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the_wine_snob
the_wine_snob
Inspiring
January 28, 2012
Answered

Community Help Posts

  • January 28, 2012
  • 8 replies
  • 13111 views

I have seen a few posts from the Community Help group/portal, that were placed in a few of the product forums. All that I am seeing are the link to an Adobe KB Article, that I assume points someone to a starting point, in answering their question, and in one, a reply, but not sure that that reply indicated that the linked article helped, or not. What I am not seeing is any reference to the original question.

Pierre kindly responded that these posts are being generated, and populated to the appropriate product forum, and I think that is a great idea - sort of what most of us do here, when one has posted of a product problem, or question.

This THREAD in the PrPro Forum, is an example, along with Pierre's comment to me.

I do not know if perhaps I am just not seeing the original post/question (on Chrome on PC), or if something is missing, and the original question is not propogating in the Community Help post?

In the Thread, you can see my initial Reply, and then Pierre's, and then my Reply to Pierre. The Adobe KB Article link, also shows that interaction, down thread. What I cannot find is the question, that initiated this. I feel that the Adobe KB Article will be helpful, on "How to Create a Title in PrPro," but cannot be sure.

This question might just be about ME not seeing the question, that initiated the responses, or perhaps MY just not looking in the right spot - or, it could be that the question, that prompted the response post, is just not showing up, and something needs to be changed.

I am not up on Community Help, so might just be missing something on my end. Looks like it might be a great idea, but seems that one piece is missing, or has not been implemented yet?

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Hunt

      This topic has been closed for replies.
      Correct answer Captiv8r

      Hi Hunt

      I've been watching this thread with interest.

      Personally, I have to say that I dislike Community Help as it stands. I dislike the viewer and overall presentation. It takes far too long to load up and present anything helpful. It's not friendly. It's not nimble. It's obtrusive. But that's just me.

      I'm also a volunteer moderator for Community Help for a couple of Adobe products. One of my peeves (and I'm guessing the reason behind this change) is that it becomes confusing to end users where they should go to ask for help with whatever they are using. In my mind, the ability to offer comments on the help is intended to allow expounding on something that may not have been explained well. Or to suggest that something that is missing be added to the help.

      Unfortunately I've noticed that many users discover this commenting ability and they choose to use it to ask for help when they really should be asking in the user forums. And it's frustrating when I see other moderators engage them and offer help there instead of properly directing them to the forums for proper discussion.

      Cheers... Rick

      8 replies

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 18, 2012

      Well, here is a new example of a CH post in the forum in Spanish:

      http://forums.adobe.com/message/4213698?tstart=0#4213698

      Some comments:

      1. It's not clear which product the discussion refers to, unless one happens to notice the name "illustrator" buried in the middle of the link.
      2. The link takes one to a multi page document, each with a different help topic. I gave up counting after 12 pages.
      3. The help post is followed by a message asking a question that, for me at least, is difficult to guess if it is directly related whith the topic in the title of the help message, or to that of one of the other pages in the link, or is a new question. This message has the same posting date and time than the opening message.
      4. As this second message is in Spanish and the text of the help message is in English, it is easy to be led to think that it is indeed a new question. This happened to Federico, the most knowledgeable and helpful participant in the forum in Spanish, the author of the third message, one of the many people in that forum who still do not understand CH posts.

      My previous suggestion on this was crippled because I left out my reasons for making it after having to rewrite my message, and gave up when I lost a second long message; and also because the system graciously eliminated the blank lines that clarified its structure.

      Quite frankly, I think that the CH messages may be a very good idea, but they certainly need a lot of polishing. In my opinion, at least. And at least when, in the forum in Spanish (one forum for all Adobe products, with no subforum of any kind and no moderators, remember?), they misteriously and unexpextedly fall down out of the blue sky.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 29, 2012

      Same CH thread again,

      http://forums.adobe.com/message/4236570#4236570

      showing how confusing the situation can get. After Federico answered in message #2 the question in Spanish by natan70 in message #1, natan posted more details in message #3. Then Federico gave a more precise answer in message #4, which natan thanked in message #5, stating that this had solved his problem. And I, in message #6, I asked natan to mark the question as answered, forgetting that he isn't the originator of the thread...



      Jacob Bugge
      Community Expert
      Jacob BuggeCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      February 16, 2012

      I am with Claudio here: the appearance is rather confusing.

      This is quite well expressed in post #2 here:

      http://forums.adobe.com/thread/962626?tstart=0

      I hope there is a way to change it.

      By the way: are these threads the ones in which we shall enjoy the absence of points, or who will decide whether the questions have been answered?

      Zeno Bokor
      Zeno Bokor
      Inspiring
      February 16, 2012

      The Help Files was where the whole point system was first implemented so why wouldn't there be points awarded in those threads?:P Points are awarded as in any normal thread marked as a question, by the OP or by the moderators, it's just that the thread is also mirrored on the Help Files.

      Jacob Bugge
      Community Expert
      Jacob BuggeCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      February 17, 2012

      Zeno,

      The reason for my question is that the one with the question is not the OP: the ghostly entity Community Help is. So it seems that the one getting the help is in no position to communicate appreciation in other than words, just as in the days of the fair forums, and that the OP and the moderators are (one and) the same who will be judging the threads.

      The Help Files was where the whole point system was first implemented

      So it is no wonder they appear funny over here, see the link in post #28.

      It may be more tedious (for a while), but the way we do in this forum, sending posters to the right place, would seem a valid option, less tedious if the ones needing help are led to realize that they may find answers from other users to questions of/like their own.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 16, 2012

      Last night a new CHP appeared in the Forum in Spanish:

      http://forums.adobe.com/thread/963410?tstart=0

      As there is first a CHP and then a question from a participant, both with the same posting date and time, I am confused. Is this the question that the CHP is addressing, or is this a case of a participant using a CHP as a thread to post further questions?

      I apologize if I am being more dumb than usual.

      Zeno Bokor
      Zeno Bokor
      Inspiring
      February 16, 2012

      Yep, nowadays when somebody posts a question on the help files their question is turned into a forum thread started by "Community Help" and their question is put as the first post in that thread. This way the question (and all the answers) are present in both the help files and the forum.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 9, 2012

      Yesterday we got a new post from Community Help in the forum in Spanish:

      http://forums.adobe.com/thread/959809?tstart=0

      As fas as I can remember, the only change with previous (and undeleted) posts is that this one has a descriptive title in Spanish. However, and as expected by me, the thread was promptly used to post an unrelated question and its answer(s). May I suggest again that these posts are either closed, or open only for posts from selected participants?

      PECourtejoie
      Community Expert
      PECourtejoieCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      February 9, 2012

      Claudio, this one seems to be working fine, in that the original question is there. Of course, as it was the case in the help files, the question might not be related to the article at hand, but it has been quickly answered.

      In the past, those posts were confined to the community help (you can see that for the CS4 pages) and fewer people were answering them, and only with text. Now, the Community Help Moderators can use the features of the forum, other users can answer, and the forums get more visits/answers. The only downside I see is when people post corrections to the pages, or link to additional content. It might be confusing for the regular users of the forum, hence the explanation posts I made in some forums.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 10, 2012

      Pierre, I fail to see what is gained by Community Help by the addition of unrelated questions and answers -which can lead to long arguments...

      adobe-admin
      adobe-admin
      Legend
      February 4, 2012

      I believe that Jive has identified the issue of blank threads and developed a fix. Deploying it this evening will involve a bit of down time, probably around 30 minutes sometime between 6pm and 11pm Pacific Time.

      adobe-admin
      adobe-admin
      Legend
      February 4, 2012

      This issue appears to be resolved. Posts coming in from Community Help should now have a reply with the proper comment(s) from the Help system. If you continue to see any blanks please let us know.

      Thanks!

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 4, 2012

      Well, the post from Community Help that we were seeing in the Forum in Spanish are no longer there, so I cannot verify what has changed (except for their disappearing ).

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 1, 2012

      We now have three messages; and the link in the third takes one to the second page of the article in the second message. Not very useful, I would say.

      PECourtejoie
      Community Expert
      PECourtejoieCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      February 1, 2012

      Claudio, there is currently an issue that John Cornicello and Mark Nicholson are trying to fix. The question being asked is not displayed.

      Indeed, for localized "all in one" forums, it would be useful to have the app name as a prefix of the discussion. I'll forward that feedback.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      February 1, 2012

      Thanks for the info, Pierre. It's nice to have you back and active around here.

      Claudio González
      Claudio González
      Legend
      January 31, 2012

      Well, two of these Community Help messages have made their way to the Forum in Spanish. Here are my first impressions.

      1. I like the idea in principle, but not very much the way it is being implemented.

      2. First, these are being posted in a forum (the one in Spanish) that houses all Adobe products under the same roof, but without including any indication in their titles about which product they refer to. This forces one to open them to find out this, and then follow the included link to find what issue the article is addressing. Suggestion: as there are no mods in the Forum in Spanish, ask selected people to post details.

      3. Second, they are presented as ordinary threads, which makes it very easy to tranform them in endless discussions initiated by newcomers looking for help. Suggestion: close the threads except for selected people.

      4. The messages do not remain at the top of the list and can quickly go to the next page or, even worse, be archived. Suggestion: Create a new sticky folder/subforum with a descriptive title an keep a link at the top of the list of topics (like the one to the Report Spam thread).

      And that's enough as a start.

      PECourtejoie
      Community Expert
      PECourtejoieCommunity Expert
      Community Expert
      January 29, 2012

      Sorry, Bill, If there was some explanation to the users about the incoming changes, I definitively missed it. For the moment, it is only After Effects and Premiere that use this new system.

      The idea is to draw on the features of the forums (images posting, videos, etc.) and the other positive side effect is the expertise of all the forum regulars that can reply to the original question.

      There seems to be a problem somewhere, because in the tests I've seen, the original question does appear in both places. (and there is somebody that did one of such test questions very lately).

      Cheers!

      the_wine_snob
      the_wine_snobAuthor
      Inspiring
      January 29, 2012

      Pierre,

      Thank you. I am still trying to get my head around Community Help, and not finding THAT much. Searching the Adobe Forums, and Adobe.com, I mainly get links to Adobe Air.

      Luckily, Jerry.K (MOD in the PrPro forums), and John C (Adobe-Admin), have been responding within some of those PrPRo/Community Help threads, so I'm also picking up some info there.

      Seems to be a WIP (Work In Progress) at this point, and needs a bit more work. It appears that there is a problem with getting the original question to show up, and even one of the original posters commented that his question had been eliminated.

      Not sure how the Community Help will be implemented, and how it will either interface with, or replace the Adobe Forums, but am sure that we will all hear more, as time goes by. Right now, it seems to be a bit of a "pilot project," but still not sure of its intended implementation.

      Thank you,

      Hunt

      Captiv8r
      Captiv8rCorrect answer
      Legend
      January 30, 2012

      Hi Hunt

      I've been watching this thread with interest.

      Personally, I have to say that I dislike Community Help as it stands. I dislike the viewer and overall presentation. It takes far too long to load up and present anything helpful. It's not friendly. It's not nimble. It's obtrusive. But that's just me.

      I'm also a volunteer moderator for Community Help for a couple of Adobe products. One of my peeves (and I'm guessing the reason behind this change) is that it becomes confusing to end users where they should go to ask for help with whatever they are using. In my mind, the ability to offer comments on the help is intended to allow expounding on something that may not have been explained well. Or to suggest that something that is missing be added to the help.

      Unfortunately I've noticed that many users discover this commenting ability and they choose to use it to ask for help when they really should be asking in the user forums. And it's frustrating when I see other moderators engage them and offer help there instead of properly directing them to the forums for proper discussion.

      Cheers... Rick

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