AIR33 Where is it?

[Leo Kanel]

Is it me or AIR33 Beta is delayed? We are a few days before April and there is no beta version yet. It looks like the 1st quarter release is missed.

[hferreira80]

No surprises for me.

I'm only one and made that decision my self, a few weeks ago.

I have one app that I will refactor the layout completely (not because of this issue).

To do so, between do with AIR or change runtime, I decided to move out from AIR and I hope to start soon.

With this move, AIR Mobile will be ended for me.

However I will keep AIR on Desktop.

I'm not stressed with time because even after August, 32 bits apps will be available (without updates) and Android Q will be very new on a so fragmented operation system.

I decided to change not only focused on this issue but on the overall.

[ASWC]

Good for your company, we did this 2 years ago. AIR is not something any company should rely on, at this point AIR is the only domain of indy developers up until Adobe pulls the plug. There are still people who think Adobe does NOT want people to leave the platform, there are mistaken, Adobe is working actively at making the last few remaining users to leave so they can safely put AIR away for good.

[ZachBJ]

So far I knew Adobe's style: they work silently and give us surprise.
I still remember when Adobe fulfilled requirements for Apple x64 iOS Apps.
CMIIW even at that time Unity didn't make it yet.

[marcanw]

Yep working on Adobe Air requires a lot of nerves but always an happy ending so far.

[zasflower2014]

AIR fixes bugs in versions is OK, How many people use Android Q? And not compatible with the previous Android version of the program.

This is Google's own problem, not Adobe.

Win10 can run Win7 programs. Ios 12 can run iOS 10 app.

Because of what you want to do, global developers will write programs for it again. Who does Google think he is?
If Google writes all the programs on its own operating system, then when I say nothing.
An operating system, if no one writes a program for you, it is nothing.
System upgrades a version, the program has to be re-written once, you play developers?
If the operating system can't even be stable, what are you doing?

[ZachBJ]

Correct.
While MS and Apple still have problems too, Google ways of developing things is way terrible than MS and Apple.

For instance, and we all know about is Chrome. This is the new IE of this century. Even in Chrome we can NOT disable video autoplay , not if we are not using extension.

To develop native Android Apps , we needs LOT OF resources during development. No, you can't use only 1Gb of RAM for using Android Studio + Gradle + Android SDK. You will have a lot more of it....for just creating "Hello Android".
4Gb is bare minimum so everything can runs bit smoothy.

Using Adobe AIR+Flex/Feathers, I don't need those beefy 4Gb to just develop simple "Hello Android" or even much complex one.

PC with 2Gb of RAM, Windows 10 still able to runs on and still able to do various tasks

In Android? We'll have struggle to install say Android O on device only 1Gb of RAM.... Even if you have 2Gb of RAM and then play those big mobile games...? You know what happened then.

while all know Windows is a desktop OS while Android is mobile OS.

I don't know how can mobile OS is hungrier than desktop OS in terms of memory?

Google is the master of resource HOG on almost all products they develop: Chrome, Android, YouTube, Gmail.. but the sad truth is we are using it all

I wonder if someday Google has serious competitor , may be things would change. [But who are Google serious competitor??]

I feel sorry for people that keep blaming Adobe on everything. Thats unwise.

[Leo Kanel]

The issue with Android Q is that Adobe keeps using the Context.MODE_WORLD_READABLE on Android. This was deprecated in API 17 (Android 4.2) and deprecation means that at some point they will remove it. Google removed it on Android Q and thus all apps crash.

This is not something Google will fix on later versions of Android Q or higher. This is something that Adobe needs to fix as we are aware that this changed for about 6 years now. You can learn more about this
here.

Scanning any of your apps with an Android vulnerability analysis system tool will report:

"

[Critical] App Sandbox Permission Checking:

           Security issues "MODE_WORLD_READABLE" or "MODE_WORLD_WRITEABLE" found "

This is also an easy fix, which makes things even worst. All they have to do is change MODE_WORLD_READABLE to MODE_PRIVATE. We did this years ago in all of our native apps.

[William Spence]

I don't have an opinion on this one way or the other.  But my guess is that trying to hit this deadline Google has placed in August is a big ask for the Adobe team, and they have to focus all their resources on getting the 64-bit version ready for google.  I would bet that Android Q is the sole reason you guys did not get the update that you were expecting.

[hferreira80]

This requirement is not for now so this is no excuse.

[zwetan_uk]

...

This is also an easy fix, which makes things even worst. All they have to do is change MODE_WORLD_READABLE to MODE_PRIVATE. We did this years ago in all of our native apps.

bullshit

you don't know if it is easy or not

you don't have access to the sources
you never compiled those sources
you never tested them
etc.

also who the f*ck do you think you are to tell another dev team how/when/what they should develop their own project?

also you mentioned

Unfortunately due to the stupidity / handling of the issue, my company decided to leave AIR and all new project will be made in Flutter an electron. Only legacy apps will remain in AIR, until they are completely retired.

should you not be on some Flutter or Electron forum instead ?

[Leo Kanel]

Well you know, on the opposite of what you do, I actually help devs both here and in the starling forum. Also contribute with as3 libs abd stack overflow. Also, once again on the exact opposite of you, I do have successfull apps for android and ios. I was forced to leave the tech as a professional.

Concerning your ignorant comments about not knowing the sdk, the issue is on the damn sharedprefs of air sdk. If i can fix it that easily without access to documentation and dev docs, the damn adobe team should have done it long before.

You always trying to defend them is not just pathetic but also reminds me of devs who once did an app with that sdk asdk and defend it like religion. Ignorant, low skilled, never progressing code monkeys.

Now either contribute something meaningful or leave.

[Leo Kanel]

Zwetan calling anyone a troll. This is so funny. Dude you make me laugh. I love how you always try to attack people when you have no arguments.

Back to the topic as you asked, let me enlighten you. The issue comes from com.adobe.air.AIRSharedPref.getConfigData(). This is using MODE_WORLD_READABLE which was removed in Android Q. This doesn't only cause apps to crash, but also makes the apps 100% insecure when they actually work.

Here is some more info so you can educate yourself.

[Guest]

Hey Leo,

It's such a waste of time trying to argue with people like zwetan_uk . Unfortunately, more and more you come across people like that when discussing in AIR forums. They are just there to annoy people like yourself whose interested in contributing and wanting to see AIR maintaining some relevance. Not much left of the developer community that existed when AIR was a more relevant technology. Anyways, all the best in your future projects

[OMA2k]

zasflower2014  escribió

How many people use Android Q? And not compatible with the previous Android version of the program.

This is Google's own problem, not Adobe.

No, this is not Google's problem at this point. As it has already pointed out, the reason all AIR apps crash on Android Q is because the AIR SDK is using a deprecated attribute, which wasn't recently deprecated, no...

It was deprecated 7 YEARS AGO!!

So the Adobe AIR team has had 7 long years to fix this issue, yet they chose not to, so we can't now blame Google for removing from their OS an attribute which was deprecated such a really long time ago!

Also, the question "how many people use Android Q?" makes no sense. Of course now it's not widely used, because it's in beta state, but it will begin to be more widely adopted after this summer, when the final version comes out and all stock Android devices will update, then shortly after other custom Android installations from a multitude of brand manufacturers will upgrade as well, not no mention all the new devices which will be sold with Android Q preinstalled.

People with either an upgraded device or a new device will not be able to run any AIR app at all, unless the AIR team releases a new version which solves this deprecated attribute issue, along with a new x64 compiler for AIR so we can upload our updated apps to the Play Store (because Google will ban any app update which is not 64-bit ready starting this August).

So this is a serious situation. We are in May already, with only 3 months to go, and nobody from the Adobe AIR team can be bothered to even drop a tiny one liner message saying they're working on these issues! This is completely unprofessional of a big company such as Adobe and a big disrespect for all the developers still working with this declining technology. It's no wonder most developers are running away from AIR.

[ASWC]

Totally correct, while other cross platform technologies handle those situations fast and well, AIR can only count on aficionados on the forums to make excuses for them as to why they can't react. At this point and for a few years now it is clear that Adobe AIR is mainly generating reasons for people to leave the platform instead of generating reasons as to why they should stay. Apparently some people still cannot read the signs ....

For me AIR is just going through what Flash went through, a clear lack of will/vision for future by its owner (Adobe) which as a result make people leave the platform, then once the number of developer using it is low enough they'll just announce the end of support and that will be it. How hard can it really be to realize AIR as no other future?

[PippoApps]

Well, AIR is still today the most convenient platform to deliver cross-platform applications.

I still use it since it allows me to deliver projects in half the time.

When and if it will be dismissed, I'll move to another platform.

So far, respect to the AIR team.

[ASWC]

No, AIR is the most convenient platform for INDY developers, not businesses. Any SERIOUS business can't use AIR anymore, done. Look for nationwide AIR job on indeed, none, zip, done.

[PippoApps]

It depends what kind of business my friend. I do respect your experience and knowledge enormously, please do credit also other poeple experiences. It is true that there are no jobs available under the spotlight, since high numbers demands are elsewhere.

With AIR, businesses which have vision, hire and pay good money for developers willing to offer high quality cutting down budgets and time to market. Please consider that in the IT "serious busines" universe how you call it, there are infinite declinations and facets. It is not  as mainstream as it was, this is a fact, but there are still a lot of businesses out there that benefit enormously from AIR.

So, until they kill the technology completely, I do enjoy time off the screen delivering products at double speed.

I wish you the best of luck.

[ASWC]

People did bring up the "double speed" idea before .... It's a delusion, you work fast with AIR cos you know it well but that's the end of it. If you want to delude yourself into thinking anyone, ANYONE, would develop with AIR twice as fast than any other technology then that's all it is, a delusion. Note that some developer like you working with different technologies say the exact same thing for THEIR technology: "double speed". Other developer like me who know better roll their eyes and smile.

[PippoApps]

Might be true for "people". I do develop since the 80s and you can imagine the amount of platforms I use and used. Simply, in many cases, AIR gives a productivity boost compared to other tehnologies. In many cases, not all, with some developers, not all. This is true for AIR as for everything. Still, cross-platform between desktop and devices is not feasable without AIR. My clients do need that a lot.

I am not denying what you say, just sharing my experience.

I am an optimist, and I do like to believe that this delay is due to the implementation of 64bit android.

I am glad you "know better" and roll your eyes wish you all the best.

Peace & love.

[Frédéric C.]

Well, I suppose the "double speed" thing can be pretty subjective, and it also depends a lot on the type of app you do. In my case, I use AIR for its powerful 2D graphical approach (so my apps are fully bitmap oriented, and I don't use native UI). Right now, I'm learning Unity (you know... the "backup plan"...). And I must say that all I saw until now makes me think I'll lose comfort and efficiency if I have to switch to Unity one day: compared to AIR, many things seem slow, inconvenient and bulky. To name a few: the time it requires to build an iOS project, the final size of the generated binaries, the nightmare it is to upgrade from one version of Unity to the other, the overall resources hog...

Yes, for me, AIR provides a light and powerful technology, that allows very fast iterations between code and testing on actual devices. Compilations are amazingly fast. Backward compatibility between SDK versions is excellent. Output on different platforms is very consistent. And output binaries size is very reasonable compared to the richness of AIR features. If one day I have to switch to another tech, I'll be very sad...

[ASWC]

It makes sense and you probably could be called a AIR "expert", how many years have you worked with it? Now imagine you've been working with Unity for 5/10 years and you are an "expert" at it. What would be the chances you will still think Unity is slow compared to AIR?

Personally I have 20 years of Flash experience, working with Apollo was painful (it would become AIR later), switching to AS3 was annoying after years of AS2 but at the end you just transition and can't go back.

5 years ago I had to get into nodejs, typescript and webgl and that was just awful coming from years of AS3. Today I can do this in my sleep, wanna Ios? android? Boom here it is, wanna desktop, done, etc ...

Everything is easy and fast when you are expert at it and everything seems stupid and slow when you are not.

As you seem to plan a switch to Unity, how many expert Unity developers do you think feel Unity is not comfortable and efficient? Do you really think you will still feel that way after 5 years of Unity dev?

[Frédéric C.]

ASWC​: Well, I see your point of course: the more you're experienced with a tech, the more you are efficient with it. So I agree with you on that. And that's why I tried to list points that were somewhat measurable, and didn't really depend on the developer's expertise.

Whatever my experience with Unity, it is a fact that:

- The Unity editor and compiler require more resources than AIR.

- It takes minutes to generate an Xcode project, even if it is an empty scene with a cube in the center.

- iOS app creation requires a Mac to compile the generated Xcode project. I'm a windows user, so this will considerably slow down my compilation pipeline. I found an Asset that might save the day though (iOS Project Builder for Windows - Asset Store ), but it's a single man project, and God knows how long it will be maintained.

- I asked experts in the Unity forums, and it is commonly accepted that once you start a project with a Unity version, it is better to stick with it till the end of the project, as many things break from one version to the other (Unity team even recently created a tool called UnityHub, to allow developers to keep many Unity versions installed on your machine at the same time).

- Even with a single cube in the middle of an empty scene, the generated IPA file is bigger than my most complex AIR app, embedded assets included!

I don't think that the points listed above would improve a lot, even if I was a Unity "expert". It would just be easier to accept them. All those points are solved by AIR because of its performance and the way it is designed. I'm not trying to create any kind of Unity vs AIR war. I'm just trying to say that, even if expertise helps a lot, of course, AIR offers some features that may make things quicker, just because it IS fast, versatile and lightweight.

And as a side note, unless Unity change their business model, which is unlikely, it is obviously more expensive than AIR if you want to use it professionally. That's why, even if I'm now dedicated to becoming an experienced Unity developer, I'm pretty sure I'll regret AIR if I have to switch (except if I want to make only games, where I suppose Unity flaws will be outweighed by its powerful game-centric features).

[ASWC]

One thing for sure we'll all regret AIR.

[hferreira80]

Peace and Love.

Nice