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when will after effects use Metal.

Forum|Forum|10 years ago
October 3, 2015
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When will ae use Metal?

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Correct answer Todd_Kopriva

Someone's getting fired

‌Let me try to clarify:

What David showed on the Apple stage was a demonstration of the potential that Metal has for After Effects, as well as for other Adobe creative applications. In his role leading our R&D group, he has committed us to pursuing performance in general as well as specifically with Metal on the Mac platform. But that is not a statement about specific timing of when these features will be publicly available, nor is it a promise about exactly what parts of the application will be taking advantage of this technology when that time comes.

My statements here have been meant to prevent the misunderstanding that there is a specific short-term commitment to release features of this nature in any specific version of After Effects.

I apologize for the confusion.

Storify Go

Participant

‌Let me try to clarify:What David showed on the Apple stage was a demonstration of the potential that Metal has for After Effects, as well as for other Adobe creative applications. In his role leading our R&D group, he has committed us to pursuing performance in general as well as specifically with Metal on the Mac platform.

https://storifygo.com/

Climberfx

Known Participant

But I saw, and after they retract, trying to circumvent what was said. But anyway. Passed waters.

And was not language differences, beside my poor english typing.

"Adobe is committed to bringing Metal to all of its Mac OS Creative Cloud applications, such as Illustrator and After Effects I showed you today, as well as Photoshop and Premiere Pro. We are very excited to see what Metal can do for our Creative Cloud users."

Szalam

Community Expert

But they are working on Metal (and other ways to leverage the GPU) with AE. At least, that's what it sounded like when I talked with them at NAB last week.

And, as I understood it, Todd was saying that just because they've brought Metal to AE in internal testing for certain things doesn't mean it'll work for sure overall throughout the app, but they are looking into it along with other options. I understood what he said to be clarifying that a commitment to try it out (which they have done and are doing) is not a commitment to bring it into the shipping production version - especially not in the very near future.

As you may recall, AE is in the middle of a complete architecture change as it is, so I think Todd was just trying to keep people from thinking that the very next version of AE was definitely going to be accelerated with the Metal API (which a lot of people seemed to think).

If you've seen the sneak peek videos or the NAB videos, they are bringing some GPU acceleration into the next version of AE for some things, so they are doing what they said they would do.

Climberfx

Known Participant

I'm seeing all of then. Love the last one with Character animation demonstration Preview 4. And would love to join the pre release team.

I have a project at the present moment that would be delighted to insert Character animations on it. Studying the execution in the moment. For sure will be animated in After Effects, but maybe using Preview 4 if i can't get a pre release try out.

In the moment, i'm studying some tutors of Character...

Don't bother man, i know they are doing good stuff.

Climberfx

Known Participant

After Effects for me just. Illustrator already did the faster zoom, so, i'm happy.

But i don't like lies to sell stuff, and then, when you buy it, the excuses appears...

That make me mad.

Szalam

Community Expert

Climberfx wrote:
But i don't like lies to sell stuff, and then, when you buy it, the excuses appears...
That make me mad.

I can understand lies making you mad. However, I don't recall Adobe saying anything that was a lie or even misleading regarding AE and Metal. I know some people misunderstood some things they said - probably due to a language difference, but I always heard a pretty consistent message from Adobe about this.

Climberfx

Known Participant

So Todd_Kopriva,

I can say, if Adobe put your face on a public demonstration saying what you said to us here, you for sure would not have a job anymore. And Adobe would not exist too. Because we are who bring money to you man.

For me, a public statement is the true, and better you port all the programs to Metal as soon as possible man.

Stop your excuses, and do what your company told you do it.

Szalam

Community Expert

Climberfx wrote:
So Todd_Kopriva,
I can say, if Adobe put your face on a public demonstration saying what you said to us here, you for sure would not have a job anymore. And Adobe would not exist too.

Todd doesn't work for Adobe anymore.

Climberfx wrote:
So Todd_Kopriva,
For me, a public statement is the true, and better you port all the programs to Metal as soon as possible man.
Stop your excuses, and do what your company told you do it.

If you take a look at the sneak peak videos that Adobe put out for what is coming in the future version, you will see that they are beginning to bring GPU acceleration to After Effects in some useful ways. However, they never promised to "port all the programs to Metal" so demanding they do so isn't going to be fruitful.

dissidently

Inspiring

In direct answer to the OP's question...

As soon as they get a rapidly responsive UI, multi-core rendering, audio stability and guide snapping sorted.

Sometime in 2020, perhaps.

One thing at a time.

The rest of 2015 will be wasted determining who is responsible for communicating with the users, and how.

This will roll through most of 2016, too. With some sackings determining the results.

Todd, ever heard the the expression "Jump, jump before you are pushed"?

If not, now's the time to grasp its meaning.

M

Matthieu-on

Participant

I am waiting for it - me and my nMP dual GPU - watiing, waiting..

Any GPU support would do it.. just do it please.

ultrastatic

Participating Frequently

There are a few things not quite right here:

- To get the 15 minutes of fame in the Apple spotlight, Adobe is "promising" stuff that we might not get. Not nice.

- Adobe is incredibly unfocused. How much of the dev resources actually go the applications that people use? Looking for new customers or looking to keep the old customers in?

- Actually all I need from CC is After Effects, because both Illustrator and Photoshop have excellent and cheap alternatives for my type of use. Is it still worth the costs for me? If you look at bugginess, few new features, speed issues, it seems that Adobe is looking to cut down expenses in the dev department for After Effects to fund a myriad of random apps and desktop applications..

- Bring in more developers. Sure that's not always the best answer, but AE needs to improve on so many levels.

N

Nils_C

Participant

Well, whatever they go with it's clear AE has a very exciting future as responsiveness is the biggest handicap for working in AE right now for me.

So thanks to the engineer for exploring the options and thanks to Todd for steering the ship.

D

David McGavran

Adobe Employee

Adobe is firmly committed to performance because it accelerates creativity - Adobe is also firmly committed to the Mac platform. We share as much as we can about the directions we’re exploring and will continue to try and set realistic expectations about when specific advancements will come to market. When we demonstrated what was possible, we made a clear statement - which I repeat here: "Adobe is committed to bringing Metal to all of its Mac OS Creative Cloud applications, such as Illustrator and After Effects I showed you today, as well as Photoshop and Premiere Pro. We are very excited to see what Metal can do for our Creative Cloud users."

David McGavran

Director of Engineering

Adobe Professional Audio and Video

P

Phil Cote

Participant

David and Todd, could you speak to each other internally before saying opposite declarations? Which of you guys should we believe now?

pavelusha

Participant

Phil, I don't think the declarations are opposite. David said that "Adobe is committed to bringing Metal to all of its Mac OS Creative Cloud applications". what it means they work on it really hard. BUT, that doesn't mean that's the only way and it's a 100% done deal. They are doing research, building software, exploring different ways. "Metal" in particular is a part of that process.

pavelusha

Participant

There are several aspects of this problem.
First, I think it was a very bad choice of words at the keynote.
Second, people forget that After Effects is a small part of a very big product. Creative cloud is a very integrated system where small change in one part can snowball big problems in others. For instance you can replace footage on the Premiere timeline with AE composition and Pemiere will be rendering that part thru AE. And you have to make sure everything works properly on both ends. So does that mean Premiere has to get Metal support too? What happens if it doesn't?
Third. Just in the current version for the first time since AE was developed the core was reworked. AE now has real multi–threading where for instance Render and UI seat on different threads. So now Adobe team has to figure out how implement further multi–threading for the rendering. That means more problems to figure out what to do with multi processor rendering, GPU acceleration and such.
Forth. Somebody posted before asking not to choose proprietary technology because Mac users have problems with NVIDIA cards. Well, Metal is proprietary Apple's technology, so then the whole PC market would have problems. And that market segment is a way bigger!
And you can continue this list with more and more problems....

But the bottom line is that Adobe has a very hard problem to solve and I hope they will take their time to do it right!

adamneer

Participating Frequently

"There are several aspects of this problem.

First, I think it was a very bad choice of words at the keynote.
Second, people forget that After Effects is a small part of a very big product. Creative cloud is a very integrated system where small change in one part can snowball big problems in others. For instance you can replace footage on the Premiere timeline with AE composition and Pemiere will be rendering that part thru AE. And you have to make sure everything works properly on both ends. So does that mean Premiere has to get Metal support too? What happens if it doesn't?
Third. Just in the current version for the first time since AE was developed the core was reworked. AE now has real multi–threading where for instance Render and UI seat on different threads. So now Adobe team has to figure out how implement further multi–threading for the rendering. That means more problems to figure out what to do with multi processor rendering, GPU acceleration and such.
Forth. Somebody posted before asking not to choose proprietary technology because Mac users have problems with NVIDIA cards. Well, Metal is proprietary Apple's technology, so then the whole PC market would have problems. And that market segment is a way bigger!
And you can continue this list with more and more problems....

But the bottom line is that Adobe has a very hard problem to solve and I hope they will take their time to do it right!"

Well said, and I agree that Metal being a Mac only technology is limiting. BUT, I don't see a reason other than corporate interest for Adobe to ONLY develop for a magical GPU tech that is shared among both platforms. Surely they aren't simply porting the Mac version over from a master copy of the Windows version, so there has to be some platform specific development already in place. If Metal is the GPU tech that allows the highest number of current Mac systems to benefit, and DirectX, or whatever Windows is currently going with provides the most benefit for PCs, I see no reason why Adobe can't devote effort into developing for both. What I don't want to see is Adobe develop another GPU acceleration that requires me to not only have a high performance card, but one made by a specific GPU manufacturer, made within a certain timespan. And I don't want to see any new features withheld from any one platform or the other, simply because they only see it cost effective to develop for one technology at a time.

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