Want to use batch-process to export, WITHOUT applying processing to originating files.

[PaulVin]

I'm using batch process to export from my wav originals, into mp3 files, with a favorite applied. I do NOT want to change anything in the multitrack I'm exporting FROM. I want to keep my multitrack file as-is... but in addition to creating mp3s with effects applied, Audition is replacing the wavs on my tracks with the newly created mp3s. Is there a way around this behavior?

[SteveG_AudioMasters_]

How exactly are you doing this? Audition cannot have undecoded MP3 files in a session - they have to be decoded to wav files before you can do anything with them in Audition at all, so I'm not quite sure what you mean here.

Most of the issues people run into result from not looking carefully at the Export options (it's worth looking at the 'change' options, even if you don't change any of them), or from not specifying exactly what should happen to files in Batch Processing. Can you do screengrabs of the relevant settings?

[PaulVin]

Hi Steve, and thanks for your reply. I'll try to describe the situation more clearly, to make sure we're on the same page.

I'm starting with a multitrack file, with around 20 tracks (it's an audiobook - 1 track per chapter). Each track has one edited, but not mastered, wav file. Mastering occurs when I apply my Favorite to the file.

For final project submission, I need mastered mp3 files. My intent is to output the mp3s to a folder, and keep the mulitrack for backup, with the edited, unmastered wavs, just as they were before Exporting the mp3s.

What I tried to do was bring all wav files into the Batch Process window, assign my mastering Favorite, set the correct Export Settings, and Run the process. This produced mp3s in my desired folder, with mastering applied - which is what I wanted. However, it also replaced the wavs in the multitrack session with the newly created mp3s - not what I wanted.

My question is, is there a way to to export those mastered mp3s, in a batch, without changing the originating multitrack?

Does that make sense, or would screenshots still be useful?

[SteveG_AudioMasters_]

I think I can see what your problem here is, but I need a little clarification. These files you are saying are edited masters in the session - are the edits in the session itself, on those files? Have they been mixed down to a final file, or are they still effectively a set of clips on each track?

[PaulVin]

Hi Steve, yes, the "edited masters" are a set of clips - one unbroken mono clip on each track.

I hope this doesn't create more questions than it answers, but in case it may be helpful, my full process is:

- create a multitrack, record a few seconds of room tone on track 1, open that recording in waveform, record the chapter in punch & roll, return to multitrack, expand the clip to show all the audio, save, repeat until the project is fully recorded, one chapter per track.

- On my desktop, duplicate the multitrack folder, keep the original as a backup raw version, rename and open the copy, open a clip in waveform, assign my mastering preset in the effects rack (for monitoring only - doesn't get Applied), edit (pacing, clicks & pops, breaths, pickups, etc), save, return to multitrack, save, repeat for each clip.

- at this point, each chapter is ready for export to mp3 (this is the stage of the process my original question refers to). After export, I open the mp3s and do a QA.

This process isn't set in stone, it just is what I developed that feels organized and efficient. Apologies for being green, but I'm not sure if "mixed down to a final file" means something like the mp3 export I'm doing, something that creates an additional mulitrack file, or something else... so I'm not sure how to respond to that question. Would love your thoughts & observations. Thank you!

[SteveG_AudioMasters_]

So let me get this straight - you've done the actual editing of the file in Waveform view, so the 'clip' isn't what we'd normally refer to as a clip - it's a whole file (a clip is normally regarded as an excerpt from a file, not the whole thing.). I'm presuming that you are applying your mastering effect as a part of the batch processing - you haven't mentioned where otherwise this is occurring.

If this is correct, then I don't understand why you are putting the files back into Multitrack - or in fact, why they started there in the first place, if you are going to record the content in Waveform view. Putting them back is simply going to cause some confusion, as it clearly has. The thing about files in Multitrack is that what you see on the screen isn't the file at all - it's just an expression of the parts of it that you are going to use - the information that's stored in the Session file. All Multitrack does is to act as a rather posh file player - so if you edit a clip, then it plays only what's left, not what you cut out - but it doesn't touch the original file at all - this is what non-linear editing is all about. The other thing about this is that this only works with wav files; if you try to put an MP3 file into Multitrack, it will convert it to wav and place the copy in, not the original.

Okay, one possible scenario: If you have a wav file in multitrack and try to export it from there, and in the batch settings, you forget to tell the system not to ditch the original files, then in order to keep your session intact it has to decode all these MP3s to put them back into the session. On the face of it, they are likely to say MP3 on the end of the recreated copy (even though they aren't).

Your problems all seem to stem from using Multitrack view 'inappropriately', for want of a better expression. If you have wav files that are essentially complete, apart from your mastering effect, all you have to do is place the files directly into the batch processor from where they are stored, and check all the settings carefully, especially those in the Export Settings box:

It's those ones at the bottom that you have to be careful with. In your situation up to now, it may well be that removing the files is causing all the strange behaviour. But if the files aren't in Multitrack view to start with, then the batch processing won't affect your session at all.

So what I don't get - as I mentioned earlier - is why you are using Multitrack at all? Strikes me that everything you are doing could happen in Waveform view anyway - couldn't it?

[PaulVin]

Well, yes, you're right about my (mis)use of multitrack. For my purposes, I only need waveform... I just started off using multitrack as a kind of graphical file organizer, liked it, and stuck with it... off-label, for sure. I may revisit that process.

As for Batch-Process Exporting, I still find the way it works to be wonky. I ran tests, copying your export settings exactly, and using some other settings. After Export, in Waveform, the wav file closes, and the newly-exported MP3 opens. This could make sense, because after exporting, you'd want to inspect the new file... but still, why should conducting an export close the originating file? That's not the behavior when doing a simple File/Export command. In Multitrack, again, the wav closes and the MP3 opens, AND the MP3 replaces the wav as the file referenced in the track... this may work for some situations I'm not familiar with, but it's certainly undesireable for my off-label use case... 

Image1, before export

Image2, after export

[SteveG_AudioMasters_]

You have to bear in mind that strictly, what you are doing shouldn't be possible, as the batch processor is intended to process files, not clips directly from Multitrack view - which, as I've explained, aren't files at all. You are almost certainly in uncharted territory...

[PaulVin]

Is it correct that standard use of Batch Process involves grabbing files from the Files panel, dragging them to the Batch Process Panel, then running the Process / Export? This is how I learned to do it.

I understand the difference between the acutal audio file, and the graphical referant of that file that lives in the Multitrack view. Since I'm dragging from the File panel to the Batch Process panel, I don't understand why Mulitrack referents would change. Again, after export, the file referred to in Multitrack switches from the recorded wav, to the exported MP3 ... this does not happen if the mulitrack file is closed before export - but I don't see how it should ever happen, nor can I see how my use of Multitrack could be an issue. Are there users for whom this change of file reference is desired behavior?

[SteveG_AudioMasters_]

I think that you may be experiencing what appears to be an anomaly in Audition's behaviour regarding what you think you can see, and what's actually there. If you open a file in Waveform view and do a 'save as' to an MP3, it then tells you that what you can see on the screen is an MP3 - but it isn't, as you can generally tell a) from the spectral view, and b) the fact that we know it can't be, because Audition cannot open MP3 files and display them without decoding them. And yes, that is an anomaly that really isn't very helpful. I'd go as far as to call it a bug, and indeed I did years ago. Nobody took any notice. But it's very easy to check - just record a file with content above 16kHz and do a 'save as'. Look at what's then labeled as an MP3 with its contents above 16k, and then try opening the MP3 you saved. In spectral view it should be obvious what the difference is, and that your previous screen, labeled MP3, was in fact a wav file.

In your case, it appears to be relabeling the files in Multitrack incorrectly in a similar manner. I don't see how this could ever possibly be desired behaviour!

[PaulVin]

This is indeed a bug, IMHO. I tested again:

Process:

1) Record & save a wav in multitrack.

2) Pull the wav from the Files panel to the Batch Process panel. Apply a Favorite, add a prefex and postfix, and select mp3 as export format.

3) Run the Batch Process

Result:

1) Waveform track shows original wav filename

2) In Files panel, original wav replaced by exported mp3, with prefix and postfix, and .mp3 extension.

3) Double-clicking either of those referents (the "wav" in the track, or the mp3 in the Files panel) opens the mp3. I suggest that this really is the mp3, because:

  a) It has the .mp3 file extension

  b) It has the prefix and postfix created during export

  c) opening the mp3 direct from the Finder opens the same file

  d) dragging the original wav from Finder back into the Multitrack timeline, causes the wav to reappear in the Files tab, and double-clicking the wav causeses the wav (with correct wav filename) to open in Waveform view.

I compared the spectral view of the mp3 and the wav - I wasn't able to immediately discern the difference... but either this is a straght-up bug, a poorly-conceived "feature", or something truly weird is going on. I suspect the simplest answer: it's a bug... but I'd think lots of other users would be experiencing this too!