss of contrast, etc?

 

I've been fooling around with SDR and Tone Mapping in the Export Effects tab with mixed success.

 

Working on Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32gb ram, OS Monterey 12.7.6. Thanks.

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1 reply

R Neil Haugen
R Neil Haugen
Legend
September 20, 2024

This has only been explained a billion times. You cannot possibly get where you expect to get.

 

Why?

 

Decisions made by Apple. Purely, simply, Apple being "Apple". Unique.

 

The long-time established display transform for Rec.709 video is essentially similar to a gamma of 2.4.

 

That is what all non-Mac systems, especially all professional, broadcast compliant systems and applications expect.

 

But Apple chose to use a different display transform for Rec.709, in their ColorSync color management  utility. Essentially similar to gamma 1.96.

 

So if a file looks good with a display transform of 2.4, it will be a bit light in the shadows with a display gamma of 1.96.

 

If a file looks good with a display transform of 1.96, it will be way too dark with a display gamma of 2.4.

 

But wait, there's more! Macs with Reference modes, set to HDTV, also use gamma 2.4! 

 

So Apple isn't consistent even within their own ecosystem!

 

So you must pick whom you wish to produce for. Just understand, no professional media you have ever watched was graded with a display transform of 1.96.

 

Within Premiere, use the Viewer Gamma setting set to 1.96/QuickTime, and ...

  • it will look very similar outside Premiere, on Macs without reference modes, but only when using QuickTime Player, Chrome and Safari browsers;
  • it will be too dark on the same Macs using VLC or Potplayer video players; and ...
  • it will also look way to dark on all non-Mac screens, and even on Macs with Reference modes

 

Between the other two options for viewer gamma, 

  • IF you are working in a darkened room, used gamma 2.4/broadcast.
  • IF you aare working in a normally lit room, use gamma 2.2/web.

 

Because it is your viewing environment ambient light level ... that by professional standards, controls which display transform ... 2.2 or 2.4 ... you use while grading.

 

And with both of these options, it will be too light outside Premiere, on Macs without reference modes only!!!! ... and only for QuickTime player, Chrome and Safari browsers.

 

All other screens will see a more similar image relative to that screen's "normal" to what you saw while grading with viewer gamma of 2.2 or 2.4.

 

Please note, this affects how you view the file while grading, it doesn't do ANYTHING to the export. You grade it while viewing it differently, you have graded the file differently.

 

And past that, all colorists are trained to realize that no one will ever ... on any other screen!!! ...no matter how delivered, either broadcast/streaming/DVD-BluRay or movie theater  ... will see what you saw while grading. Period.

 

Screens are that much different from each other. It's a freaking mess "out there".

 

And yes, I work for/with/teach pro colorists. Have for years.

Everyone's mileage always varies ...
A
AfterglowAuthor
Known Participant
September 23, 2024

I sense your frustration, thanks, and was aware of the different gamma settings. My enquiry was more about 1. if there had been any updates to Mac gamma madness and 2. workarounds. 

 

I'm now trialling changing Premiere gamma setting from 2.4 to 2.2. 

 

I also realise with SLOG3 footage I shoot on Sony cameras, I've been too cautious in not pulling black levels down. I've experimented with the Lumetri black levels of various low contrast clips then exported and uploaded them to Vimeo/Youtube until they look satisfactory. Only 1 in every 10 projects I work on ends up on air/broadcast. The rest is all online.

    R Neil Haugen
    R Neil Haugen
    Legend
    September 24, 2024

    Nope, no changes from Apple on their odd ColorSync Rec.709 display transform. Sadly.

     

    And all workarounds are simpy ... kinda ... mostly ... not worth the time. Most of the colorists I know have simply given up and do things To The Standard. And given that 1) every screen out there is different and 2) no one EVER will see the same image you saw while grading, no matter the delivery method ... well, it's a right mess anyway.

     

    Over which you never ever have control anyway.

     

    Pro colorists do not spend thousands of dollars on Grade 1 Reference monitors, thousands more on spectros and software to calibrate, several hundred on a Decklink card, and work that darkened room, so that you see the image they saw when grading.

     

    Because that never, ever, can possibly happen. Screen variability is all over the place, the viewing environment multiplies issues, and not even on full broadcast TV can they ever expect you'll see the image they saw.

     

    So why spend all that money and time to match their setup to The Standard?

     

    It's about relativity.

     

    In relative terms, the media they produce will look like other professionally produced media, on every screen out there, as each user is used to seeing it. On their screen.

     

    "You can't fix gramma's green TV."

    Everyone's mileage always varies ...
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